is it time for us to start leaning chinese, hindi and portugese?
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Original post by Classical Liberal
Assuming the English speaking countries continue to dominate software/programming and the major educational institutions then I cannot forsee any reason to start learning other languages other than because it can be really interesting and cool.
This notion that schools should devote resources to languages ahead of maths, science, English and critical thinking is barmy.
This notion that schools should devote resources to languages ahead of maths, science, English and critical thinking is barmy.
Yet at the moment schools promote subjects such as Drama, Media and Theatre studies ahead of all the subjects you listed. There does need to be a strong focus on the basic three Rs, and teaching of science and logic is also important. Yet after these core subjects, I do believe everyone should learn at least one foriegn language. Learning a language helps keep the brain active and use different areas of the brain than may be used in other subjects, improves job opportunites and looks impressive on a CV, opens the students eyes to other cultures, is academically/mentally/emotionally fulfilling and gives a new perspective on language.
I think all those reasons I have listed are quite valid and added to it being cool and interesting as you say, make a very strong case for languages to be a vital part of the curriculum.
You are right to say that English speaking institutions currently dominate education, in that the vast majority of the top 30 universities are American or British, but this could change as Eastern countries develop. The education systems of Shanghai, Singapore, Hong Kong are the top performing in the world and as Asian countries develop further world leading universities will develop a greater presence in these areas. Hong Kong and Tokyo university are 34th and 30th respectively in the world university rankings. The software and programming industries are also growing in Asian countries, indeed, the sterotypical Asian youth in the Western world is portrayed as something as a mathematical computer whiz.
I think it is very wrong to write off language learning as some esoteric intellectual pursuit.
I find the idea that 'because the world is learning English, we shouldn't need to learn foreign languages' quite laughable and hopelessly naive.
Even ignoring the various good 'soft' reasons to learn a language (some of them outlined above) the simple fact is- if you want to sell to someone, you better make sure you sell in their own language. That is why British/American companies have local offices in places such as Sweden and the Netherlands. Even though people (and especially businesspeople) in those countries speak excellent English as a rule, they want to be sold to in their own languages. Therefore foreign companies employ local salespeople who speak the language and know their market. You will not get very far trying to sell an IT solution to a Dutch/Swedish/German company or organisation if you cannot communicate to them in their own language, irrespective of how good their English might be. It's not only good manners but also good business sense.
The UK is largely a service-based economy, and as a result foreign languages will become more and more necessary here as the BRIC economies grow.
Even ignoring the various good 'soft' reasons to learn a language (some of them outlined above) the simple fact is- if you want to sell to someone, you better make sure you sell in their own language. That is why British/American companies have local offices in places such as Sweden and the Netherlands. Even though people (and especially businesspeople) in those countries speak excellent English as a rule, they want to be sold to in their own languages. Therefore foreign companies employ local salespeople who speak the language and know their market. You will not get very far trying to sell an IT solution to a Dutch/Swedish/German company or organisation if you cannot communicate to them in their own language, irrespective of how good their English might be. It's not only good manners but also good business sense.
The UK is largely a service-based economy, and as a result foreign languages will become more and more necessary here as the BRIC economies grow.
Well I've already learnt Spanish to the point of near fluency, I'm only 17. I now have opportunities to work abroad in businesses in Meixco coming my way. I am also currently using my knowledge of Spanish/Brasilian friends to learn Portuguese which will enable me to do a term of my degree in Brasil. I got an A in mandarin at GCSE and although I forgot most of it, it wows people. So everyone saying that it is not useful... that is a load of **** lool
However I don't think everyone should learn it by force, it takes away from those who choose to learn languages because they enjoy them, and it is not actually needed if you never plan on doing business/living abroad.
However I don't think everyone should learn it by force, it takes away from those who choose to learn languages because they enjoy them, and it is not actually needed if you never plan on doing business/living abroad.
^^I just realised it looks like I put spanish/brasilian friends. I meant knowledge of spanish language and having brasilian friends.
English is the internation language of the sea as far as I'm aware. As most goods are transported by sea one would assume that english will still be the main language to learn.
Also please do remember that as sad as I am to say this (in the sense that the wealth will be exploited for western gain) their is still alot of untapped wealth in Africa and I can assure you that it will be where the West will have their fingers.
Also please do remember that as sad as I am to say this (in the sense that the wealth will be exploited for western gain) their is still alot of untapped wealth in Africa and I can assure you that it will be where the West will have their fingers.
Original post by cl_steele
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/07/gdp-projections-china-us-uk-brazil
the age of western domination over international economic affairs is forcast to be at an end by 2050 with the bric countries and the 'E7' replacing the 'G7' as the predominent powers on planet earth, would it be a wise move to start learning these languages to keep with the times?
discuss
the age of western domination over international economic affairs is forcast to be at an end by 2050 with the bric countries and the 'E7' replacing the 'G7' as the predominent powers on planet earth, would it be a wise move to start learning these languages to keep with the times?
discuss
China is today what Japan was in the 1970s and 80s, everyone thought in future there would be a need to speak Japanese because it was seen as the "future" UK was in major decline as was the US.
BRICs won't grow forever , in fact China is already starting to cool and as they start finding it harder to control the population the state would slowly revert back towards tighter controls and unlike currently where exports is a major driver of their economy they would eventually try to make it a consumption based economy... as exports get less important it is more than likely they can also dictate quite a bit on their imports as well.
Would knowing Mandarin help you? The Chinese of China are a weird bunch, their rich and wealthy tend to have a major ego and you somewhat need to understand their culture more than their language to do business with them. Having said that as a Mandarin speaker, I can't deny that it has brought tremendous benefits with regards to my career advancement, many times it pretty much made the difference between a sale or no sale, China women just melt when a foreign guy molly-coddles them in Mandarin.......and considering how rich their women are it does have it's advantages to know Mandarin and have the ability to network with them, more business deals are closed with a bottle of expensive whiskey at a nightclub than at a boardroom. Which is why when you are sent to China, usually you get a target sale amount that your company will require off you and they would also give you an entertainment allowance of between 15-25% of that target.
India? English is sufficient tbh.
Brazil? It's going to take them years to do what China has achieved, in any case they will mostly be aligned to Latin America and USA rather than UK.
Russia?? I won't bother with this one.
Original post by Herr
China is today what Japan was in the 1970s and 80s, everyone thought in future there would be a need to speak Japanese because it was seen as the "future" UK was in major decline as was the US.
BRICs won't grow forever , in fact China is already starting to cool and as they start finding it harder to control the population the state would slowly revert back towards tighter controls and unlike currently where exports is a major driver of their economy they would eventually try to make it a consumption based economy... as exports get less important it is more than likely they can also dictate quite a bit on their imports as well.
Would knowing Mandarin help you? The Chinese of China are a weird bunch, their rich and wealthy tend to have a major ego and you somewhat need to understand their culture more than their language to do business with them. Having said that as a Mandarin speaker, I can't deny that it has brought tremendous benefits with regards to my career advancement, many times it pretty much made the difference between a sale or no sale, China women just melt when a foreign guy molly-coddles them in Mandarin.......and considering how rich their women are it does have it's advantages to know Mandarin and have the ability to network with them, more business deals are closed with a bottle of expensive whiskey at a nightclub than at a boardroom. Which is why when you are sent to China, usually you get a target sale amount that your company will require off you and they would also give you an entertainment allowance of between 15-25% of that target.
India? English is sufficient tbh.
Brazil? It's going to take them years to do what China has achieved, in any case they will mostly be aligned to Latin America and USA rather than UK.
Russia?? I won't bother with this one.
BRICs won't grow forever , in fact China is already starting to cool and as they start finding it harder to control the population the state would slowly revert back towards tighter controls and unlike currently where exports is a major driver of their economy they would eventually try to make it a consumption based economy... as exports get less important it is more than likely they can also dictate quite a bit on their imports as well.
Would knowing Mandarin help you? The Chinese of China are a weird bunch, their rich and wealthy tend to have a major ego and you somewhat need to understand their culture more than their language to do business with them. Having said that as a Mandarin speaker, I can't deny that it has brought tremendous benefits with regards to my career advancement, many times it pretty much made the difference between a sale or no sale, China women just melt when a foreign guy molly-coddles them in Mandarin.......and considering how rich their women are it does have it's advantages to know Mandarin and have the ability to network with them, more business deals are closed with a bottle of expensive whiskey at a nightclub than at a boardroom. Which is why when you are sent to China, usually you get a target sale amount that your company will require off you and they would also give you an entertainment allowance of between 15-25% of that target.
India? English is sufficient tbh.
Brazil? It's going to take them years to do what China has achieved, in any case they will mostly be aligned to Latin America and USA rather than UK.
Russia?? I won't bother with this one.
why not.
surely it is more valuable than hindi, what's that ? india's never gonna be more than a basket case.
ni yingkai zhidao !!! chouyangde laowai
ha ha
(edited 12 years ago)
I think its definitely important to be culturally aware of all of the BRIC's and i think also Indonesia may grow quite fast soon too. I know the times I've been in India most people can speak English especially if they are in business. In China however Mandarin is extremely useful, right now I am in Beijing interning at a language school called the culture yard and doing an intensive Chinese course which is really useful. Many young foreigners here who can speak Mandarin well are finding really interesting jobs and i think it makes you highly employable in the west in multinational companies trying to get into China
Original post by Cultureyard
I think its definitely important to be culturally aware of all of the BRIC's and i think also Indonesia may grow quite fast soon too. I know the times I've been in India most people can speak English especially if they are in business. In China however Mandarin is extremely useful, right now I am in Beijing interning at a language school called the culture yard and doing an intensive Chinese course which is really useful. Many young foreigners here who can speak Mandarin well are finding really interesting jobs and i think it makes you highly employable in the west in multinational companies trying to get into China
Sorry just nit picking here but isnt it BRICS as the S stands for south africa not just a grammar note
Original post by cl_steele
Sorry just nit picking here but isnt it BRICS as the S stands for south africa not just a grammar note
Not necessarily.
BRIC= Brazil, Russia, India, China (so we can talk about "the BRICs")
BRICS= as above + South Africa.
Most people refer to 'BRIC' as South Africa doesn't tend to be classed with the other large emerging economies.
Original post by standreams
Not necessarily.
BRIC= Brazil, Russia, India, China (so we can talk about "the BRICs")
BRICS= as above + South Africa.
Most people refer to 'BRIC' as South Africa doesn't tend to be classed with the other large emerging economies.
BRIC= Brazil, Russia, India, China (so we can talk about "the BRICs")
BRICS= as above + South Africa.
Most people refer to 'BRIC' as South Africa doesn't tend to be classed with the other large emerging economies.
Really? I was under the impression the BRIC grouping was now BRICS as SA got admitted to it back in 2010?
Original post by cl_steele
Really? I was under the impression the BRIC grouping was now BRICS as SA got admitted to it back in 2010?
No- they are two seperate terms. In the same way as you have the G8 and the G20- all the G8 members are also members of the G20 but the fact of the G20's existence hasn't cancelled out the G8.
So the BRICS (including South Africa) does exist, but that doesn't mean that the BRIC (excluding South Africa) no longer exists- they are two seperate entities. The existence of BRICS hasn't really gained a great deal of acceptance yet.
Original post by VY Rose
I think a second language should be taught as soon as a child enters school. Students from Sweden, Norway, anywhereinEurope etc, are fluent in English by the end of their main education...
We however, end up with the ability to buy bread in French... boulangerie, anyone?
French isn't really very useful; nor is it logical to learn... from a careers perspective, we'd be far better off all learning Mandarin. Or to be honest, anything - but properly. I wish I was made fluent in a second language by time I was sixteen!
We'll see, hmm?
We however, end up with the ability to buy bread in French... boulangerie, anyone?
French isn't really very useful; nor is it logical to learn... from a careers perspective, we'd be far better off all learning Mandarin. Or to be honest, anything - but properly. I wish I was made fluent in a second language by time I was sixteen!
We'll see, hmm?
On the contrary, I'd say it is. I'm interested in Politics, what with my degree being half European Studies (Politics) and half French. France is hugely important within the EU, and to be able to speak French if you want to enter professions in organisations like that can only be an advantage, I'd imagine.
Plus, any language helps you with regards to key skills such as communication, spending a year abroad so being that bit more independent: although I accept other degrees and other languages offer that, and we are talking about French specifically.
Original post by cl_steele
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/07/gdp-projections-china-us-uk-brazil
the age of western domination over international economic affairs is forcast to be at an end by 2050 with the bric countries and the 'E7' replacing the 'G7' as the predominent powers on planet earth, would it be a wise move to start learning these languages to keep with the times?
discuss
the age of western domination over international economic affairs is forcast to be at an end by 2050 with the bric countries and the 'E7' replacing the 'G7' as the predominent powers on planet earth, would it be a wise move to start learning these languages to keep with the times?
discuss
我学习中文 :P
Only just started but it will probably be useful :P Brazil and India are the other big players. Potentially russia just cause it's __ing huge so has lots of potential :P
I think by 2050 English, Mandarin, and Indian will be pretty mainstream. I think english just because we've lacked territorial dominance for over 50 years but there's still a lot of english spoken abroad.
Original post by ajtiesto
I'd really like to see the West getting taken over. They've misused their authority and power over the decades so negatively, economically within their own countries and foreign relations with the Muslim world. I think the world will be more at peace if countries like China, India and Brazil had more power because the US, UK, France and Germany haven't really got a clue what they're doing. These western countries have failed diplomatically to be bring any kind of peace in the middle east, Iraq, Iran, Palestine, Afganistan. I think these rising nations can do a far better job!
Yes China will bring peace to us all isn't that right Tank Man.
Original post by Dirac Delta Function
Why is Brazil not considered to be part of "the West"?
Because it's non-aligned.
It's good to learn new languages.I've already learnt English,Korean and Chinese.^^.
blah blah blah
"There is no likelihood man can ever tap the power of the atom." Noble prize winning physicist, 1923
"Stocks have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau." Yale Economics Professor, 1929
"This is the second time in our history that there has come back from Germany to Downing Street peace with honour. I believe it is peace for our time." Neville Chamberland PM, 1938
"In all likelihood world inflation is over." CEO of the international monetary fund, 1959
"This antitrust thing will blow over" Bill Gates
"The [Iraq] war... will last... six days, six weeks... I doubt six months" Donald Rumsfeld.
No one can predict the future, what will the world look like in 50 years? We have no idea and making economic projections for 50 years in the future is an exercise in futility.
"There is no likelihood man can ever tap the power of the atom." Noble prize winning physicist, 1923
"Stocks have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau." Yale Economics Professor, 1929
"This is the second time in our history that there has come back from Germany to Downing Street peace with honour. I believe it is peace for our time." Neville Chamberland PM, 1938
"In all likelihood world inflation is over." CEO of the international monetary fund, 1959
"This antitrust thing will blow over" Bill Gates
"The [Iraq] war... will last... six days, six weeks... I doubt six months" Donald Rumsfeld.
No one can predict the future, what will the world look like in 50 years? We have no idea and making economic projections for 50 years in the future is an exercise in futility.
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