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Who are your top 10 F1 drivers of all time?

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    1) Michael Schumacher
    2) Ayrton Senna
    3) Alain Prost
    4) Jim Clark
    5) Juan Manuel Fangio
    6) Niki Lauda
    7) Mika Hakkinen
    8) Fernando Alonso
    9) Stirling Moss
    10) Gilles Villeneuve
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Agree with Montoya, very talented.

    I only followed F1 from 1998 so my list is for the last decade..

    1) Schumacher
    2) Alonso
    3) Vettel
    4) Hakkinen
    5) Raikkennen
    6) Hamilton
    7) Button
    8) Montoya
    9) Massa
    10) Hulkenburg (purely for sticking a Williams on pole)
    10)
    Where is Damon Hill in that list? If you have followed F1 since 1998 he should be there, as anyone who can win a race in a Jordan deserves to be there!
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    (Original post by super_dooper)
    Where is Damon Hill in that list? If you have followed F1 since 1998 he should be there, as anyone who can win a race in a Jordan deserves to be there!
    Haha, Belgium 1998 was the most amazing race ever.
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    I bet the newer guys like hamilton are better than most of these oldies if they were in the same era, the sport has evolved
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    1)Ralf Schumacher (of course I mean Michael)
    2)Fangio
    3)Giles Villeneuve
    4)Jacques Villeneuve
    5)Hakkinen
    6)Vettel
    7)Aryton Senna
    8)Sato
    9)Kobayashi
    10)Alain Prost

    Some degree of personal bias may have influenced this list.
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    (Original post by super_dooper)
    Why do you say that? Nigel Mansell was an amazing driver. He was blindingly quick. He was the one man besides Prost who was able to challenge, and beat, Senna. Mansell had guts and determination galore. He was a very flamboyant driver, he was ultra consistent in that he never had bad days and he hardly ever made mistakes.

    Witness, for example, his win at Silverstone in 1987 where he had to pit due to a tyre vibration. He rejoined the track 30 seconds down on leader Nelson Piquet. He caught and passed Piquet, breaking the lap record numerous times, to take a magical win, to the delight of the British fans.

    Mansell was every bit as good as Senna and Prost. He should've been champion at least 2 or 3 times, and it was just bad luck that robbed him of more titles. In 1986, for example, he was only a few laps from winning the title when his tyre blew and lost him the championship. In 1987, his unlucky crash at Suzuka took him out of the title race. He was, in truth, a 3 times world champion who only won the title once in F1 because of a bit of bad luck.

    Races were never dull when he was in them. He could often come from behind to take the win, and he was an amazing overtaker. He was one driver who could really take the car by the scruff of its neck and drive consistently on the limit.

    The fact that he went to Indycars in 1993 and crushed the opposition in his first season there proves all you need to know. And when he came back to F1 in 1994, he won after just 4 races at the age of 41. Not even Schumacher was able to do that.

    Mansell also deserves his place so high up because he did not come from a rich background. Unlike Senna, Hamilton, etc....Mansell had NO MONEY and had to fight his way up the lower formulas and he even had to remortage his house and work lots of crappy jobs just to keep his motor racing career alive. He had so much determination, and he got into F1 based on his sheer talent alone.

    What I also like about him is that he was not a glitzy or glamorous person....he was just a down-to-earth, feet-on-the-ground, family man.

    Read his autobiography and watch some documentaries about him if you want to know more. In short, he's a very under-rated driver, definitely one of the all time best. And with 31 wins, he stands behind only Schumacher, Prost and Senna in the number of wins.
    Ive read his autobiography twice, and i know all about him struggling financially, winning races in lower formula with cars where the wheels were out of alignment, and how he worked as a manager at his dads engineering company whilst working his way up the ladder in motor racing etc. But ive also read many books on clark and fangio, ive been to the jim clark room in Duns, seen all his trophies and all of the old footage of his races in all the different categories, and fangio and clark were immeasurably superior. They won a far higher percentage of the races they took part in whereas fangio won five titles and clark won two, narrowly missing out on three more, in eras where driving and winning were much harder and much more challenging. They are superior in every way to Mansell, who was outdriven by Senna in an inferior car in 1991, and who won his only title in one of the most dominant cars in f1 history. No contest, clark and fangio are better in every way.
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    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Agree with Montoya, very talented.

    I only followed F1 from 1998 so my list is for the last decade..

    1) Schumacher
    2) Alonso
    3) Vettel
    4) Hakkinen
    5) Raikkennen
    6) Hamilton
    7) Button
    8) Montoya
    9) Massa
    10) Hulkenburg (purely for sticking a Williams on pole)
    10)
    Hulkenberg? You're kidding me right.

    :eek::rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Rich_183)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Surtees you forgot John Surtees
    He's in the top 10 motorsport drivers, but I wouldn't rank him alongside Senna, Prost and Schumacher as he wasn't *that* amazing in F1, same with Stirling Moss.

    My top 10:

    1. Ayrton Senna
    2. Michael Schumacher
    3. Alain Prost
    4. Juan Manuel Fangio
    5. Jim Clark
    6. Graham Hill
    7. Niki Lauda
    8. Jackie Stewart
    9. Emerson Fittipaldi
    10. Gilles Villeneuve/Nelson Piquet
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    1. Button
    2. Mansell
    3. Senna
    4. James Hunt
    5. Sebastian Vettle
    6. Keke Rosberg
    7. Niki Lauder
    8. Martin Brundle
    9. Rubens Barichello
    10. Graham Hill

    This are my favourites, not necessarily in order of speed though!
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    Senna has got to be top of anyone's list.

    Everyone should watch the movie 'Senna'. When a million people line the streets for your funeral you know you're something special (especially considering he gave millions to charity).


    'The figures suggest that Schumacher and Fangio were better. But the people who know, they tell a different story'

    Alonso : I think Senna, I would put him at number one.

    Massa: For me Senna is number one.

    Coulthard: For me, undoubtly, Ayrton Senna was the number one..


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    (Original post by Leavemyarcelona)
    Ive read his autobiography twice, and i know all about him struggling financially, winning races in lower formula with cars where the wheels were out of alignment, and how he worked as a manager at his dads engineering company whilst working his way up the ladder in motor racing etc. But ive also read many books on clark and fangio, ive been to the jim clark room in Duns, seen all his trophies and all of the old footage of his races in all the different categories, and fangio and clark were immeasurably superior.
    You cannot know whether they were 'immeasurably superior' unless they raced against Mansell in equal equipment and were judged that way. It's impossible to accurately judge drivers of different eras as to how they compare with each other, as they are racing totally different cars, tracks and different rules.

    (Original post by Leavemyarcelona)
    They won a far higher percentage of the races they took part in whereas fangio won five titles and clark won two, narrowly missing out on three more, in eras where driving and winning were much harder and much more challenging.
    They competed in fewer races than Mansell, so that will make their wins to starts ratio biasly higher.

    (Original post by Leavemyarcelona)
    They are superior in every way to Mansell, who was outdriven by Senna in an inferior car in 1991,
    I don't think the 1991 Williams was superior to the 1991 McLaren. The McLaren that year was pretty evenly matched with the Williams on pace. Williams were quicker on some circuits, McLaren on others. It was only in 1992 that the Williams extablished authority over McLaren.

    If you do your homework on the 1991 season, you'll see that the Williams car was very unreliable that year. Mansell had gearbox failure in the early races, an electrical failure on the last lap in Canada, as well as a pitlane incident in Portugal where his wheel came off in the pitlane. None of these things were his fault. He was totally in with a chance of the title, and could've won the title if the bad luck hadn't happened. He had the speed and the talent.

    (Original post by Leavemyarcelona)
    who won his only title in one of the most dominant cars in f1 history.
    In actual fact, Mansell should've been a 3 or 4 times F1 world champion. 1986 was his, until the bad luck with his exploding tyre. 1987 was his until the crash at Suzuka. 1991 was his, but he was robbed for the bad luck/car failures etc. 1992 was his, he dominated that season. So I'm not sure that he was 'outdriven' by Senna....and he didn't only win because he had a dominant car, despite what the press say. Mansell just had a lot of bad luck in his career. On pure talent alone, he should've won more titles, but fate sadly intervened. I also believe he would've won the 1990 title for Ferrari, had he been allowed to race Prost on equal terms (as Prost basically manipulated the team into favouring him).

    I don't care what anyone says, Mansell was just as good as anyone on pure talent and speed.
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    (Original post by super_dooper)
    If you do your homework on the 1991 season, you'll see that the Williams car was very unreliable that year. Mansell had gearbox failure in the early races, an electrical failure on the last lap in Canada...
    Electrical failure? He stalled it waving to the crowd :teehee:
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    (Original post by A Mysterious Lord)
    Electrical failure? He stalled it waving to the crowd :teehee:
    No he didn't. That's a bull**** lie that some idiotic journalists who didn't like Mansell made up in order to sell newspapers and magazines. The car had an electrical failure on the last lap. No driver of Mansell's experience would stall a car on the last lap of a grand prix.
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    (Original post by super_dooper)
    No he didn't. That's a bull**** lie that some idiotic journalists who didn't like Mansell made up in order to sell newspapers and magazines. The car had an electrical failure on the last lap. No driver of Mansell's experience would stall a car on the last lap of a grand prix.
    He apparently flicked the ignition off to the engine when waving to the crowd. Proof came from Williams themselves, but they cited 'electrical failure'.

    Btw, are you an esteemed member of the kiss Nigel Mansell's arse club?
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    (Original post by super_dooper)
    No he didn't. That's a bull**** lie that some idiotic journalists who didn't like Mansell made up in order to sell newspapers and magazines. The car had an electrical failure on the last lap. No driver of Mansell's experience would stall a car on the last lap of a grand prix.
    It's what the majority of F1 books and websites have said for years. Martin Brundle even suggested he knocked the engine cut out switch with his hand while waving. He's never denied it either, he's called the reporters 'pathetic' and 'idiotic' but never actually said that wasn't the case; a non-denial denial so to speak.
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    (Original post by The_master616)
    He apparently flicked the ignition off to the engine when waving to the crowd. Proof came from Williams themselves, but they cited 'electrical failure'.
    And where is this 'proof' you speak of? What's your source? I bet your 'proof' will come from some idiotic journalist who doesn't like Mansell. Some people just can't admit that it was a car failure, and not Mansell's fault, that caused him to stop on the last lap in Canada 1991.

    (Original post by The_master616)
    Btw, are you an esteemed member of the kiss Nigel Mansell's arse club?
    I recognise and acknowledge his talent. A lot of the British F1 press don't like him, for some reason, but he was definitely one of the top 10, if not top 5, best F1 drivers of all time.
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    Deny deny deny...
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    michael /thread
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    (Original post by A Mysterious Lord)
    It's what the majority of F1 books and websites have said for years. Martin Brundle even suggested he knocked the engine cut out switch with his hand while waving. He's never denied it either, he's called the reporters 'pathetic' and 'idiotic' but never actually said that wasn't the case; a non-denial denial so to speak.
    Watch a video called 'Nigel Mansell's 1991 season'. It is basically a camera crew following Nigel during that season, and they make a documentary about how his season goes.

    On the video he's interviewed by a journalist who says 'Can you scotch the rumour that you accidently knocked something electrical out in the car on that last lap in Canada?'.

    Mansell replies, 'Yeah well, these are the people who delight in kicking a driver while they're down, and they write these malicious rumours that I accidently knocked an ignition switch in the car. The people who write these things and the people who print them, they are just too pathetic for words'.

    So obviously he did deny it. I checked out the Wikipedia page for the 1991 Canadian grand prix http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_Canadian_Grand_Prix

    In there it says 'it is commonly reported that he let his engine revs drop too low while he was waving to the crowd in celebration, thereby stalling the engine, though the official Williams line is that Mansell suffered a late gearbox failure'.

    So no, Williams never ever said that Mansell 'accidently knocked an ignition switch'. That's bull.

    Listen, some of the F1 press had it in for Mansell for some reason, mainly because they were jealous that he achieved the success he did.

    Mansell was one of the greatest F1 drivers of all time. Colin Chapman of Lotus, who gave Nigel his break in F1, is even quoted as saying that Mansell was the best new talent since Jim Clark. So there you go.
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    (Original post by super_dooper)
    Watch a video called 'Nigel Mansell's 1991 season'. It is basically a camera crew following Nigel during that season, and they make a documentary about how his season goes.

    On the video he's interviewed by a journalist who says 'Can you scotch the rumour that you accidently knocked something electrical out in the car on that last lap in Canada?'.

    Mansell replies, 'Yeah well, these are the people who delight in kicking a driver while they're down, and they write these malicious rumours that I accidently knocked an ignition switch in the car. The people who write these things and the people who print them, they are just too pathetic for words'.

    So obviously he did deny it. Listen, some of the F1 press had it in for Mansell for some reason, mainly because they were jealous that he achieved the success he did.

    Mansell was one of the greatest F1 drivers of all time. Colin Chapman of Lotus, who gave Nigel his break in F1, is even quoted as saying that Mansell was the best new talent since Jim Clark. So there you go.

    I'd rather believe what neutral respected journalists had to say and from the Williams mechanics than what a biased tv programme created for the knuckle dragging worshippers do.

    I also admire Mansell's time in F1, but I disagree that he was the greatest ever. He wasn't a complete driver and it is partly because of this that he isn't a multiple WDC.

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