[Noldorin]

As a Brit, I've sent my application to a number of US universities, including a few Ivy Leagues. I applied for computer science at all of them. The deadlines were mainly 15th December.

Haven't heard from any yet. Has anyone else applied to US universities, especially for computer science? If so have you heard anything back yet? I'm not sure it's a good or bad thing I'm still waiting this long.

[Just Like You]

As an American trying to get into a UK school for my Masters, I'll just go ahead and tell you that I am AMAZED at how quickly the whole process is going for me. And that REAL PEOPLE are actually e-mailing me back and getting my application sorted out. What a concept.

It's not uncommon to be held waiting a half a year when applying to grad schools in the US. Mostly because if you apply early, they don't send out approval/rejection letters early, they hold everybody together so all decisions get sent out at the same time. There are a few schools that will send out letters as applications come in, but that's not been the standard in my experience.

If you feel like you've been waiting too long, you can try giving them a call or an email, although I'll also warn you that most schools here are also notoriously bad at communication in general. The common theme that seems to run through most of the popular graduate schools is that you have to chase them for information, not the other way around.

[kka25]

(Original post by Just Like You)
It's not uncommon to be held waiting a half a year when applying to grad schools in the US. Mostly because if you apply early, they don't send out approval/rejection letters early, they hold everybody together so all decisions get sent out at the same time. There are a few schools that will send out letters as applications come in, but that's not been the standard in my experience.

If you feel like you've been waiting too long, you can try giving them a call or an email, although I'll also warn you that most schools here are also notoriously bad at communication in general. The common theme that seems to run through most of the popular graduate schools is that you have to chase them for information, not the other way around.

These are not great things to hear really =/

[NeoXerxes]

I'm another US student that will be attending grad school in the UK.

My advice: Unless it's Harvard (and only Harvard), it's not worth it, especially with the rates that you Brits pay.

[kka25]

(Original post by NeoXerxes)
I'm another US student that will be attending grad school in the UK.

My advice: Unless it's Harvard (and only Harvard), it's not worth it, especially with the rates that you Brits pay.

Mind explaining why, please?

[Lilium]

(Original post by NeoXerxes)
I'm another US student that will be attending grad school in the UK.

My advice: Unless it's Harvard (and only Harvard), it's not worth it, especially with the rates that you Brits pay.

Have you any valid source for that? In my experience, i.e, what I have read and heard from students, when there are any tuition fees to be paid for grad school, the prices are standard.

In the sciences, and I dare say, most fields, when one is attempting graduate study, a department's research interests holds much more importance than the brand name of the school. On top of that, graduate school in the sciences is *funded* in the states. A successful applicant is awarded a tuition waiver and either a research or teaching assistantship, which is usually enough $$ to live on. Some can even earn fellowships which is just free money! One should note that the wage is minimal and as such, just enough to live on.

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~harchol/gradschooltalk.pdf

This should be of particular interest to the OP. The OP should also note that MS programs are generally not funded and as such, it might be wiser to try get into a PhD program, do the coursework and drop out after said coursework. Now, whether that's ethical or not my concern. Something else that could be of concern is whether or not the OP would be accepted in a CS PhD program.

Competition is stiff for PhD programs in the sciences. To give you an idea of what you'd be up against:
http://www.mathematicsgre.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=685

[kka25]

(Original post by Lilium)
Have you any valid source for that? In my experience, i.e, what I have read and heard from students, when there are any tuition fees to be paid for grad school, the prices are standard.

In the sciences, and I dare say, most fields, when one is attempting graduate study, a department's research interests holds much more importance than the brand name of the school. On top of that, graduate school in the sciences is *funded* in the states. A successful applicant is awarded a tuition waiver and either a research or teaching assistantship, which is usually enough $$ to live on. Some can even earn fellowships which is just free money! One should note that the wage is minimal and as such, just enough to live on.

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~harchol/gradschooltalk.pdf

If I'm not mistaken, one is bonded contractually if they enter the fellowships programme...

This should be of particular interest to the OP. The OP should also note that MS programs are generally not funded and as such, it might be wiser to try get into a PhD program, do the coursework and drop out after said coursework. Now, whether that's ethical or not my concern. Something else that could be of concern is whether or not the OP would be accepted in a CS PhD program.

If you're bonded and you end it without any reason, you would need to pay back the money.

Owh! And

[Just Like You]

I can't speak much for the costs, but last I checked for art/design related MA programs here in the US, international rates were astronomical. Something like $40,000 a semester. It's also one of the reasons why I'm coming to the UK to study. Even paying international student rates to go there, it would be approx £13,000 for tuition. If I studied here in the states, I would have to pay out-of-state fees (since there's no good design schools in Florida), and the tuition would be approx £38,000 converted. Kind of a no brainer, there.

[neuro11]

i kind of agree about the outrageous fees require to study in US as a overseas student particularly when the scholarship opportunity are quite limited them. Any good university you choose and it costs over 30K per semester. Some uni directly encourage international students to manage their own funding before applying. interestingly, UCD have even clearly mentioned they have no funding for international student(to the school i am concerned) and they also provided an example explaining last year they had no students admitted categorized as INTERNATIONAL....lolllz
Things are a little better in Phd, cz you have more chances to be funded for the researches. But still competition is extremely high for a fully funded research.

[Lilium]

(Original post by kka25)
If I'm not mistaken, one is bonded contractually if they enter the fellowships programme...

If you're bonded and you end it without any reason, you would need to pay back the money.

Owh! And

I don't know about the fine print of fellowships. :-)

In the case of being a TA/RA with a tuition waiver, it's not unheard of that students can drop out without too much trouble. I know of one such guy who did, worked at Google, then quit to focus on his start-up.

Oh hai! (will reply to your mail tonight)

[kka25]

(Original post by Lilium)
I don't know about the fine print of fellowships. :-)

In the case of being a TA/RA with a tuition waiver, it's not unheard of that students can drop out without too much trouble. I know of one such guy who did, worked at Google, then quit to focus on his start-up.

Oh hai! (will reply to your mail tonight)

I would strongly encourage you to read the fine print first and forecast realistically how it might impact you. These sort of things are tricky and often stressful and they won't release you that easily once you've signed the agreement =/

In the case of being the TA/RA, I've heard about that as well. There are options for the student to do some menial jobs (admin jobs) for some duration in exchange for fees payment and some allowances. Although the money wouldn't be much as the fellowship (the ones that I saw), those are still quite attractive =>

Sure

[sj27]

(Original post by kka25)
I would strongly encourage you to read the fine print first and forecast realistically how it might impact you. These sort of things are tricky and often stressful and they won't release you that easily once you've signed the agreement =/

In the case of being the TA/RA, I've heard about that as well. There are options for the student to do some menial jobs (admin jobs) for some duration in exchange for fees payment and some allowances. Although the money wouldn't be much as the fellowship (the ones that I saw), those are still quite attractive =>

Sure

Fine print definitely has to be read, but I was also reading just last night a website from a top uni (I read a few so can't recall which this particular one was) which talks about a relatively high drop-out rate for PhDs. They call them "ABDs" - for all but dissertation, those students who have completed all the coursework but never get round to finishing their dissertations. (Some unis will award these guys masters degrees, others don't.). They spoke about the motivation needed for dissertations, and the fact that there is no "shame" if you don't go all the way etc etc....but it didn't mention anything about financial consequences, and this from a uni which appears to fully fund almost all its PhDs.

[kka25]

(Original post by sj27)
Fine print definitely has to be read, but I was also reading just last night a website from a top uni (I read a few so can't recall which this particular one was) which talks about a relatively high drop-out rate for PhDs. They call them "ABDs" - for all but dissertation, those students who have completed all the coursework but never get round to finishing their dissertations. (Some unis will award these guys masters degrees, others don't.). They spoke about the motivation needed for dissertations, and the fact that there is no "shame" if you don't go all the way etc etc....but it didn't mention anything about financial consequences, and this from a uni which appears to fully fund almost all its PhDs.

I highly doubt websites from Universities would even mention those sort of private details especially details from a contract. Moreover, who wants to talk about those sort of things? It's highly personal to some. Additionally, the piece that you read might just highlight why PhD drop outs are so high and some of the consequences but not all of the consequences.

I would advise you to be careful with reading these sort of things. Who knows they might miss something and who knows the particular mentioned student(s) contract(s) would be a different contract? One might even ask are they even in a contract?

[Ghost6]

(Original post by NeoXerxes)
I'm another US student that will be attending grad school in the UK.

My advice: Unless it's Harvard (and only Harvard), it's not worth it, especially with the rates that you Brits pay.

You should never do an unfunded PhD, Harvard or not. For masters you are often (but not always) expected to pay though. This is why it makes so much sense to go to the UK for masters. Same language, lower fees, and often better reputation for masters as they are seen as terminal degrees and not degrees awarded to those who failed their PhD's. Then go back to the states for a fully funded PhD at a top 10 department with a major advantage in the admissions process. Of course would have to pick your UK school carefully, if it's not top 5 in your field the benefits will be unclear over applying directly from undergrad.

[sj27]

(Original post by kka25)
I highly doubt websites from Universities would even mention those sort of private details especially details from a contract. Moreover, who wants to talk about those sort of things? It's highly personal to some. Additionally, the piece that you read might just highlight why PhD drop outs are so high and some of the consequences but not all of the consequences.

I would advise you to be careful with reading these sort of things. Who knows they might miss something and who knows the particular mentioned student(s) contract(s) would be a different contract? One might even ask are they even in a contract?

Yeah well it's very strange they would discuss a detailed list of advantages and disadvantages and not mention if stipends had to be repaid, which anyone would agree is a pretty big disadvantage. You may have missed the bit of my post where I agreed one had to read the fine print, but clearly there are a number of different forms of funding and to make blanket statements (especially about a different country, this is a thread about the US) is also something to be careful of, no?

[kka25]

(Original post by sj27)
Yeah well it's very strange they would discuss a detailed list of advantages and disadvantages and not mention if stipends had to be repaid, which anyone would agree is a pretty big disadvantage. You may have missed the bit of my post where I agreed one had to read the fine print, but clearly there are a number of different forms of funding and to make blanket statements (especially about a different country, this is a thread about the US) is also something to be careful of, no?

Of course.. that's the whole point of my posts.

[Lilium]

Being a TA or RA is not an "admin" job. From what I gather, being a TA involves "teaching" (whether that is a whole set of lectures or tutoring, I do not know) and grading exam/tests. The latter involves doing the grunt work of an academic or perhaps a post doc. As Ghost6 mentioned, most students just don't attend if they aren't given tuition waivers + funding/stipend for living expenses. The amount given is usually location dependent. Columbia, which is in NYC, gives out something in the region of 2k USD for their Physics grad students. I can imagine that amount being lower in say, Louisiana.

[kka25]

(Original post by Lilium)
Being a TA or RA is not an "admin" job. From what I gather, being a TA involves "teaching" (whether that is a whole set of lectures or tutoring, I do not know) and grading exam/tests. The latter involves doing the grunt work of an academic or perhaps a post doc. As Ghost6 mentioned, most students just don't attend if they aren't given tuition waivers + funding/stipend for living expenses. The amount given is usually location dependent. Columbia, which is in NYC, gives out something in the region of 2k USD for their Physics grad students. I can imagine that amount being lower in say, Louisiana.

Of course it's not; what I mentioned was about the funding requirements that I saw. They weren't clear of what admin job is required but there's a high chance that they would throw in the RA/TA position as well. Who knows.

[Noldorin]

(Original post by Just Like You)
As an American trying to get into a UK school for my Masters, I'll just go ahead and tell you that I am AMAZED at how quickly the whole process is going for me. And that REAL PEOPLE are actually e-mailing me back and getting my application sorted out. What a concept.

It's not uncommon to be held waiting a half a year when applying to grad schools in the US. Mostly because if you apply early, they don't send out approval/rejection letters early, they hold everybody together so all decisions get sent out at the same time. There are a few schools that will send out letters as applications come in, but that's not been the standard in my experience.

If you feel like you've been waiting too long, you can try giving them a call or an email, although I'll also warn you that most schools here are also notoriously bad at communication in general. The common theme that seems to run through most of the popular graduate schools is that you have to chase them for information, not the other way around.

Thanks for the info. Evidently you're an American doing the reverse that I am, but I'm likely to have a similar waiting time...

The US unis do seem rather impersonal indeed! Everything I've received from them is quite impersonal really. And they didn't reply to *any* of the emails I sent them re: application queries. Wasn't impressed.

Guess I'll keep waiting then... if a British uni gives me an offer before I hear back from any US ones, then I'll probably just take it though.

[Noldorin]

Whoever said that it's only worth applying for Harvard, that's quite ridiculous. All the top US unis fund PhD programmes, and some give decent living stipends too! It would be ludicrous to write-off other great schools like MIT, Stanford, and Columbia. I certainly won't.

Thanks to certain guys for a few useful comments here... otherwise I feel we're getting rather off-topic here. My original question was not about funding at all.