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How can people think homosexuality is a choice?

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Original post by Miracle Day
I just had a heated argument with some guy, and my frustration is what angered me to write this. He told me, for accepting gays and being cool with them, and treating them as I would anyone else I'm not a proper Christian - infact probably not one at all - because the Bible condemns them. He says we should all use Jesus as a model human.

I tell him about Lady Gaga born this way and he was adamant people aren't born gay, but they're brought up fooled.

I then ask how homosexuality can be a choice, when homophobic areas have higher suicide rates and by his logic surely they could just change back to being straight if it was a choice. He then says he wishes more homosexuals would commit suicide, and that homosexuals don't think they can turn straight.

So I tell him, Jesus tells us to love all.. so saying that is going against Christianity etc. Then he quotes Sodomy and Gamora.

He's obviously not just a closed minded pre-teen.. he knows his stuff. I just can't comprehend how people can believe it.

If any of you believe it's a choice.. help me out and tell me why please.

Edit: I'm just so angry right now.. sorry.. someone restore my faith in humanity


Dude is a pretty bad Christian... he says Jesus should be the model human and yet he quotes the old testament?

Being attracted to the same sex is not a choice, but acting on it is more of a choice, and that is what some (but not all) Christians disagree with, as they beleive that sex is for marriage and procreation and all that.
Reply 301
Avatar for jesse111
jesse111
Original post by Miracle Day


Edit: I'm just so angry right now.. sorry.. someone restore my faith in humanity


Of course its a choice ! Think back to when you were young
and were assexual as im sure we all used to think the opposite sex
was gross and intercourse was disgusting and lalala. Once we turn a suitable age we choose to be aroused by whatever sex we choose. Im not against homosexuality but im not for it either. I couldnt give a rats behind about it
but saying its not a choice is bs
Reply 302
Avatar for DYKWIA
DYKWIA
13
Original post by Bellissima
i am still waiting to hear about these "homosexual lies" that you started talking about.


What if they start teaching about homosexuality in schools. We should respect the wishes of religious folk who don't want their children to be exposed to things like that.

Also, some gay people are very militant and I don't want them to win, because I don't want their views being taught in schools.
Original post by bad8oy
how are they getting treated differently?????????? they are being treated exactly the same as the rest of us, all the same rules in life apply to us all do they not????


i am talking about gay marriage...
Original post by DYKWIA
What if they start teaching about homosexuality in schools. We should respect the wishes of religious folk who don't want their children to be exposed to things like that.

Also, some gay people are very militant and I don't want them to win, because I don't want their views being taught in schools.


Can't the same be said for religion. I am an atheist and so if I have children, I may wish that the aren't taught about world religions. It so happens that I would because I don't want ignorant children but I'm just showing that it applies both was and so is quite hypocritical of you to even suggest it.

Original post by bad8oy
and? why should gays be allowed to get married. civil partnership should be good enough for them. think about it. if a gay couple adopted a kid i know for a fact that kid would get badly bullied. i mean it doesnt have a direct effect on people like us but think about how it effects say the kid.
and homosexuality is unnatural. people were made for the opposite sex.


You realise that children can be adopted under civil partnerships? I know many gay parents who make a great job of it and who will raise terrific children. I don't know why this should be stopped just because some people are ignorant.
Original post by DYKWIA
What if they start teaching about homosexuality in schools. We should respect the wishes of religious folk who don't want their children to be exposed to things like that.

Also, some gay people are very militant and I don't want them to win, because I don't want their views being taught in schools.


what do you mean by "teaching homosexuality"?? a lesson on how to be gay? that is the stupidest thing i've heard from you so far... why would there be lessons on homosexuality when there aren't any on heterosexuality? if you mean teaching children that there is nothing wrong with being gay... then what is wrong with that? what is the problem with teaching children not to hate people for something that has no affect on their character?

i do not respect the views of bigoted religious people, i do not respect the views of bigoted people full stop. if they want to hate people for something as pathetic as their skin colour or sexuality then that is their choice... but to not teach children that everyone should be treated the same regardless of race, sexuality etc. JUST because it goes against prejudiced views then that is completely wrong.

"expose children to homosexuality"... well guess what, it's a fact of human life, they are going to be exposed to it one way or another. there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with telling children that some men or women love eachother the way mummy and daddy love eachother and you shouldn't hate people because of that. it's not going to make them gay. when i mentioned to my 8 year old cousin that will young was gay she said "ewwwww he's so gross" which i think is just distgusting that an 8 year old has been influenced this way to have a negative opinion on someone for something like sexuality.



yes, some gay people are very militant, because it is something they feel strongly about when they are not treated equally, when gays in other countries are persecuted, when there is still A LOT of bigotry towards gays going around.
there are also very militant theists, atheists, republicans, socialists, environmentalists etc. AND very militant homophobes.
i don't know what you mean by "win" but it's not a game is it.
(edited 12 years ago)
Original post by DYKWIA
What if they start teaching about homosexuality in schools. We should respect the wishes of religious folk who don't want their children to be exposed to things like that.

Also, some gay people are very militant and I don't want them to win, because I don't want their views being taught in schools.


They teach religion in schools, i didnt need to hear about that, i have no intention on being religious but i still took part in the lessons and listened to people who's views differed from mine greatly, how is this any different to religious people listening to the views of those who are not in the same way sexually inclined....Not the best example considering numerous religious people understand that they can in fact be gay without falling into the deepest depths of hell.

There is, in higher level schools, the choice to opt out of certain lessons. If some narrow minded people think their children should grow up completely oblivious to the real world around them and the people in it then i imagine they can have their children taken out of the "lessons about how to be gay"

...I assume thats what you mean by 'teaching about homosexuality' because no sane person would think it wrong to teach children to be tolerant of their fellow humans regardless of their sexual orientation :rolleyes:

Also: What do you actually mean by "teachings of homosexuality"? Lessons on anal sex? Brainwashing students into becoming gay? i dont actually understand how homosexuality can be "taught".
Original post by Bellissima
what do you mean by "teaching homosexuality"?? a lesson on how to be gay? that is the stupidest thing i've heard from you so far... why would there be lessons on homosexuality when there aren't any on heterosexuality? if you mean teaching children that there is nothing wrong with being gay... then what is wrong with that? what is the problem with teaching children not to hate people for something that has no affect on their character?


Just posted almost exactly the same as this, whoops :redface:
Original post by DYKWIA
What if they start teaching about homosexuality in schools.


What do you mean by 'about homosexuality'? Is there really that much to teach?

We should respect the wishes of religious folk who don't want their children to be exposed to things like that.


I don't see why we should. We wouldn't 'respect the wishes' of racist parents who didn't want their children to be taught anti-racism in schools. We wouldn't 'respect the wishes' of parents who believed that people with skin diseases were inferior who didn't want their children to be taught that they deserve the same respect as anyone else. Why should we tolerate intolerant parents?

Also, some gay people are very militant and I don't want them to win, because I don't want their views being taught in schools.


This sounds like the stupidest conspiracy theory I've ever heard.
Original post by bad8oy
and? why should gays be allowed to get married. civil partnership should be good enough for them. think about it. if a gay couple adopted a kid i know for a fact that kid would get badly bullied. i mean it doesnt have a direct effect on people like us but think about how it effects say the kid.
and homosexuality is unnatural. people were made for the opposite sex.


it's not good enough because it is not the same. it is separating them from marriage.


that is not the gay couples fault nor the childs, it is homophobes in society.


if homosexuality were unnatural it wouldn't occur, but it does, therefore it is natural. if it only came about through something like genetic engineering then it would not be natural, but it is because it happens...... naturally!
Original post by Darrenh800
Yeah but it stops people from causing a fuss and helps relations between bigoted people. I believe that once civil partnerships have been in law for long enough, most people will be happy with them becoming official marriages. It's inconsequential to me what the world calls my piece of paper as long as I can have my husband and all the rights which I need to have peace of mind. Why fight for something which will cause much resentment and hatred yet actually only changes the name of the document. It's also not like the bus thing because both papers serve the exact same purpose. One doesn't have more powers than the other and you can't deny one over another thus proving, in my opinion, that it's a pointless battle to fight.


ok fair enough, i used to think that way but then i thought more about it and in my opinion they should not be separated. they should not segregate gay people from the rest of the world in any way, and this is one way of doing it. of course civil unions are MUCH better than nothing... but that doesn't justify them not being marriages.
if you don't fight for anything then nothing will happen. history can show us that.
the bus serves the same purpose and sitting on the seat in the back isn't any different to sitting in the seat in the front, but it is the message it sends out, the reminder that no, you are not as good as us.
Original post by bad8oy
im not being ignorant, i being truthfull i know for a fact that in school a boy with say 2 dads will definitely get bullied. im not saying i would bully. i would never dream of bullying someone but i know for a fact they would get bullied by someone.


I'm not saying you are ignorant. I'm calling the bully ignorant and I don't think they should stop two loving people from bringing up a child. Why punish them? I think you should educate the ignorant not punish the couple who want a child.
Original post by bad8oy
how can you say it is natural in anyway what so ever. Man was made for Women. Women was made for Man. Man + Man = unnatural. they make aids and are bad for society as a whole


i would ask if you were for real but unfortunately i know the answer. yes, there are people this thick in the world.

gay people do not "make aids"... i'm not even going to indulge you if you say crap like this. i feel like i should try and reduce your ignorance but i can't be bothered.
Reply 313
Avatar for DYKWIA
DYKWIA
13
Original post by Bellissima
what do you mean by "teaching homosexuality"?? a lesson on how to be gay? that is the stupidest thing i've heard from you so far... why would there be lessons on homosexuality when there aren't any on heterosexuality? if you mean teaching children that there is nothing wrong with being gay... then what is wrong with that? what is the problem with teaching children not to hate people for something that has no affect on their character?

i do not respect the views of bigoted religious people, i do not respect the views of bigoted people full stop. if they want to hate people for something as pathetic as their skin colour or sexuality then that is their choice... but to not teach children that everyone should be treated the same regardless of race, sexuality etc. JUST because it goes against prejudiced views then that is completely wrong.


No, I'm saying that the rights of those who don't want their kids exposed to this stuff too much should be respected. Maybe it should be optional - i wouldn't want to be forced through some rant about why being gay is great.

"expose children to homosexuality"... well guess what, it's a fact of human life, they are going to be exposed to it one way or another. there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with telling children that some men or women love eachother the way mummy and daddy love eachother and you shouldn't hate people because of that. it's not going to make them gay. when i mentioned to my 8 year old cousin that will young was gay she said "ewwwww he's so gross" which i think is just distgusting that an 8 year old has been influenced this way to have a negative opinion on someone for something like sexuality.


So you agree that they should be conditioned into thinking homosexuality is great?

Original post by Care-Free
They teach religion in schools, i didnt need to hear about that, i have no intention on being religious but i still took part in the lessons and listened to people who's views differed from mine greatly, how is this any different to religious people listening to the views of those who are not in the same way sexually inclined....Not the best example considering numerous religious people understand that they can in fact be gay without falling into the deepest depths of hell.


There's a difference though. Religion education is about making people aware of religion. We are already aware of homosexuality, we don't need to be told how we should feel about it.

Original post by anarchism101
What do you mean by 'about homosexuality'? Is there really that much to teach?

I don't see why we should. We wouldn't 'respect the wishes' of racist parents who didn't want their children to be taught anti-racism in schools. We wouldn't 'respect the wishes' of parents who believed that people with skin diseases were inferior who didn't want their children to be taught that they deserve the same respect as anyone else. Why should we tolerate intolerant parents?

This sounds like the stupidest conspiracy theory I've ever heard.


I don't know, maybe they would teach about how evil religion is and how homosexuals have had such a hard time and no one else has.
Original post by bad8oy
how can you say it is right. how can you say i am ignorant??? if anyone is ignorant it is you because you cant see the real world for what it is


From the looks of your homophobic posts, you are indeed ignorant and unaware of reality. Please, do some research.
Original post by bad8oy
you cant educate the ignorant there is always going to be people like that, and homosexuality is never going to be accepted by society and that is something you will always have to come to terms with, especially while religion is around. i dont agree with it and most people in the world probably dont.


Giving up definitely wont stop it. Prejudice can be alleviated over time and I'm not saying it will be easy but it can be done. Their are many success stories of children who were brought up by a same sex couple and are now very confident, strong characters. How do you explain them away?
Original post by DYKWIA
No, I'm saying that the rights of those who don't want their kids exposed to this stuff too much should be respected. Maybe it should be optional - i wouldn't want to be forced through some rant about why being gay is great.



So you agree that they should be conditioned into thinking homosexuality is great?



There's a difference though. Religion education is about making people aware of religion. We are already aware of homosexuality, we don't need to be told how we should feel about it.



I don't know, maybe they would teach about how evil religion is and how homosexuals have had such a hard time and no one else has.


where did i say people should be conditioned into thinking being gay is great? i think people should be educated in acceptance and not holding prejudice against others due to things like race, skin colour, sexuality, disability etc.. i think people should be educated into realising that there is nothing WRONG with being gay and it is equal to being straight. that does not mean i think it's great? i don't think it's anything... being gay is just being gay, it's neither good nor bad, just like being straight is neither good nor bad.

if people want to actively take their children out of a lesson where something like acceptance of all nationalities, races, sexualities, sexes etc. being equal is taught just because it opposes their view and they don't want to open their mind, then that is their decision. i think it is rather pathetic that they feel that way, but that doesn't mean that other children whose parents' do not mind or aren't bothered shouldn't be taught to value for their character rather than something physical like skin colour or something else like sexuality.
Original post by bad8oy
the fact that i disagree with homosexuality doesnt mean im homophobic.


1. There's nothing to disagree with.
2. Your posts are almost entirely completely false, and therefore it is logical to assume you are a homophobe making up excuses for hating gay people.
Original post by DYKWIA
What if they start teaching about evolution in schools. We should respect the wishes of religious folk who don't want their children to be exposed to things like that.


What you just said is comparable to this.
Original post by DYKWIA

I don't know, maybe they would teach about how evil religion is and how homosexuals have had such a hard time and no one else has.


Most religions oppose abortion. Schools are obliged to give children information about how they could get an abortion if the situation came up, but they don't teach 'how evil religion is' there. Can't see it being different. And in most schools, kids are taught truckloads about how oppressed black people, Jews, women, etc have been.

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