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Why would anyone want to be a satanist?

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    (Original post by Stratos)
    That would be Laveyan satanism yes, but I assume the op is speaking of those actively worshipping "the beast", gotta give it to the christians that's one hell of a cool name.
    The OP mentioned LaVey, so I assumed they were talking about Laveyan Satanism. Also being the largest organisation to call themselves "satanists", it seems reasonable to assume that's what they meant.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    The OP mentioned LaVey, so I assumed they were talking about Laveyan Satanism. Also being the largest organisation to call themselves "satanists", it seems reasonable to assume that's what they meant.
    Sorry my mistake. :cool:
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    Y'know, I went through a very angry phase when I was a teenager and of course I went through the 'hmmmm, satanism looks cool' phase. I got LaVeys book and, well, its generally gobbledygook. At the same time though, there are some things in it that have stuck with me to this day...mainly about self preservation and self worth. As another person said at the start of the thread, some people worship god and some worship satan. Neither are likely to be real, so its not much of a big deal.
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    (Original post by Mequa)
    Years back, I was a moderator on a LaVeyan Satanist forum for around 2 years. (I am no longer on good terms with them, long story short, I got a lifetime ban.)

    While these guys are often criticised for making selfishness a virtue, in my first-hand experience it is not self-interest which is their real issue.

    Satanists have a tendency to be extremely narcissistic and snobbishly elitist people, which tends towards online phenomena such as flame wars, trolling, cyber-bullying and often cyber-stalking. The various factions of Satanism tend to hate each other, most notably theistic vs atheistic Satanists, but also those who politically lean to the Far Right are bitter enemies of those who combine Satanism with left-wing ideologies. LaVeyan Satanists often hate each other too, due to allegiances with rival groups (such as Peter Gilmore's Church of Satan VS Karla LaVey's First Satanic Church), which although being almost philosophically identical in outlook, are bitter enemies. People still get banned from fora for being a member of a rival forum, or at the very least ridiculed. Grudges are held for years.

    The Order of Nine Angles, which I linked the Wikipedia page of, is one of the most controversial Satanist groups of all time, due to its avowal of neo-Nazism, open promotion of human sacrifice (e.g. murder) and other criminal activities. It may not even have been a real organisation, but in the last few years it saw a resurgence of interest on the Internet with many groups claiming affiliation and promoting its unsavoury tenets. Most of these groups closed down recently, largely due to some bitter in-fighting.

    Satanism is one hell of a subculture (excuse the pun), but is really not a pleasant one in many ways. Pseudo-intellectualism and often overt anti-intellectualism abounds. It is very common for people there to gain social status and climb the pecking order through sexualised interaction, and are willing to abuse the privileges offered in return, whether through being able to insult and abuse others with impunity (with harsh measures dished out if those lower down the pecking order reciprocate), or go rampant with a ban-hammer on online forums, and this is often painted as a form of meritocratic stratification. Those "coming out on top" assumed to have done so out of genuine merit.

    LaVeyans have the notion of themselves being an elite form of human being. Those who lean towards Order of Nine Angles doctrines regard the majority of humans as "mundanes", and such misanthropy often lends itself to a fascist worldview where the masses of humanity are viewed as cattle, ideally to be ruled with an iron fist (and "culled" as necessary). There is a lot of testosterone-fuelled narcissism here. Whether it is "evil" or not is another question, but it seems to me more like a bunch of p!ssy misanthropes having a circle jerk.

    While some of LaVey's ideas do have merit, and I still have a soft spot for LaVeyanism in some ways, I am happy to no longer have involvement with them. Also, bear in mind that LaVey was basically a con artist using notoriety to push his own ideology (in the form of a parody religion) and draw in the membership fees for his "church". In some ways Satanism hasn't escaped from the worst parts of Christianity. There are bitter factions, there is bigotry, there are con games, but combined with some of the worst adolescent-style drama I have ever witnessed. Still, I'd rather know a LaVeyan than a Christian fundamentalist.
    It's nice to see someone who actually knows what they're talking about on this thread!

    The OP's friend who listens to marilyn manson and reads passages from the satanic bible sounds like he's going through a hilarious rebellious teenager stage.
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    (Original post by ohirome)
    I got LaVeys book and, well, its generally gobbledygook.
    I assume you mean The Satanic Bible; Anton LaVey authored a total of 5 books in all (perhaps with some of his "biographies" [mainly fictional] ghost-written by him). This particular book was cobbled together in a hurry and contains very little original material written for the purpose, and a lot of padding needed to create a complete book.

    The second section of that book (called "The Book of Lucifer") is the least gobbledygook part. It's basically a collection of essays on various topics Anton LaVey originally handed out to his occult circle, before publishing in this format. This section is worth a read, in my view, even if the rest is junked.

    The first part ("The Book of Satan") is basically meant to be inflammatory, and is entirely composed of plagiarised excerpts from an old social Darwinist book which have been edited to give a more "Satanic" twist. It seems to be more for shock value than anything else, although some followers do take it literally.

    The second half of The Satanic Bible ("The Book of Belial" and "The Book of Leviathan") concerns magic spells, specifically black magic. This is the most gobbledygook part. The first spells included (as with other material) were originally handed out to LaVey's occult circle; the remainder was filled up with bastardised versions of "The Enochian Keys" in order to make the book long enough to publish without being a pamphlet. Some interpret the rituals within as a form of "psychodrama" rather than literal voodoo (an interpretation inspired by Gestalt psychotherapy which was in vogue in the 1960s), although there are those who take this very literally, even those Satanists who claim to be professed atheists. This strange mix of magic and atheism is another peculiarity in the subculture. LaVey also wrote another book of rituals ("The Satanic Rituals"), which adds more gobbledygook/psychodrama (take your pick)...

    You can get it online as a PDF, although it is still under copyright so this is clearly illegal.
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    I claimed to be a satanist and played the odd bit of Slayer (from my phone!) when I was about 14, primarily for the purpose of watching the reaction of the evangelical Christian girl in my class :rofl:
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    As for all the contrasting styles of Satanism, one Satanist I know online coined the term "Satanity" to describe the composite of all Satanisms.

    Make of that what you will.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    They don't worship Satan. Or at least not the same literal Satan from Christianity. They don't believe there is literally a sadistic demon called Satan who lives underground. Satan is a metaphor for the chaos inherent in nature.

    I think you'll find that most Satanists don't believe god exists, and I'm sure they don't believe in hell either.

    I'm sure some do.. You know, worship Satan.
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    (Original post by sophia_)
    I'm sure some do.. You know, worship Satan.
    Those guys at joyofsatan.com certainly do. They also have a bit of a neo-Nazi bent, and evangelise to teens.

    Complete whackjobs, in my humble opinion.
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    (Original post by HollyB_C)
    I think they're people who just need some love - and a great big hug
    :hugs:
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    (Original post by Mequa)
    I assume you mean The Satanic Bible; Anton LaVey authored a total of 5 books in all (perhaps with some of his "biographies" [mainly fictional] ghost-written by him). This particular book was cobbled together in a hurry and contains very little original material written for the purpose, and a lot of padding needed to create a complete book.

    The second section of that book (called "The Book of Lucifer") is the least gobbledygook part. It's basically a collection of essays on various topics Anton LaVey originally handed out to his occult circle, before publishing in this format. This section is worth a read, in my view, even if the rest is junked.

    The first part ("The Book of Satan") is basically meant to be inflammatory, and is entirely composed of plagiarised excerpts from an old social Darwinist book which have been edited to give a more "Satanic" twist. It seems to be more for shock value than anything else, although some followers do take it literally.

    The second half of The Satanic Bible ("The Book of Belial" and "The Book of Leviathan") concerns magic spells, specifically black magic. This is the most gobbledygook part. The first spells included (as with other material) were originally handed out to LaVey's occult circle; the remainder was filled up with bastardised versions of "The Enochian Keys" in order to make the book long enough to publish without being a pamphlet. Some interpret the rituals within as a form of "psychodrama" rather than literal voodoo (an interpretation inspired by Gestalt psychotherapy which was in vogue in the 1960s), although there are those who take this very literally, even those Satanists who claim to be professed atheists. This strange mix of magic and atheism is another peculiarity in the subculture. LaVey also wrote another book of rituals ("The Satanic Rituals"), which adds more gobbledygook/psychodrama (take your pick)...

    You can get it online as a PDF, although it is still under copyright so this is clearly illegal.
    Are any of his books worth reading? I mean can you get something useful out of it that could help you in life lol, if yes which one should I read? I like his idea that a Human should pay more respect towards themselves but other than that the rest is ****.
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    (Original post by TheMJCG)
    Are any of his books worth reading? I mean can you get something useful out of it that could help you in life lol, if yes which one should I read? I like his idea that a Human should pay more respect towards themselves but other than that the rest is ****.
    I'd just start with the first half of The Satanic Bible (you can stop at the "Book of Belial"). You may find a library that stocks it if you don't want to shell out for it.
    Of course I can't openly recommend PDF downloads etc.

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