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Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab helped onto plane??

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    (Original post by TobeTheHero)
    apparently I have read on the internet that FBI helped a chicken cross...
    read my other posts, then do the talking.
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    (Original post by xXxiKillxXx)
    So the Dutch claim he did have a passport? You can't really use this to oppose the argument, because the argument I stated was that it could have been an FBI sting operation, and IF it WAS, then of course the Dutch intelligence is going to side with the FBI. Also where is the video evidence of him at Schiphol airport? Maybe he did have a passport, but why don't they release video evidence to prove it? Who exactly from Dutch intelligence claimed that he did have a passport anyway? Just because Dutch intelligence said something, doesn't mean its true.. I am open to other explanations IF there is evidence for them..
    You evidence of a sting is he was helped onto the plane, evidence of this is he didn't have a passport but was allowed on. Evidence from the officials says he did have a passport, procedure says he would need a passport, he would have known he needed a passport, the official at the gate was overruled by a random man who they had never seen before? All the signs would point to him having a passport and as such no having to be let on the plane. The only thing saying otherwise is one man's claim, a claim which is also totally illogical from the side of the FBI and the terrorist.

    So I provide some evidence that is wrong, but your evidence is correct? How convenient.
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    (Original post by doggyfizzel)
    You evidence of a sting is he was helped onto the plane, evidence of this is he didn't have a passport but was allowed on. Evidence from the officials says he did have a passport, procedure says he would need a passport, he would have known he needed a passport, the official at the gate was overruled by a random man who they had never seen before? All the signs would point to him having a passport and as such no having to be let on the plane. The only thing saying otherwise is one man's claim, a claim which is also totally illogical from the side of the FBI and the terrorist.

    So I provide some evidence that is wrong, but your evidence is correct? How convenient.
    The guy who supposedly helped him to get on was a man of Asian descent. It wouldn't be that hard to believe that Farouk was tricked by this Asian (who perhaps supplied him with the non-functional bomb as part of the whole sting) to think that he would help him get onto the plane without the usual security checks..

    Also it is not ''evidence from the officials'', it is a CLAIM by the officials, there is a big difference. If there is a video proving he had a passport, then by all means post it and I will rest my alternative theory. Until then you cannot call it ''evidence''.. Also, tbh, I have provided more ''evidence'' than you, I have provided a video with passengers (more than one passenger!), claiming there was a different side to the story, all you have done is post a link that claims Dutch officials said he did have a passport.. (which might not even be a claim made by the Dutch?)
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    Anyways it wouldn't be the first FBI sting :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Finton
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    (Original post by xXxiKillxXx)
    The guy who supposedly helped him to get on was a man of Asian descent. It wouldn't be that hard to believe that Farouk was tricked by this Asian (who perhaps supplied him with the non-functional bomb as part of the whole sting) to think that he would help him get onto the plane without the usual security checks..
    If this were the case why the Asian man need not exist. Farouk had a Nigerian passport if he had this and his valid visa, he could have just got on the plane. The security checks still happened he had long since gone though security and he wasn't on the no fly list. There is no reason for this Asian man to exist unless you need him to form a conspiracy theory. If the conspiracy were true, he wouldn't exist.

    Also it is not ''evidence from the officials'', it is a CLAIM by the officials, there is a big difference. If there is a video proving he had a passport, then by all means post it and I will rest my alternative theory. Until then you cannot call it ''evidence''.. Also, tbh, I have provided more ''evidence'' than you, I have provided a video with passengers (more than one passenger!), claiming there was a different side to the story, all you have done is post a link that claims Dutch officials said he did have a passport.. (which might not even be a claim made by the Dutch?)
    Not more than one passenger, two passengers who are both husband and wife, that is effectively one source. No other non related passengers saw this man.

    Answer me this, why would he not have a passport? If he was a terrorist with months of planning, why would he not bring a passport. If it was a set up why not tell him to bring his passport rather than get someone to overrule at the gate, what reason would you have for doing that?
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    SO what if they did?

    Due to the way the courts work, it can be difficult to secure a conviction based on someone's intent and intelligence gathered on that, that is why it takes so many terror suspects so long to get to trail, it is difficult to pin it on them. However, it would be much easier to gain a conviction, if the criminal goes onto a plane with what they believe to be a bomb and attempts to detonate it. At which point they can be arressted and dealt with. Seems perfectl reasonable to me. Yes, there may be issues with entrapment, but as far as I'm concerned these can be waved away when dealing with attempts of mass murder and such like.
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    (Original post by Steevee)
    SO what if they did?

    Due to the way the courts work, it can be difficult to secure a conviction based on someone's intent and intelligence gathered on that, that is why it takes so many terror suspects so long to get to trail, it is difficult to pin it on them. However, it would be much easier to gain a conviction, if the criminal goes onto a plane with what they believe to be a bomb and attempts to detonate it. At which point they can be arressted and dealt with. Seems perfectl reasonable to me. Yes, there may be issues with entrapment, but as far as I'm concerned these can be waved away when dealing with attempts of mass murder and such like.
    Because due to these sting operations, the dumb general public readily accepts more draconian measures thinking that it helps prevent 'terrorism' (such as this case).They think that they are now safe because the glorious FBI just 'foiled' another terrorist attack; when in reality, they didn't foil any attacks, without the FBI the attack couldn't have occurred..
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    (Original post by Karlito1978)
    You also say people who don't believe the statements are authentic are 'idiotic'.

    So you kind of do say they are by implication.

    I'd say, stop reading silly conspiracy websites and except the fact that many, many muslims are racist.
    Wait.. what has Muslims and racism got to do with this? Elaborate..
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    (Original post by xXxiKillxXx)
    Because due to these sting operations, the dumb general public readily accepts more draconian measures thinking that it helps prevent 'terrorism' (such as this case).They think that they are now safe because the glorious FBI just 'foiled' another terrorist attack; when in reality, they didn't foil any attacks, without the FBI the attack couldn't have occurred..
    Well, not really. These people would have attempted to attack and link up with other extremists, we are just removing them. PLus there's the factor that the security forces stop far more than you ever hear about, because they can't make it public knowledge for further security reasons.
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    (Original post by Karlito1978)
    The guy was a muslim. He wanted to blow whites up on our Holiest day due to the racism that his religion conduces.

    You're another racist muslim who can't accept that muslims do wrong and wants to pin all the blame on evil whitey.
    LOL LOL LOL, are you trolling? I mean if you said he wanted to blow up non-believers, I would understand where you are coming from but racism? Your really ignorant. Firstly, Christmas day is not a ''White'' holy day, its origins lie elsewhere. Secondly, give me ANY example from the Quran/Sunnah which promotes racism against White people? In fact, give me any example that seems to suggest racism against White people.. (I challenge anyone reading this). Give me ONE just ONE example of me blaming ''evil whitey''.. Since you people always go on about groups such as Islam4UK, have you ever bothered to look closely? About 3-4 members are White..

    You seem like a White Nationalist...

    Either way, don't ignore this. If you do, it just proves your repeated accusations are baseless.
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    (Original post by Karlito1978)
    There you go again. you just can;t help yourself. A white man objects to the inherent kuffar hating and misogyny in the koran that informs the muslims beliefs so he must be a 'white nationalist'.

    Such a racist mindset. English people grew out of racism a long time ago. It's time for muslims to catch up.
    I don't care at all about your race, I didn't even KNOW you were White until you told me. And no I assumed you were a White Nationalist because of the way you use the term ''Whitey''.. plus I assumed so because you seemed to put strong emphasis on White unity and White ''days''; most critics of Islam on TSR are liberals who promote unity between all races etc and I knew you couldn't be one of them..

    And I see how you dodged my question. No answers aye?
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    (Original post by Karlito1978)
    You shouldn't assume, it makes you look silly.

    Not as silly as refusing to accept that some muslims do bad things and believing it's always an evil set up by the evil white man.

    Your people are massively racist. Time to grow up.
    I DO accept some Muslims do bad things, thats part of a Muslims belief. And although there are some Muslims who dislike White people, they are a VAST minority, and I'm sure this guy wasn't one of them. He trained with Al-Qaeda according to the official story for god sake, Al-Qaeda is so racially diverse nowadays. And you still haven't answered how Islam teaches racism against Whites.. Ignoring the point again aye..

    EDIT: Why does it have to be an evil set up by the ''White man''? Are you really as stupid as you appear? You do realise a lot of the White House (a so-called enemy of Islamists) are of Hispanic, Jewish, Black etc descent? The President is half-black..!
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    just ask the FBI. don't think anyone cares

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Updated: February 29, 2012
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