How would one describe Thatcher's Britain
Discuss issues related to the politics of the UK, such as the actions of any MP, any current or potential law, or any other factor affecting the British political system.
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainTo be honest, I'd argue the mistake they made was in joining the ERM in the first place in 1990, not leaving it in 1992.(Original post by Democracy)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Wednesday
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...00/2519013.stm
"Cap in hand" indeed
It's pretty disingenous to blame Labour for what is the failings of the neoliberal, capitalist system of economics when Thatcher's own successors were a disaster themselves.
As we saw with the gold standard, as we saw with the Euro, as we saw with the ERM, and with a vast number of fixed exchange rate mechanisms over the years, they just don't work. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainI did read your post, it contained 2 links about Black wednesday, a failure of an integrationist mechanism which tried to lump all the EU currencies together (good to see the EU learning from its mistakes there). Which seemed to suggest that you blamed thatcher or her successors for it, which, while partly fair as Major did push for the UK to join, overlooks the fact that the EU were responsible for setting up the system, and also overlooks the excellent performance of the UK economy under Major. (He almost halved unemployment between 1994 and 1997).(Original post by Democracy)
If my granny had wheels she'd be a bike
I didn't say that. Did you actually read my post?
"failings of the neoliberal, capitalist system of economics"
I level the blame at the economic school, not individuals or parties. Which is why I found your Daily Express style "cap in hand" statement particularly silly.
Your point was about general economic blundering. The Conservative party are perfectly capable of presiding over that, as they proved in 1992, they had no need to wait for Labour to come along and do it for them. Therefore your point was irrelevant and sounded like typical party politics point scoring.
See above, you can blame individuals all you like, that's not looking at the root of the problem.
My point about Labour making things worse is basically this. The economy cycles through boom and bust. What Labour did was to believe Brown's claim to have ended 'tory boom and bust' and as such they spent as if the boom would never end. They doubled the national debt in the good times and now the people are left to sort out Labour's mess, facing harsh cuts which, while implemented by the conservatives, would be nessecary under any party. Attack Thatchers economic theory if you will, it certainly beats one where you refuse to acknowledge the existance of boom and bust until after the bust has happened. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainYes the richer got richer, but the vast majority of the poor also got richer.(Original post by maturestudy)
The rich got richer whilst the poor got poorer.
Some coal miners for example now congratulate Thatcher closing down the mines as some of them went on to running business and now make a considerablely higher wage than what they did as a miner. Once the mines were closed miners sons had an incentive to get good qualification at school, rather than them just focusing on going into mining. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainI hate studying her poetry the only context it has is her moaning about Thatcher's Britain which makes my essays dull as then I've got to whine as well about thatchers Britain to back my argument up.(Original post by Tahooper)
You're writing an essay on Carol Ann Duffy? I hope by that you mean you're writing an essay on how much of a chauvinistic feminazi she is.
She is an annoying feminist. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainTo quote the iron lady herself 'that is the socialist way, you would rather see the poor get poorer so long as the rich were less rich' the vast majority of people are better off as a result of thatcherism. Simple tests like, when was your power last turned off due to strike action? demonstrate this.(Original post by tomcol23)
Yes the richer got richer, but the vast majority of the poor also got richer.
Some coal miners for example now congratulate Thatcher closing down the mines as some of them went on to running business and now make a considerablely higher wage than what they did as a miner. Once the mines were closed miners sons had an incentive to get good qualification at school, rather than them just focusing on going into mining. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainGordon Brown appointing Duffy as poet laureate certainly outranks any failings that Margaret Thatcher ever had.
The poor got richer. But that's not even the main issue - the poor also became materially better off - compare early 1990s Britain to late 1970s Britain: the change in fortunes of the working class is almost like night and day.(Original post by screenager2004)
Thatcher treated Britain like a company, not a nation. Yes, the country made a lot of money, but this wealth was concentrated amongst a minority, the rich got richer, the fabled 'trickle down' never materialisedLast edited by L i b; 20-02-2012 at 18:28. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainShort sighted.
Yes, many would argue she brought Britain out of the ****e days of the 1970's. But in doing so she helped pave the way for the mess we are in today. i.e. A complete over reliance on the financial sector, the concentration of this countries power and wealth on 1 square mile of central London, increasing regional wealth divide and an increasing wealth divide between the poorest and richest of society. Her policies also led to the devastation of many communities who are still feeling the impact of unemployment and all its associated problems today.
Other countries like Germany managed to retain much of their manufacturing industries whereas ours was ripped to pieces, and no other country is quite so reliant on the notoriously unreliable financial sector as Britain is. These are Tatchers legacies. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainI disagree so completely with you on that. We need poets.(Original post by chrisawhitmore)
Thatcher took a country on the brink of financial ruin, which had already had to go cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout, and rebuilt it to an economy so strong it managed to last 11 years under Labour before collapsing, yet still poets, who are essentially the second most useless profession after trade union leaders, enjoy complaining about her ... -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainYou have single-handedly restored my faith in humanity with this post :')(Original post by chrisawhitmore)
Thatcher took a country on the brink of financial ruin, which had already had to go cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout, and rebuilt it to an economy so strong it managed to last 11 years under Labour before collapsing, yet still poets, who are essentially the second most useless profession after trade union leaders, enjoy complaining about her ... -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainAs it happens, the German heavy industries require near constant EU subsidies. It is really a choice of occasional large bailouts or constant small ones.(Original post by Azog 150)
Short sighted.
Yes, many would argue she brought Britain out of the ****e days of the 1970's. But in doing so she helped pave the way for the mess we are in today. i.e. A complete over reliance on the financial sector, the concentration of this countries power and wealth on 1 square mile of central London, increasing regional wealth divide and an increasing wealth divide between the poorest and richest of society. Her policies also led to the devastation of many communities who are still feeling the impact of unemployment and all its associated problems today.
Other countries like Germany managed to retain much of their manufacturing industries whereas ours was ripped to pieces, and no other country is quite so reliant on the notoriously unreliable financial sector as Britain is. These are Tatchers legacies. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainI like how people ignore section 28 because they can't talk their way out of that one with the "It made us richer!!!!" excuse.
Anyway to answer the question in one word I'd say: divided.Last edited by Beebumble; 21-03-2012 at 22:15. -
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Re: How would one describe Thatcher's BritainI have never found a politician with whom I agree on every point. Section 28 was a mistake. It by no means cancels all the good she did. Also, improving the economy is not an excuse, but one of the most important things she could have done.(Original post by Beebumble)
I like how people ignore section 28 because they can't talk their way out of that one with the "It made us richer!!!!" excuse.
Anyway to answer the question in one word I'd say: divided.
