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Islam isn't the worst religion.

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    (Original post by Scarface-Don)
    I said that I would not reply but I just can't stand your stupidness. How can you say that Islam is an Arabic religion? Islam is probably one of the most diverse religion, with billions of followers from non-Arabic countries in the Middle East, Asia and Africa. It's like saying that Christianity is an Israeli religion because it was formed in Jerusalem and that's where Jesus (pbuh) is from when yet Europe has millions if not a billion followers of the Christian faith.
    I stated it was arabic in relation to origins of its traditions - you seemed to forget that many of the islamic traditions you referred were in the main those that pre-islamic 'pagan' arabs practiced for hundreds of years before mohammed turned up. And its those that are applied worldwide, regadless of how internation you say it is. Why do you think it is that most muslim people wherever they are in the world are given names that are essentially derived from arabic ones?
    Equally christian tradition can be traced back to ancient hebrew tradition, names etc - albeit much of western christianty has been 'europeanised' for many centuries.
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    (Original post by Empire08)
    How is this positive? The only thing that makes sense from those three is the no alcohol, I suppose you could argue for health reasons. But, I don't need a fairy tale book to tell me what is good and bad for me thanks, I can make my own decisions.

    Edit: Also, the link you gave to Wikipedia clearly states that fasting 'may' have benefits. It's not been proven conclusively. In any case, it's irrelevant.
    Using this ideology, the big bang is still a theory so it may or may not have happened. Its not been proven conclusively. In any case, its irrelevant.
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    (Original post by Indo-Chinese Food)
    I stated it was arabic in relation to origins of its traditions - you seemed to forget that many of the islamic traditions you referred were in the main those that pre-islamic 'pagan' arabs practiced for hundreds of years before mohammed turned up. And its those that are applied worldwide, regadless of how internation you say it is. Why do you think it is that most muslim people wherever they are in the world are given names that are essentially derived from arabic ones?
    Equally christian tradition can be traced back to ancient hebrew tradition, names etc - albeit much of western christianty has been 'europeanised' for many centuries.
    Yo dawg wassup yo homie

    ^ Might as well say that, dude.
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    (Original post by ShredMaster)
    I'm not even gonna bother making an adequate reply.
    100% success
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    All religions have positives and negatives about them, and considering "worst" is relative it's clearly not a subject that can be decided upon collectively. People do need to stop criticizing other people's religions though; as long as people aren't affecting your life negatively, leave them be.
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    (Original post by Waqar.)
    Often silly is still a wrong statement, majority of the rules are there for a reason. These reasons are stated in the Qu'ran. So far around 80% of the Qu'ran has been verified to be correct in other words, the reasons are true. the other 20% hasn't been verified but none of it has been wrong yet. I did say that i wasn't too sure about that stat so theres no point picking me up on that and not replying to the rest of my reply lol

    You ate pork, that's your problem not mine. Pigs are known for eating their own faeces and even cannibalism. Any animal that eats it's own waste and rolls around in it happily is definitely not going into my body.
    Just thought I'd point out that pigs are naturally very clean and intelligent animals. They can't stand being in their own muck... The only reason they would be is when they are forced to live like that by humans. They also don't choose to eat other pigs, if they do it is fed to them.
    So if you get your pork from decent farms that look after their animals, than none of what you just mentioned is an issue at all. It may have been a concern back when the Qu'ran was written, but it's not now. I eat pork and I'm perfectly healthy.
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    (Original post by Emaemmaemily)
    People do need to stop criticizing other people's religions .
    why ?

    some religions are perfectly hateful, advocate heinous crimes and persecutions, and deserve to be criticized without any sort of hesitation or political correctness

    what often happens unfortunately is that once a set of principles and prescriptions gets the "religious label" , its followers will go on and claim some absurd immunity from criticism (as well as tax exemptions)
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    why ?

    some religions are perfectly hateful, advocate heinous crimes and persecutions, and deserve to be criticized without any sort of hesitation or political correctness

    what often happens unfortunately is that once a set of principles and prescriptions gets the "religious label" , its followers will go on and claim some absurd immunity from criticism (as well as tax exemptions)
    If you quoted the rest of what I said, you'd see my reply to this. My point is that we shouldn't bother other people and their religions, as long as they aren't negatively affecting other people's lives because it is none of our business.
    All religions have bad things about them, and we each have opinions on the ones we dislike the most, but it's all relative at the end of the day.
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    (Original post by Emaemmaemily)
    If you quoted the rest of what I said, you'd see my reply to this. My point is that we shouldn't bother other people and their religions, as long as they aren't negatively affecting other people's lives because it is none of our business..
    this is not quite true

    some religions affect negatively their own people (e.g.religions which forbid blood transfusions and vaccinations, or prescribe dangerous or inhuman practices) - this poses a problem in particular in the case of children (not only with regard to health, but also with regard to education)

    also, any religion which is followed by a consistent number of adepts will, at some moment or another, ask for public recognition and will affect others

    it will ask for recognition of its holidays, accommodation of its dietary rules, frequently for exemption from military service (where applicable) for its ministers, and then any sort of fiscal privileges

    and, most of all, exemption from criticism
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    (Original post by prince1990)
    Using this ideology, the big bang is still a theory so it may or may not have happened.
    Correct.

    (Original post by prince1990)
    Its not been proven conclusively. In any case, its irrelevant.
    Not quite. But nice try.

    By the way, the reason I said the 'health benefits' are irrelevant is because I don't need a book to tell me how to live.
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    this is not quite true

    some religions affect negatively their own people (e.g.religions which forbid blood transfusions and vaccinations, or prescribe dangerous or inhuman practices) - this poses a problem in particular in the case of children (not only with regard to health, but also with regard to education)

    also, any religion which is followed by a consistent number of adepts will, at some moment or another, ask for public recognition and will affect others

    it will ask for recognition of its holidays, accommodation of its dietary rules, frequently for exemption from military service (where applicable) for its ministers, and then any sort of fiscal privileges

    and, most of all, exemption from criticism
    I think you have completely missed my point. It affecting children within the religion is still affecting others. What I meant by "others" was another individual, as I was speaking on a person to person basis. So we should leave people to their religion, unless they are affecting other people (even other people within their religion) negatively.

    Religions being recognised isn't a negative affect, so is irrelevant.
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    (Original post by Emaemmaemily)
    Religions being recognised isn't a negative affect, so is irrelevant.
    It isn't irrelevant

    e.g. if religious holidays are recognized, special dietary prescriptions or sexual segregation accommodated in public services, tax exemptions granted etc this has an economic cost, which will be borne by the entire community
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    It isn't irrelevant

    e.g. if religious holidays are recognized, special dietary prescriptions or sexual segregation accommodated in public services, tax exemptions granted etc this has an economic cost, which will be borne by the entire community
    You're going quite far past what I was speaking about though. All I said was that individuals should be left alone as long as they aren't negatively affecting other people; I made it clear in my last post that I'm speaking mainly about individuals.
    As I've said previously, I know there are many negatives to all religions (I'm not religious myself at all, so don't agree with any of them), but there should always be a certain amount of religious freedom.
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    (Original post by Emaemmaemily)
    You're going quite far past what I was speaking about though. All I said was that individuals should be left alone as long as they aren't negatively affecting other people; I made it clear in my last post that I'm speaking mainly about individuals.
    As I've said previously, I know there are many negatives to all religions (I'm not religious myself at all, so don't agree with any of them), but there should always be a certain amount of religious freedom.
    I agree

    my main point however is : we should have strict separation between religion and State

    the State has to be religiously "blind" : only in this way will there be no distortion/discrimination in the use of public money and authority for private purposes

    also, I wanted to stress that religions should not be afforded any special treatment or protection, beyond what the law prescribes for any person or organization

    for this reason, I remarked that religion usually is not strictly individual. It tends to form organizations, and these should be treated like any other organization.

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    (Original post by mariachi)
    I agree

    my main point however is : we should have strict separation between religion and State

    the State has to be religiously "blind" : only in this way will there be no distortion/discrimination in the use of public money and authority for private purposes

    also, I wanted to stress that religions should not be afforded any special treatment or protection, beyond what the law prescribes for any person or organization

    for this reason, I remarked that religion usually is not strictly individual. It tends to form organizations, and these should be treated like any other organization.

    Best
    Well you've just stated exactly my own opinions, so I officially have no idea why you've stated this all to me as if you're arguing when it's what I think too.
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    (Original post by Emaemmaemily)
    Well you've just stated exactly my own opinions, so I officially have no idea why you've stated this all to me as if you're arguing when it's what I think too.
    Don't know. Seems like you did disagree with me also.

    Probably, the main difference is that you think a religion can exist without impacting non-believers, while in my view this is possible only in theory, but not in practice, as history has shown us.

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    (Original post by mariachi)
    Don't know. Seems like you did disagree with me also.

    Probably, the main difference is that you think a religion can exist without impacting non-believers, while in my view this is possible only in theory, but not in practice, as history has shown us.

    Best
    That is not what I've said at all. Perhaps you need to go back to the original things I've posted and actually read them, because that is almost the exact opposite of what I've said.
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    (Original post by Emaemmaemily)
    That is not what I've said at all. Perhaps you need to go back to the original things I've posted and actually read them, because that is almost the exact opposite of what I've said.
    Of course I have read them. This is the post I (partially) objected to

    People do need to stop criticizing other people's religions though; as long as people aren't affecting your life negatively, leave them be
    I pointed out that criticizing religions, even if they don't directly affect you, can be quite appropriate and necessary

    However, this discussion has become pointless.

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    (Original post by mariachi)
    Of course I have read them. This is the post I (partially) objected to



    I pointed out that criticizing religions, even if they don't directly affect you, can be quite appropriate and necessary

    However, this discussion has become pointless.

    Best
    And as I've clarified, I was referring to criticizing individuals for following a religion, rather than questioning religions themselves.
    Yes it has become pointless becuase it seems you still don't understand what my original point was. If you wish to continue this discussion feel free to PM me, but I feel we should stop hyjacking the thread.
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    (Original post by internet tough guy)
    Everything you said is fine, and as with everything in religion, how followers choose to interpret their rules and obligation is entirely up to them. Of course with enough dedication and faith in whoever you believe in, you can be inspired to do the most extraordinary things - like I don't know, walk up a mountain everyday? :dontknow:. Still, it doesn't mean they're practical, nor does it negate the fact that there are disadvantages to doing these activities. This is my main disagreement, I object to OP's suggestion to non-muslim (as this thread is aimed at non-muslims) that fasting is practical, because it isn't (on a strictly practical basis). Under the rules of fasting in Islam, say if I've just been through a long day's work and I am thirsty from the heat, I can't just drink - even though my body requires it. You are right, depending on your attitude there can be benefits (such as learning to be humble) from this fasting excercise, but in all honesty I think for most people, these benefits can be acheived through lesser means without such hassle as not consuming anything for up to 15 hours a day.
    Fair enough :shakehand:

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