Hey there Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Is it medieval to want to keep an indigenous majority and retain our culture?

Announcements Posted on
Post on TSR and win a prize! Find out more... 10-04-2014
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Stefan1991)
    Why on Earth would you be proud of that? :lolwut:
    If someone said they were proud to be Indian and Hindu you would happly accept the statement but if someone says that they are proud to be British and White you think there must be something wrong if they say it? Why on earth do you think he should not be proud of being British and white? (Do you want to impose you identity crisis on him?)
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by No Future)
    I don't agree with people above who seem to equate skin colour to culture, the given example being:

    "I am white and relate to white people".

    There is no homogeneous 'white culture'. There are many white cultures and not all white people share the same culture.

    e.g. A white Brit, white American and white Norwegian do not share the same culture. They may share a similar skin colour, but not the same culture.

    Culture does not depend on the colour of your skin, but of where you grew up, your family values, where you live, where you were educated etc.

    And someone who is not white can share the same culture that is regarded as traditionally 'white'. A non white person who was born or has lived for many years in the UK may adopt British culture (and perhaps keep some of the culture of their ancestors)

    Why not take the best of both cultures?

    I resent the notion that non white necessarily means 'foreigner with totally different culture'.

    Some non white people have lived in the UK for generations and are very proudly British. You don't have to be white to be British or white to be part of British culture.
    While it has become the political "Newspeak" to say that race and culture are mutually exclusive, this is very much a lie. Defenders of this lie go to the ends of the world to sustain their lie, finding exceptions all the time and putting them on the front of brochures. Of course there are exceptions, but to generalise (these Newspeak hate generalisations because generalisation is another word for the plain truth and they hate truth) most races and cultures are interlocked. If you look at say the Pakistani community or the Chinese community in Britsin, they largely live in the terms of their ancestoral past, and turn areas of Britain into areas of their nations. David Cameron said that multiculturalism was not working because integration was not happening.
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    While it has become the political "Newspeak" to say that race and culture are mutually exclusive, this is very much a lie. Defenders of this lie go to the ends of the world to sustain their lie, finding exceptions all the time and putting them on the front of brochures.
    Lol wtf?
    I'm stating this based on my own family and personal experience.

    (Original post by nicknick1)
    Of course there are exceptions, but to generalise (these Newspeak hate generalisations because generalisation is another word for the plain truth and they hate truth) most races and cultures are interlocked.
    You seem to think we're in a George Orwell novel.

    (Original post by nicknick1)
    If you look at say the Pakistani community or the Chinese community in Britsin, they largely live in the terms of their ancestoral past, and turn areas of Britain into areas of their nations. David Cameron said that multiculturalism was not working because integration was not happening.
    I don't know that many UK Pakistanis so can't comment on them, but I have a Pakistani friend from Toronto and her culture is a mixture of 'Canadian', Pakistani and Chinese. She is very "western". I agree that there are Pakistanis and Chinese who choose not to adopt western culture, but at the same time there are many Chinese who do.

    David Cameron? **** that ****. I don't care what he says.
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Stefan1991)
    This is just paranoid fearmongering. Islam will only take over if the majority want it?
    The rates of childbirth could mean that other cultures e.g. Islam because a majority in Western countries. After this the political and legal system could slowly change. (Don't tell me the creeping change does not happen, just look at the U.S. post 9/11).
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Stefan1991)
    You are proud of being rich? At the expense of millions of starving, impoverished people? Rich off hundreds of years of theft of other countries' resources at gunpoint? And a bloody, oppressive, brutal history?
    How is that anything to be proud of? :lolwut:
    It was only at the expense of people during the Empire days which was before any of us whatever side of the fence we are on now. You can't say we should be ashamed because we buy coffee from the 3rd world, although I am shamed of the unnecessary wars we wage and I am against those.
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Stefan1991)
    Might as well be proud of Hitler if you're that proud of mass murder, theft and slavery. :rolleyes:
    Might as well be proud of the Nazi's if you are proud of Political Correcness as they invented it.
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by T-Toe)
    It's hypocritical seeing as the Europeans inhabited indigenous land. *Cough America and Australia *cough*.

    If anything immigrants should be welcomed to 'western land' on a red carpet to compensate for the damage.
    I don't agree. The people alive today had nothing to do with those things which included decimating the Native American indigenous people. This is regrettable, but it does not mean we should open our borders to all and sundry.
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by py0alb)
    What culture? Give me examples. Also, what do you mean by indigenous?
    Sure, here is a photo of some of the British indigenous people:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	531.jpg 
Views:	69 
Size:	55.3 KB 
ID:	136202
    • 7 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    Sure, here is a photo of some of the British indigenous people:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	531.jpg 
Views:	69 
Size:	55.3 KB 
ID:	136202
    People who like holding placards?

    I don't like holding placards, they hurt my hands. Am I not indigenous British?

    Perhaps I have missed the point, could you be more specific?
    • 14 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    The rates of childbirth could mean that other cultures e.g. Islam because a majority in Western countries. After this the political and legal system could slowly change. (Don't tell me the creeping change does not happen, just look at the U.S. post 9/11).
    Well that would only be democratic, otherwise you have a system of government that is only supported by a minority, which would of course be wrong.

    You are also assuming all Muslims would want to live in a sharia law theocracy, many Muslims like our systems of governance. That is one reason why they're here.
    • 12 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    I don't agree. The people alive today had nothing to do with those things which included decimating the Native American indigenous people. This is regrettable, but it does not mean we should open our borders to all and sundry.
    Ahhhh -___- read my most recent post (besides this one).
    • 32 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    excuse me what is wrong with mediaeval ? OK the Early Middle Ages would have dragged a bit but the High Middle Ages saw the flourishing of Christendom and was the era of Chivalry and Courtly Love.
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by py0alb)
    People who like holding placards?

    I don't like holding placards, they hurt my hands. Am I not indigenous British?

    Perhaps I have missed the point, could you be more specific?
    Nearly 80% of indigenous British people are descendants of Neolithic era or earlier settlers, with some going back into Upper Palaeolithic times - up to 26,000 or more years ago. Even many of the remaining 20% have been in Britain since the late Neolithic period, with the Anglo-Saxon migrations around 500 AD and at the very latest, the Viking and Danish migrations, around 700 or 800 AD, making them resident here or at least 1300 years. In the 11th century there was the Norman invasion.


    The United Nations Department of Economic and Social Affairs defines indigenous people as follows: “indigenous communities, peoples and nations are those which, having a historical continuity with pre-invasion and pre-colonial societies that developed on their territories, consider themselves distinct from other sectors of the societies now prevailing on those territories, or parts of them. They form at present non-dominant sectors of society and are determined to preserve, develop and transmit to future generations their ancestral territories, and their ethnic identity, as the basis of their continued existence as peoples, in accordance with their own cultural patterns, social institutions and legal system.

    “This historical continuity may consist of the continuation, for an extended period reaching into the present of one or more of the following factors:
    a) Occupation of ancestral lands, or at least of part of them;
    b) Common ancestry with the original occupants of these lands;
    c) Culture in general, or in specific manifestations (such as religion, living under a tribal system, membership of an indigenous community, dress, means of livelihood, lifestyle, etc.);
    d) Language (whether used as the only language, as mother-tongue, as the habitual means of communication at home or in the family, or as the main, preferred, habitual, general or normal language);
    e) Residence on certain parts of the country, or in certain regions of the world;
    f) Other relevant factors.
    • 7 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    Nearly 80% of indigenous British people are descendants of Neolithic era or earlier settlers, with some going back into Upper Palaeolithic times - up to 26,000 or more years ago. Even many of the remaining 20% have been in Britain since the late Neolithic period, with the Anglo-Saxon migrations around 500 AD and at the very latest, the Viking and Danish migrations, around 700 or 800 AD, making them resident here or at least 1300 years. In the 11th century there was the Norman invasion.


    The United Nations Department of Economic and Social Affairs defines indigenous people as follows: “indigenous communities, peoples and nations are those which, having a historical continuity with pre-invasion and pre-colonial societies that developed on their territories, consider themselves distinct from other sectors of the societies now prevailing on those territories, or parts of them. They form at present non-dominant sectors of society and are determined to preserve, develop and transmit to future generations their ancestral territories, and their ethnic identity, as the basis of their continued existence as peoples, in accordance with their own cultural patterns, social institutions and legal system.

    “This historical continuity may consist of the continuation, for an extended period reaching into the present of one or more of the following factors:
    a) Occupation of ancestral lands, or at least of part of them;
    b) Common ancestry with the original occupants of these lands;
    c) Culture in general, or in specific manifestations (such as religion, living under a tribal system, membership of an indigenous community, dress, means of livelihood, lifestyle, etc.);
    d) Language (whether used as the only language, as mother-tongue, as the habitual means of communication at home or in the family, or as the main, preferred, habitual, general or normal language);
    e) Residence on certain parts of the country, or in certain regions of the world;
    f) Other relevant factors.


    I meant about the culture.

    Your stats are way off by the way. There are almost zero "pure" indigenous Britons left and they mainly live in Ireland.
    • Thread Starter
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by the bear)
    excuse me what is wrong with mediaeval ? OK the Early Middle Ages would have dragged a bit but the High Middle Ages saw the flourishing of Christendom and was the era of Chivalry and Courtly Love.
    Nothing is wrong with medieval. I just used the word because it is commonly used in a negative context towards people making British cultural statements.
    • 14 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    It was only at the expense of people during the Empire days which was before any of us whatever side of the fence we are on now. You can't say we should be ashamed because we buy coffee from the 3rd world, although I am shamed of the unnecessary wars we wage and I am against those.
    Empire days? You mean the last 450-500 years? Which would be all of our recent history. Which is why I can't see how you can be proud of our history. We have never stopped acting like colonial masters.

    We should be ashamed for the way we have kept the third world underdeveloped and in poverty to enrich ourselves.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dependency_theory

    Dependency and world system theory propose that the poverty and backwardness of poor countries are caused by their peripheral position in the international division of labor. Since the capitalist world system evolved, the distinction among the central and the peripheral nations has grown."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World-systems_theory

    "Europe (the West) utilized its advantages and gained control over most of the world economy, presiding over the development and spread of industrialization and capitalist economy, indirectly resulting in unequal development"
    • 14 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    Might as well be proud of the Nazi's if you are proud of Political Correcness as they invented it.
    I don't care much for "political correctness", but where have you got this bizarre idea that the Nazis invented it? :lolwut:
    • 14 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by nicknick1)
    If someone said they were proud to be Indian and Hindu you would happly accept the statement but if someone says that they are proud to be British and White you think there must be something wrong if they say it? Why on earth do you think he should not be proud of being British and white? (Do you want to impose you identity crisis on him?)
    Why would you be proud of being a certain race? :lolwut:

    And he shouldn't be proud of being British and white because there's nothing to be proud of....
    • 2 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by the bear)
    excuse me what is wrong with mediaeval ? OK the Early Middle Ages would have dragged a bit but the High Middle Ages saw the flourishing of Christendom and was the era of Chivalry and Courtly Love.
    Life expectancy wasn't up to much.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    What kind of failure at life states one of their crowning achievements as "being born in a certain place". And yes that doesn't just apply to white british people it applies to anyone who thinks along those lines.

Reply

Submit reply

Register

Thanks for posting! You just need to create an account in order to submit the post
  1. this can't be left blank
    that username has been taken, please choose another Forgotten your password?

    this is what you'll be called on TSR

  2. this can't be left blank
    this email is already registered. Forgotten your password?

    never shared and never spammed

  3. this can't be left blank

    6 characters or longer with both numbers and letters is safer

  4. this can't be left empty
    your full birthday is required
  1. By completing the slider below you agree to The Student Room's terms & conditions and site rules

  2. Slide the button to the right to create your account

    Slide to join now Processing…

    You don't slide that way? No problem.

Updated: March 24, 2012
Article updates
Useful resources
Reputation gems:
You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.