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What are your opinions on PBL?

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    (Original post by theatrical)
    Which courses don't have at least some element of a pre-clinical/clinical split?

    Most courses incoporate patient contact into the first few years, but these still have a clear pre-clinical/clinical devide.
    My course doesn't.
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    (Original post by theatrical)
    Which courses don't have at least some element of a pre-clinical/clinical split?

    Most courses incoporate patient contact into the first few years, but these still have a clear pre-clinical/clinical devide.
    That's really besides the point when you're purely talking about what the definition of the word is...
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    (Original post by .eXe)
    so is there 1 general exam that covers everything then? That must be a monster of an exam since it incorporates literally everything in medicine :O
    From what i heard, at manchester they give every year the same test at the end of the year but they expect first years to fail and you to get more marks each year.
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    (Original post by .eXe)
    so is there 1 general exam that covers everything then? That must be a monster of an exam since it incorporates literally everything in medicine :O
    Not quite. There is a clinical exam that every one takes, in all years, twice a year. It's called the progress test and as the name implies, you're supposed to progress each time you take it.

    In pre-clinicals, they take another exam every 6 months that covers everything that has been covered in the preceding 6 months.
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    (Original post by Hippokrates)
    From what i heard, at manchester they give every year the same test at the end of the year but they expect first years to fail and you to get more marks each year.
    Your grade reflects your performance in your year group - so nobody is expected to fail it.
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    (Original post by Beska)
    That's really besides the point when you're purely talking about what the definition of the word is...
    I was querying whether her definition of the word is actually correct...
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    So another question is do you feel PBL is complimentary to group Plenaries or lectures when run in tandem?
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    I figure asking in an ongoing topic might be better that starting my own thread since it'd be similar.

    Anyone could give more insight to how PBL is conducted in Glasgow? Your opinions on it, what could be improved..etc?
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    If PBL works as a group of people already knowing stuff discussing it - then what's the point in medical school? We could just all skip the first couple of years, buy books, learn stuffs at home and pitch up to talk about it, yes? I've asked this before - where is the evidence that PBL is as effective, or more effective than traditional diadactic courses?
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    (Original post by Wangers)
    If PBL works as a group of people already knowing stuff discussing it - then what's the point in medical school? We could just all skip the first couple of years, buy books, learn stuffs at home and pitch up to talk about it, yes? I've asked this before - where is the evidence that PBL is as effective, or more effective than traditional diadactic courses?
    It's a meta-analysis so its results have very strong reliability.

    http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/ijpbl/vol3/iss1/4/

    Quote from the paper:
    Findings indicated that PBL was superior when it comes to long-term retention, skill development and satisfaction of students and teachers, while traditional approaches were more effective for short-term retention as measured by standardized board exams. Implications are discussed.
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    (Original post by .eXe)
    It's a meta-analysis so its results have very strong reliability.

    http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/ijpbl/vol3/iss1/4/

    Quote from the paper:
    Thanks that's really insightful

    I would also add that the course I have an offer for is a mixture of PBL Lectures and and clinical skills from the outset so Hopefully i will get the best of both worlds
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    (Original post by OSharp)
    Thats not exactly a compelling argument.

    Sounds more like hearsay to me.
    PBL is a bunch of ****e, imo.

    And whoever said that about wiki is right. I tell you the truth, the vast majority of our PBLs were done the night before off wikipedia/emedicine/patient.co.uk. If I was really cutting it fine I would skim the relevant page in the OHCM on the tube in the way in and blag it during the debrief. Half the time the facilitator didn't care anyway, such as a psychologist leading an obstetrics and gynaecology session. Couldn't answer any of our questions that were not on his preprinted 'tutor notes' (subsequently ended up on a website with everyone feverishly trying to copy what we were actually supposed to know which was often vastly different from what we actually covered)

    I did very well in my first year, got a Merit. Missed a merit by a few marks in my OSCE component (whoever would have thought a second year would be expected to do clinical medicine :facepalm:) but got the equivalent marks for a merit in my written papers.

    The gaps in my knowledge from my 'PBL based' course only came out two years later working for the USMLE Step 1 which was a slap in the face. A friend of mine in the year below, just done an iBSc, is working towards Step 1 now, a good student like me. He is currently at failing standard for Step 1, an exam designed to be taken after the second year of medical school.
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    (Original post by .eXe)
    It's a meta-analysis so its results have very strong reliability.
    Since when did meta analysis = de facto strong reliability?
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    (Original post by OSharp)
    -
    Personally, I favour it. However, I wouldn't like a medical degree dominated by it and instead prefer to do PBL in my own time to consolidate my learning.
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    (Original post by digitalis)
    Since when did meta analysis = de facto strong reliability?
    Out of interest where did you study?
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    (Original post by OSharp)
    Out of interest where did you study?
    In my signature.
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    (Original post by digitalis)
    In my signature.
    for some reason TSR doesnt show me sigs despite the fact i have asked it to
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    (Original post by OSharp)
    for some reason TSR doesnt show me sigs despite the fact i have asked it to
    Barts
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    (Original post by xXxBaby-BooxXx)
    My course doesn't.
    It must do, What differentiates year 2 from year 3 then?

    With us year 3 is spent on a clinical attachment/rotation for 4/5 days per week, where as in year two we have one day per case.
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    (Original post by carcinoma)
    It must do, What differentiates year 2 from year 3 then?

    With us year 3 is spent on a clinical attachment/rotation for 4/5 days per week, where as in year two we have one day per case.
    Year 2 we do haem, derm, cardio and resp (with a bit of vascular and stroke) and year three we do endocrine, GI, renal, urology, neurology, ENT, opthalmology :p:

    Year 1 was intro module and rheum and ortho, year 4 is paeds and obs and gynae, year 5 is psych and emergency care.

    The only thing that differs year to year is what we learn, not how we learn it.

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Updated: March 30, 2012
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