[patrickinator]

Should the UK government leave the UE? Your thoughts...

[Classical Liberal]

We should be in the fast lane of Europe travelling at 15mph.

[Pearl Lake]

Yes and then our economy and global power will really rival that of India, Brazil etc! Sure we could be an off-shore switzerland.. or we could be an integral part of the most dynamic economic zone on earth..

[chrisawhitmore]

(Original post by Pearl Lake)
Yes and then our economy and global power will really rival that of India, Brazil etc! Sure we could be an off-shore switzerland.. or we could be an integral part of the most dynamic economic zone on earth..

Are you suggesting that the EU is good for economies? Facts would suggest otherwise. If you take the 15 pre-2004 EU states as a group, their share of global GDP has dropped by 10% from 1974-2009, and is set to drop a further 10% (on the EU's own figures) by 2020. To provide a comparison, the USA increased its share by just under half a percent across the same period.

What Britain really needs is to be able to negotiate trade deals directly with BRICS countries and the commonwealth rather than having to go through the EU, so that we can get the deal that serves British interests, not those of Brussels.

[Gales]

Re: Should the UK leave the European Union?

(Original post by Pearl Lake)
Yes

(Original post by chrisawhitmore)
Are you suggesting that the EU is good for economies? Facts would suggest otherwise. If you take the 15 pre-2004 EU states as a group, their share of global GDP has dropped by 10% from 1974-2009, and is set to drop a further 10% (on the EU's own figures) by 2020. To provide a comparison, the USA increased its share by just under half a percent across the same period.

What Britain really needs is to be able to negotiate trade deals directly with BRICS countries and the commonwealth rather than having to go through the EU, so that we can get the deal that serves British interests, not those of Brussels.

Can't read?

[Morgsie]

Not Another UK/EU pulling out thread.

WE should remain in the EU.

[FrogInABog]

Europe as a whole has gone way past what it should be. While I know that the EU only encompasses some of that, most people use 'EU' to refer to everything to do with European bureaucracy.

It should exist merely as a common market, where free trade is easy and encouraged. We do not need a system that tries to impose itself on others, tying every member state up in an enormous tangle of legislation and red tape. It could be beneficial for our economy, but as it is, we are unable to do anything to improve our situation without first running it past a man from Belgium.

I am a self-confessed Eurosceptic, and while I will admit that free trade and the common market can bring wealth and prosperity to all involved, European level law-making and general interference won't help anything except the egos of a few irritating self-obsessed people like Herman van Rompuy, Jose Manuel Barroso, and Baroness Ashton.

While I'm on the subject, why does the EU even have a Foreign Affairs person? Brussels is just as foreign to the UK as Timbuktu, so why on earth do they presume to say otherwise?!

Edit: just realised I haven't properly answered the question... It would, at this stage, be unwise to pull out of Europe, as I don't think we would be allowed to remain merely as part of the Common Market. They're attitude seems to be in or out, and as we would probably lose when out, we should stay in. All we can hope is that the leaders of the EU nations get a bit of backbone and start properly demanding the withdrawal of legislative powers.

[Llamageddon]

Never get bored of the rhetoric

no, really.

[chrisawhitmore]

(Original post by Gales)
Re: Should the UK leave the European Union?






Can't read?

Sorry, the rest of the comment sounded like sarcasm.

[monk_keys]

(Original post by chrisawhitmore)
Are you suggesting that the EU is good for economies? Facts would suggest otherwise. If you take the 15 pre-2004 EU states as a group, their share of global GDP has dropped by 10% from 1974-2009, and is set to drop a further 10% (on the EU's own figures) by 2020. To provide a comparison, the USA increased its share by just under half a percent across the same period.

What Britain really needs is to be able to negotiate trade deals directly with BRICS countries and the commonwealth rather than having to go through the EU, so that we can get the deal that serves British interests, not those of Brussels.

Seems simplistic. This data also disagrees (based on ppp) the USA, Germany, UK France, Japan have all lost in share of GDP to most BRIC countries, which makes sense.

http://www.econstats.com/weo/V012.htm

[nicknick1]

The UK should leave the EU. It is a complete disaster for the UK which results in uncontrollable immigration, a big transfer of wealth from the UK, exposure to the unstable Euro credit risks, no control of our own legislation and mad Human Rights situations such as not being able to deport terrorists. With the prospect of Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria joining the EU, why would be want to leave the doors open for potentially millions of poor immigrants, who will also complete with our young people on the job markets. It makes no sense.

[Psyk]

(Original post by nicknick1)
The UK should leave the EU. It is a complete disaster for the UK which results in uncontrollable immigration, a big transfer of wealth from the UK, exposure to the unstable Euro credit risks, no control of our own legislation and mad Human Rights situations such as not being able to deport terrorists. With the prospect of Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria joining the EU, why would be want to leave the doors open for potentially millions of poor immigrants, who will also complete with our young people on the job markets. It makes no sense.

Are you posting from 2003? Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria joined the EU 8 years ago.

[Rakas21]

Of the contrary, No!

While i accept that the European Union in its current state needs democratic reform the fact is that the Eurozone contained within is the largest market on the planet and as such the potential benefits if managed correctly are huge (like dangling gold bullion in our faces).

Other than the political reform what we need to see is CAP scrapped and CFP reformed. We need an integrated common transport and energy policy and greater legal harmonization.

The time to ask the population whether they want to be in or out is not now. Over the next twenty years i see a great deal of further integration within Europe and at some point the EU will declare itself a full federal state. Once it does so, that is when the UK should ask itself whether it wishes to be 'in' or 'out'.

[Time Tourist]

Question should be phrased other way round.

Who remembers when Dave said this?



Lying tosser.

[chrisawhitmore]

(Original post by monk_keys)
Seems simplistic. This data also disagrees (based on ppp) the USA, Germany, UK France, Japan have all lost in share of GDP to most BRIC countries, which makes sense.

http://www.econstats.com/weo/V012.htm

To be honest I'm not sure how the PPP adjustment works, my data is based on GDP share only. The data sets may be found here, but can be summarized by a USA growth of 0.4% from 1969-2009 and an EU15 drop of 9-10% over the same time.

EDIT Sorry, somehow forgot the link
http://www.ers.usda.gov/Data/Macroeconomics/

[Bukhatir]

I think its got a bigger problem @ home read more here

[nicknick1]

(Original post by Psyk)
Are you posting from 2003? Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria joined the EU 8 years ago.

I should have said, if they have unrestricted membership it would be a disaster because we would have large amounts of labour immigration which we just don't need.

[Snagprophet]

I would've mind being in it if if didn't decide our laws, did not decide how we catch fish or force immigration on us.

[Cheese_Monster]

No, but the current structure isn't working either.

Not for fictional aspects like 'parliamentary sovereignty' but because the emphasis is increasingly on supranationalism rather than intergovernmentalism. Proposed reforms, if carried out, should rectify the democratic deficit within Europe and rebalance powers with national Parliaments. This is the solution.

Not OMG let's pull out now. That would be great for trade with Europe...

[Herr]

Leave? No.

I think it should play an active role in reforming the EU and making it significantly more accountable plus address the democratic and fiscal deficit that goes on within the EU.

But first and foremost I think there should be a clear IN or OUT referendum.