[Liam_G]

I'm a little shocked by some of the responses on this thread, and I'll probably get a lot of neg for this post, seeing as I disagree with most of you, but I don't really care.

(Original post by Rybee)
100% Agree. I think it's quite sick. We had 1 kid at school who's mum was a lesbian and he got bullied to **** for it. Would never wish a guy to have 2 gay blokes as his 'parents'... as much as you could ever sugar coat it, he'd get bullied 24/7 for it. That's how it works in the real world, not the cotton wool world most people of TSR seem to think exists...

You think it's sick? I think your attitude is quite sick if I'm honest. If people are being bullied, it's the bullies that are the problem. Stop trying to treat the symptom and not the cause.

It's fine for people to grow up in single-parent households, but having two parents of the same sex is sickening? I think it's strange how people believe that because there happens to be a person in one couple who has a vagina, they're automatically going to be better parents than a same sex couple would be.

I'm not saying that I want children when I'm older, but knowing that the majority of people automatically think I'm an unfit parent because of my sexuality is something that honestly depresses me. I'd be a ****ing great parent if I ever had the chance, and I know that if I ever had a child, I'd provide a better standard of care for that child than many of the sorry excuses for parents you see today manage to.

Not so long ago it was absolutely unthinkable for there to be interracial couples, and for them to marry and have children. If I edited your post slightly, it'll show you an opinion that seems appaling now, but was perfectly acceptable in this country in the not so distant past:

(Original post by Rybee)
100% Agree. I think it's quite sick. We had 1 kid at school who's mum was a black woman and he got bullied to **** for it. Would never wish a guy to have a black person as one of his 'parents'... as much as you could ever sugar coat it, he'd get bullied 24/7 for it. That's how it works in the real world, not the cotton wool world most people of TSR seem to think exists...

Yes, that is how it worked in the real world, but the real world changed, and I hope it changes again.

If I don't get the chance to be a parent in my lifetime, so be it, these things shouldn't be rushed, but I sincerely hope that peoples attitudes change in the future.

[Tommyjw]

(Original post by Zangoose)
Up to now you have no proof and no leg to stand on with regards to countering my argument. Nicely done, kiddo.

Third time. You not being u to the task of reading sources does not mean there is no proof.

You have no proof either, Tommay boyy

Except for all the studies you have seen and many you have ignored because you 'cba and somehow in your oh so intelligent mind ignoring sources means they dont exist :L

Dont know why i try, your initial post clearly showed you were a clueless ignorant fool, ah well, your loss, just dont have kids please.

[KJane]

Yes it should be allowed. There are already plenty of same sex parents, couples who break up and one parent starts dating someone of the same sex, IVF and sperm donors etc. I don't see why we should bother preventing adoption for gay couples, don't put off potential parents from adopting when so many need a home.

As for bullying, kids get bullied for a range of reasons, big skinny/fat, tall/short, how they speak, their teeth, their nose etc, I don't think it's a valid enough reason to prevent a child from being raised by a same sex couple, I'm sure most children would rather have a stable loving family and be bullied than the other way around, and you can stop bullying. You can't even be sure they will get bullied, but if we preventing people from having kids on the off chance their children might get bullied, there'd be a lot more childless couples.

[wildcolonialboy]

(Original post by silent ninja)
Isn't that the question asked in the thread title: should same sex parenting be allowed?

Actually that is the implicit question. There are already children who have gay parents. Unless you're proposing to sic to take these children away from their parents, "allowed" has nothing to do with it.

It's part of human identity to have a male and a female parent.

So people who grow up in single-parent households are not human?

Whether they are present doesn't affect the fact that it's in our identity.

A baseless assertion bordering on the nonsensical. Please reread your statement until you understand how empty of meaning it is.

It's not a case of logic and "if it doesn't hurt anyone why not? " mentality.

If children aren't hurt by it, then what is wrong with it?

By that argument what's wrong with incestual marriage

'

A fatuous and highly disingenuous analogy designed to elicit and incite disgust. An incestuous relationship is qualitatively different from a relationship between two consenting non-related adults.

It's incestuous, by the way. If you can't spell it properly, why should we consider your views on it in any way credible?

and kids after screening?

I have no idea what "kids after screening" is.

You have to draw the line somewhere.

Except that Christians and organised religions have got that line wrong over and over and over again, and continually have to revise their official dogma to conform with common decency and logic as society becomes more advanced.

Our instincts tell us it's wrong regardless of what some sections of society feed us.

Actually "instinct" does not tell us it's wrong, otherwise all humans would instinctually feel the same way. Do you know what instinct is?

Gay parents can't give birth.

Actually lesbians can give birth, and by that logic adopted parents aren't really parents.

I'd say that's a BIG indicator that they were never meant to be and never should be parents.

So couples who are infertile should be banned from having children? Thank goodness society has advanced to the point where we have the scientific understanding, compassion and common decency to apply medicine to help infertile couples conceive.

[wildcolonialboy]

(Original post by Liam_G)
I'm not saying that I want children when I'm older, but knowing that the majority of people automatically think I'm an unfit parent because of my sexuality is something that honestly depresses me. I'd be a ****ing great parent if I ever had the chance, and I know that if I ever had a child, I'd provide a better standard of care for that child than many of the sorry excuses for parents you see today manage to.

Thankfully our generation of gay men and woman will be the first generation to have real choice when it comes to the decision to have children, and there's nothing the fundies can do about it. Society has moved on, and we're so much the better for it.

[wildcolonialboy]

(Original post by Rybee)
I don't have a mum and I crave more than anything to have that motherly figure back in my life.

Please stop taking out your frustrations and psychopathologies on other people. I assure you in all sincerity that psychological help will heal that wound far better than bashing gays ever can.

[KJane]

(Original post by Rybee)
No I don't think it's fine growing up in single-parent households. I don't have a mum and I crave more than anything to have that motherly figure back in my life. It's not ideal, but it's better than my dad being gay with another bloke. **** that.

But what would your mum have given you that a gay couple can't give their children?

[Rybee]

(Original post by KJane)
But what would your mum have given you that a gay couple can't give their children?

Motherly love.

[wildcolonialboy]

(Original post by Rybee)
Motherly love.

Lesbians can't give their children motherly love?

[innerhollow]

(Original post by Liam_G)
I'm not saying that I want children when I'm older, but knowing that the majority of people automatically think I'm an unfit parent because of my sexuality is something that honestly depresses me. I'd be a ****ing great parent if I ever had the chance, and I know that if I ever had a child, I'd provide a better standard of care for that child than many of the sorry excuses for parents you see today manage to.

Would be inclined to side with this. I know I'd be a ****ing awesome father, but face lots of difficulties with regards to this, compared to all those ****ing loser deadbeat dads out there who are allowed to progenerate like plague rats.

[KJane]

(Original post by Rybee)
Motherly love.

Then by that logic, a lesbian couple could give twice the 'motherly love' than one. What's the difference between fatherly and motherly love anyway? I highly doubt there is anything a gay couple cannot give a child that a straight couple can.

[escape]

[QUOTE=Zangoose;36895157]Fair enough. Which periods and societies in particular, were openly accepting of homosexuality? I'm ignorant of that and I could do with some awareness.
QUOTE]

The Greeks
The Romans

They're the two that come to mind immediately. Forgive me if at 2.10am I'm too tired to research this.

[ncsoftlover]

[QUOTE=escape;36895429]

(Original post by Zangoose)
Fair enough. Which periods and societies in particular, were openly accepting of homosexuality? I'm ignorant of that and I could do with some awareness.
QUOTE]

The Greeks
The Romans

They're the two that come to mind immediately. Forgive me if at 2.10am I'm too tired to research this.

Chinese never had a history of prosecuting gay people either.
as for which period and societies in particular? how about today, in most developed nations.

[jimcatinnes]

Are a lot of the arguments used against this not just recycled from single parent families?

[ncsoftlover]

same sex parenting is already a reality in many countries, and UK included.
These countries are functioning just fine, in fact, they maybe the best functioning countries in the world as a whole, most are developed nations at the forefront of human rights development.
This issue will not be an issue in the near future, history and human progression is speaking for itself again.

[JPDub]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/...rticle2226451/

The article above is about studies done on Lesbian parents which have found that they are actually quite successful.

Also, I have a few friends with gay/lesbian parents; none of them are bullied over it and they are all exceptionally normal. It probably happens, of course, but children of straight parents can also get bullied and be outcasts too.

[escape]

Just reading this thread has made me so so angry.

Studies have consistantly shown that children of gay/lesbian parents are no worse off than children with heterosexual parents. Children with separated parents, regardless of their parents's sexual orientation, are the ones society should be worrying about.

I know that I never want to be pregnant, but I want to be a mother. Time will tell whether I choose to adopt/foster a child (with either a male or a female partner - or alone) or whether I have a child biologically with a female partner. But I'll be damned if I am told that I cannot be a parent because of the gender of my partner.

Sexual orientation really should be of no interest to anyone other than the individual. After all, to look at it logically (disregarding societal norms which change with each generation), it makes absolutely no impact on anyone's life other than the individual. I genuinely don't understand why people are so bothered about who strangers are having sex with. The mind boggles.

[silent ninja]

(Original post by wildcolonialboy)
Actually that is the implicit question. There are already children who have gay parents. Unless you're proposing to sic to take these children away from their parents, "allowed" has nothing to do with it.

It shouldn't be allowed in future. Simplez.

So people who grow up in single-parent households are not human?

Do you even know what identity issues are?

A baseless assertion bordering on the nonsensical. Please reread your statement until you understand how empty of meaning it is.

You don't know what identity means so you obviously didn't understand that part.

If children aren't hurt by it, then what is wrong with it?

If incestuous children are healthy, what's wrong with an incestuous relationship? They can be screened for genetic problems before birth right?

A fatuous and highly disingenuous analogy designed to elicit and incite disgust. An incestuous relationship is qualitatively different from a relationship between two consenting non-related adults.

Why draw the line on non-related adults? What's wrong with them being related? WHY? By your logic they are consenting adults.

It's incestuous, by the way. If you can't spell it properly, why should we consider your views on it in any way credible?

Oh yeah, let's dismiss everything based on a mispelling 1.30am at night. Yep. Sorry, i bow to you inifinite intelligence.

I have no idea what "kids after screening" is.

So you've never heard of DNA being screened for defective genes? ...

Actually lesbians can give birth, and by that logic adopted parents aren't really parents.

Naturally? I'd like to see that.
Correcting a defect, such as a couple having difficulty in conceiving (it's a defect because HEALTHY couples are capable of having children), is TOTALLY different to abnormally altering reproductive matter to produce a child (haploidization). The other method is obviously to use sperm from a donor, in which case it's not the lesbian couple's child anyway... either way, a lesbian couple cannot have children.

Adopted parents are based on the traditional family structure. They are usually man and woman.

So couples who are infertile should be banned from having children? Thank goodness society has advanced to the point where we have the scientific understanding, compassion and common decency to apply medicine to help infertile couples conceive.

Again you show your lack of reading comprehension.
Male and female couples have been giving birth forever. Males and females in general give birth. If a couple can't conceive, it's corrective when medicine helps them. In contrast, no gay couple can give birth. That's a big indicator they were never meant to be parents in my opinion.

Science can also do plenty of other nasty things with genetics; just because we can does it mean we should?

[Jackso]

(Original post by silent ninja)
Isn't that the question asked in the thread title: should same sex parenting be allowed?

It's part of human identity to have a male and a female parent. Whether they are present doesn't affect the fact that it's in our identity.

It's not a case of logic and "if it doesn't hurt anyone why not? " mentality. By that argument what's wrong with incestual marriage and kids after screening? You have to draw the line somewhere. Our instincts tell us it's wrong regardless of what some sections of society feed us.

Gay parents can't give birth. I'd say that's a BIG indicator that they were never meant to be and never should be parents.

Doesn't matter whether or not it is a part of our identity; people adapt and evolve over time. That's life. How you can compare raising a child in an incestual marriage to raising one in a homosexual marriage is beyond me. There is a world of difference between a child being adopted by a gay couple or a child having serious health issues due to his biological parents being closely related. Furthermore, being gay isn't a serious mental issue whereas being attracted to a member within your immediate family is definitely alarming.

Using the logic of your last sentence there should be no such thing as single parents either. Yet it is very common and the kids turn out just fine.

[Stevo112]

(Original post by Zangoose)
Okay, so fair enough the gays want marriage but now they want kids too? That's absolutely appalling...

I'm cool with gays getting married and whatnot because once they are married they can do what they do behind closed doors where nobody ever has to be exposed but it's a step too far to consider gay couples having children...

Can you imagine how traumatic that would be for the child? I can think of many reasons on behalf of the kids never to allow that:

• Getting bullied at school...
• Being seen as an outcast amongst mates, possibly leading to bullying (and we all know extreme bullying can lead to suicide)...
• If it's a male + male parentage, there is a big lack of "motherly love" and the type of female nurturing that every child should experience
• If it's a female + female parentage, there is no strong masculine figure for the child to look up to. There's no dad to keep the boy in check or to keep the girl from turning into a slag, so to speak. I'm obviously not saying that fathers can't nurture well and mothers can't be looked up to but it is common knowledge that there's a [somewhat distinguished] line between parental roles with regards to bringing up children
• It's just wrong, full stop

.

(There are many more reasons which I'll mention at request)

If reincarnation is actually real, I thank the high Gods that I was never reincarnated into a family with homosexual parents

I got bullied in school for acting gay despite having opposite sex parents, and despite being straight. Some of my best friends were gay. They also got bullied. Some of my ginger friends got bullied. Some of my friends with special needs got bullied. I do not see why you would be so worried about bullying when the truth of the matter is that a bully gonna bully (or in laymens terms; haters gonna hate) for a large number of reasons!

Any mate who bullies isn't a mate

I would also be interested where you stand with single parents then. Presumably two cocks would be better than one when raising a child! You see, I just think your against homosexuality because I completely believe that you would applaud a single STRAIGHT woman/man raising a child on their own; especially if their partner died or something nasty like that.

To me, homosexual couples would probably bring more stability and love than a single parent and they would generally have a positive influence on their child. Sure the child might pick up some gay tendancies and might even dabble, but the homosexual parents who behave almost entirely similar to hetrosexual ones have very little differences between them!

Every person to themselves I say. Like I can be arsed PC'ing a bunch of gay people! A kid with such a background would always be welcome in any classroom I teach and would probably add to the cultural aspect of the class.