Results are out! Find what you need...fast. Get quick advice or join the chat
Hey there! Sign in to have your say on this topicNew here? Join for free to post

Why are education standards in this country so low?

Announcements Posted on
Applying to Uni? Let Universities come to you. Click here to get your perfect place 20-10-2014
    • Thread Starter
    • 56 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    Title should read: why are attitudes towards education in this country so low?

    The other day I was on the train and I overheard a conversation between a couple of students, I presumed they were studying for the GCSE examinations. Quite frankly I was appalled at what I was hearing:

    * One girl said she only needs "five GCSE grades A*-C" to do hairdressing
    * Another said she is truanting tomorrow
    * Then the third girl said she "loves winding teachers" up and teaching other students a lesson - (whatever that means)

    Note: all at different times during their journey. If I had known what school they attend I would have reported them.

    On the BBC website I came across an article regarding students missing school, one quote I found particularly frightening, "Children who attend school regularly are four times more likely to achieve five or more good GCSEs, including English and maths, than those who are persistently absent" from the Schools Minister (Link to article here. Implying that 4-5 GCSE grades is an achievement.

    I am sure many of you have opinions and acknowledge such incidents, so discuss your thoughts.
    • 22 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    It's the fault of schools that there are kids like this?

    Schools and teachers can only teach those who want to be taught. If the kids aren't going to school with the right attitude, who says it's the education standards that are at fault?
    • 12 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    Some people want to become hairdressers. What's the big deal? If they can cut my hair well, I don't care how many GCSEs they have...
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    To refute your shameful argument, I would just like to ask you to take a look at some of the thousands of posts on this website. Go and take a look at some students responding to pre-1914 literature, or preparing for a mathematics entrance examination, and you will see that, contrary to the biased opinion of yourself, the vile Prime Minister from whom you take your username, and many of the older generation, the education standards in this country have never been higher. As for your derisory statement about hairdressing-- yes, there are many people who merely choose hairdressing as a soft option, and there is a saturation of vocational candidates for such qualifications. But that doesn't mean to say that pursuing a vocational course is wrong or less meritable than someone who goes and does a Maths degree. Who are you to define what constitutes 'success'?
    • 10 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    Quite frankly I was appalled at what I was hearing:
    Cherry picking and coming up to the conclusion our whole educational standards is bad because of it? Not the most intelligent of arguments is it.

    You do realize what you are speaking of is the persons attitude to teaching, not the actual teaching standard like you think it is? Atleast try and use common sense.

    Implying that 4-5 GCSE grades is an achievement.
    When the difference is either getting those GCSEs which then thus help for college and such, and not getting them, then yes it is an 'achievement'
    • Thread Starter
    • 56 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Drewski)
    It's the fault of schools that there are kids like this?

    Schools and teachers can only teach those who want to be taught. If the kids aren't going to school with the right attitude, who says it's the education standards that are at fault?
    Should have clarifed: not the point about truanting, just how they view 4-5 GCSEs as an achievement and encouraging students to just get Cs, whilst ignoring students with higher aspirations.

    Of course it needs to be up to the student, it's just the attitude some schools have and the lack of discipline.
    • 9 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I thought this was going to be about the actual content of the education.

    When I first came to England I could barely speak English so I couldn't really pass anything other than maths, and the maths was absolutely laughable. I received consistent 90-100% grades without trying. The other Polish and Indian students agreed with me that the level of maths was very low.

    I think they make the grades easy to achieve so that they could say that there's a higher pass rate.
    • 3 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I don't understand why the aim is to get 5 A*-C grades. That's such a low bar it's ridiculous, the children of this country need to be pushed more.
    • 22 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Temmychan)
    To refute your shameful argument, I would just like to ask you to take a look at some of the thousands of posts on this website. Go and take a look at some students responding to pre-1914 literature, or preparing for a mathematics entrance examination, and you will see that, contrary to the biased opinion of yourself, the vile Prime Minister from whom you take your username, and many of the older generation, the education standards in this country have never been higher. As for your derisory statement about hairdressing-- yes, there are many people who merely choose hairdressing as a soft option, and there is a saturation of vocational candidates for such qualifications. But that doesn't mean to say that pursuing a vocational course is wrong or less meritable than someone who goes and does a Maths degree. Who are you to define what constitutes 'success'?
    To be fair, that is a highly debatable point. Are the standards higher now or do we artificially make them higher? I personally don't believe people are any more or less intelligent than they have been at any other point in living memory.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    Sometimes I do think that parents from lower class social backgrounds rely on schools to teach their children everything - from manners to education and that parents should not have to do it at home. I'm sure there is some study out there showing the benefits of parents carrying on the learning process after school (eg reading at bed time, actively helping with homework, promoting knowledge etc) compared to those that don't do these things with children.

    Maybe standards would be higher if parents or the home environment encouraged learning, which then gets transferred to school environments. The reason why it should not be the other way around is that when attending a school, you are ready to learn. The school should not have to teach some of its students why they should be learning - that comes from home!
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Drewski)
    To be fair, that is a highly debatable point. Are the standards higher now or do we artificially make them higher? I personally don't believe people are any more or less intelligent than they have been at any other point in living memory.
    I'm not saying that people are more or less intelligent-- on the contrary, intelligence overall has been mostly constant. What I'm commenting on is the teaching standards. 50 years ago, teaching was a pretty standard 'here is a thing, learn this thing, now' approach. Now, we have a much wider understanding of how young people learn, what helps them to learn, the 'types' of learner, allowing those who struggle very badly to be helped in their own way, but people who are of higher ability to also be taught how to stretch themselves.
    • 22 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    Should have clarifed: not the point about truanting, just how they view 4-5 GCSEs as an achievement and encouraging students to just get Cs, whilst ignoring students with higher aspirations.

    Of course it needs to be up to the student, it's just the attitude some schools have and the lack of discipline.
    Don't know how you made that jump. But of course, you're just being reactionary deliberately to try to make a point. Badly.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    It makes me cry when people say the education system failed them. Put the effort in and I'm sure it wont.
    • 10 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    The other day I was on the train and I overheard a conversation between a couple of students, I presumed they were studying for the GCSE examinations. Quite frankly I was appalled at what I was hearing:

    * One girl said she only needs "five GCSE grades A*-C" to do hairdressing
    * Another said she is truanting tomorrow
    * Then the third girl said she "loves winding teachers" up and teaching other students a lesson - (whatever that means)

    Note: all at different times during their journey. If I had known what school they attend I would have reported them.

    On the BBC website I came across an article regarding students missing school, one quote I found particularly frightening, "Children who attend school regularly are four times more likely to achieve five or more good GCSEs, including English and maths, than those who are persistently absent" from the Schools Minister (Link to article here. Implying that 4-5 GCSE grades is an achievement.

    I am sure many of you have opinions and acknowledge such incidents, so discuss your thoughts.
    I got a 2:2 from Brunel in film and tv studies, so we're not ALL thick.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I think its funny.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I really don't know know what happened. I was surprised to learn they had foundation / higher streams for GCSE, & beyond shocked at the content of foundation maths- what time is it on the clock?... arrange in ascending order? this is the stuff of 8-10yrs olds.
    It is no wonder when kids come from the UK to school in my country they often put them in 2 classes below their age. Our GCSE maths is AS level Maths. & if you don't pass all the compulsory subjects you will be made to repeat the year again and again until you do.
    • 5 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    - Lack of discipline

    - Lack of work ethic

    - Lack of ambitions

    - Lack of pressure
    • 8 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I think a lot of it comes from parents.

    While I'm from a working class background, my mother's childhood was very focused around education. She went to a military school in Pakistan and it was very disciplined. I've grown up to be very focused on studying.

    Whereas a friend of mine who is from the same economic background didn't get her 5 A*-C grades and has had kids instead. Her failed childhood was not her fault though. She was too busy taking care of her two younger sisters and younger brother because her father was always working and her mother was always drunk to turn up to school in the first place. I only ever saw her about once a week.
    • 6 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    Well firstly no one should be thought down upon because they want to be hairdressers. Yes it's not academic but we all use hairdressers from time to time and at least it's a career that they can have for life instead of being on and off benefits flitting from job to job.

    As for the education standards being so low.The fact a school has to get amount of passes or get somewhere on a league table in order to get funding doesn't work. It just means teachers don't teach a subject properly and just teach them how to pass exams or like in my school they knew they needed 70% of students to pass their GCSE's in order to receive funding so openly focused on the top 70%, who they knew would get the grades, and ignored the ones who were struggling. Then of course bad schools get worse because of lack of decent facilities.

    Secondly, way too much emphasis on getting truants back into school. If they don't want to be there then that's their problem. Maybe a call to social services to make sure no family issues or abuse is stopping them from going to school would be better. If it's just a case of someone not wanting to be in school forcing them there, against their will, is not going to make them learn and it usually result in more behavioral problems.

    It's difficult to expel unruly students. Teachers have to jump through hoop after hoop to get rid of one trouble maker who disrupts a whole class. Likewise with bad teachers. If they're not cut out for the job they shouldn't be in it and should be given a chance to do something else.

    Ofsted. I'm not against the whole idea of Ofsted but their criteria from what I hear is a bit ridiculous. Like focusing on how well a teacher uses a powerpoint or how well they incorporate games and have aims and starters. Teachers should be judged solely on how much the class learns when in their lesson as long as pupils learn what they're supposed to what does it matter how they learnt it?

    Yeah so that's my two pennies worth.
    • 10 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I don't think you can blame everything on the school - some children/students are just really difficult to teach. I have to say, I think that a significant part is parenting standards - parents are responsible for the primary socialisation of kids, it's primarily their responsibility to set them on the straight and narrow. By the time a child reaches secondary school, it's far more difficult to instill a certain attitude in them.

Reply

Submit reply

Register

Thanks for posting! You just need to create an account in order to submit the post
  1. this can't be left blank
    that username has been taken, please choose another Forgotten your password?
  2. this can't be left blank
    this email is already registered. Forgotten your password?
  3. this can't be left blank

    6 characters or longer with both numbers and letters is safer

  4. this can't be left empty
    your full birthday is required
  1. By joining you agree to our Ts and Cs, privacy policy and site rules

  2. Slide to join now Processing…

Updated: April 13, 2012
New on TSR

Submitting your UCAS application

How long did it take for yours to be processed?

Article updates
Useful resources
Reputation gems:
You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.