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How do you feel about pop music?

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    Pop has been a great genre in the past *cough* The Beatles *cough*

    But today's pop? Trash.
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    (Original post by HighwayUnicorn)
    *braces for loads of negs*

    I genuinely enjoy Lady Gaga. She writes her own lyrics, co-produced almost all her songs, can sing well and can play the piano (and not just one or two melodies she can really play it).

    But I cannot tell whether she stands out from among the crowd because she is actually good or because everyone else is so mediocre...
    I enjoy her to an extent as well, and for me to say that about any modern pop music is something.

    It's a shame though that it has come to the point where writing one's own songs is the exception and not the rule.
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    (Original post by j.alexanderh)
    Yes, I agree that music may need to be listened to more than once to be appreciated. But it is not about more than how it sounds. One might shed some interesting light on music by looking at contexts and so forth, and reinterpret the sounds in light of external information, but it's still ultimately about the sound. If there is no real distinction in sound between a song written by its performers and a song written by someone other than its performers it makes no sense to dislike it on musical grounds. Learning that song X was written on commission from a freelance writer doesn't allow for reinterpretation of the music in the same way that learning that an instrumental piece of music is based on Romeo and Juliet allows reinterpretation of that piece on further hearings. The only change it can make to your listening experience is extra-musical. You might think, 'the artists isn't singing about his feelings' or something like that.

    The 'logic' seems similar to that behind a phenomenon from classical music; occasionally it turns out that a previously popular work attributed to some big name was actually written by an obscure also-ran, and suddenly no-one wants to listen to it anymore. It all indicates that many 'listeners' are actually more interested in the people behind the music than music itself. You want to admire the musicians and not the music. Would the songs of Johnny Cash lose their expressive qualities if it turned out that someone else had written them all along? Of course not.
    A song can sound 'pleasant' just like dinky music in an elevator, but I wouldn't have any respect for the performing musician if they didn't write it. They're reduced to the status of just an instrument. It severely reduces the impact of it.

    My enjoyment of music is extra-musical. The kind of music I like is socially conscious, and is accompanied by strong ideologies, responses current affairs, artworks and communities. I listen to it like I'd listen to the speeches of a great politician - Hitler was always applauded to be a strong orator, but you wouldn't keep listening to his speeches for their oratory merit alone when the entire ideology behind it and the man himself was a cretin.
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    (Original post by screenager2004)
    A song can sound 'pleasant' just like dinky music in an elevator, but I wouldn't have any respect for the performing musician if they didn't write it. They're reduced to the status of just an instrument.
    So you admit that you are more interested in the musicians than the music? And that strikes you as okay?

    It severely reduces the impact of it.
    Except it doesn't? You cannot hear the difference between a piece written by the performers and a piece not written by the performers.

    My enjoyment of music is extra-musical. The kind of music I like is socially conscious, and is accompanied by strong ideologies, responses current affairs, artworks and communities. I listen to it like I'd listen to the speeches of a great politician - Hitler was always applauded to be a strong orator, but you wouldn't keep listening to his speeches for their oratory merit alone when the entire ideology behind it and the man himself was a cretin.
    Those are not the kind of extra-musical concerns your original post implies. A song written by someone and performed by someone else does not lose any socially conscious message or anything else you've mentioned in the 'transition'. The only concern I can see your OP implying is about the artists themselves - 'does he really feel that way', 'is he a musician worthy of my respect' etc. If I'm wrong please enlighten me, but I can think of no other reason for your objections.


    Often it makes sense to perform music written by someone else. Performing music and writing music are two very different skills. Competence in one is no guarantee of competence in the other. Hence in the tradition of classical music it is extremely common (and necessary in the case of large scale compositions) to write music which one cannot play oneself. Let those trained to write write, and those trained to perform perform.

    I wonder how your ideology would have fared in the days before recorded music. 'When a musician dies, their music is to be consigned to the bins of history because they can't perform it themselves anymore.' Hmm.
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    (Original post by j.alexanderh)
    So you admit that you are more interested in the musicians than the music? And that strikes you as okay?
    Yes precisely that. How is that 'not okay'? Enjoying music is about more than just sound vibrations entering your ear - that's just a crude audio-sensory stimulation. it's a pretty sound. The windows logon chime is a pretty sound, it's empty though.

    Those are not the kind of extra-musical concerns your original post implies. A song written by someone and performed by someone else does not lose any socially conscious message or anything else you've mentioned in the 'transition'. The only concern I can see your OP implying is about the artists themselves - 'does he really feel that way', 'is he a musician worthy of my respect' etc. If I'm wrong please enlighten me, but I can think of no other reason for your objections.
    The message is still there, sure, but the cover artist didn't write it. They might still believe in it, which is just as good I suppose.

    Often it makes sense to perform music written by someone else. Performing music and writing music are two very different skills. Competence in one is no guarantee of competence in the other. Hence in the tradition of classical music it is extremely common (and necessary in the case of large scale compositions) to write music which one cannot play oneself. Let those trained to write write, and those trained to perform perform.
    Performing and writing are two different things - they're two halves of a whole. You can't enjoy a song purely on the performance, it's only half the experience.

    I wonder how your ideology would have fared in the days before recorded music. 'When a musician dies, their music is to be consigned to the bins of history because they can't perform it themselves anymore.' Hmm.
    To be totally honest, I don't like classical music very much. Aesthetically it's very pretty and all, but that's it. You can listen to it when you're too tired to think about music, but pretty noises don't teach me anything new. Doesn't challenge my ideologies and perspectives on life.
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    Usually I ignore lyric if it sounds good but this dosent frequently happen. I'm kind of have no feeling but I can stand them as long as they are not about relationships.
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    (Original post by Miracle Day)


    My personal stance is that if I like a song, regardless of the lyrics, who wrote it etc.. then I like it.
    Me too :five:. I find people who automatically dislike a song just because the singer didn't write it or do deep meanings kinda pathetic tbh.

    In general I do tend to listen to a lot of pop music, although a lot of the new mainstream music that plays on the radio these days doesn't really interest me as much as mainstream music from more previous years, as it seems to have quite declined in quality over time for some reason. Lately, I've been listening to quite a bit of Lemar and Robbie Williams, and really missing how great pop music sounded back then compared to now. I mean, the music industry does still come out with a few new gems like Lana Del Rey and Azealia Banks, but they're amongst a sea of OK but mediocre music.
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    I really hate pop music. It appeals to the lowest common denominator and I think of myself as being above all that nonsense.

    Also, I can do nothing but laugh when people deride pop music and yet say that they like stuff like Muse and Foster The People.
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    (Original post by CherryCherryBoomBoom)
    Me too :five:. I find people who automatically dislike a song just because the singer didn't write it or do deep meanings kinda pathetic tbh.
    Does that mean I'm pathetic because I automatically dislike all generic Britney Spears songs?

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    (Original post by Newbie123)
    Does that mean I'm pathetic because I automatically dislike all generic Britney Spears songs?

    If the only reason you dislike her songs is simply because she doesn't write her own songs, then yeah I find that kinda weird IMO, because how does that affect the overall quality of song anyway? Like some other people have mentioned, whoever made a song shouldn't really make that much of a difference whether a song is good or not. I mean, most of the time I don't feel particularly compelled to search up who wrote a song, I only really care about who sung it and if they sung it good. Some people are simply more gifted at performing and singing, whilst others are more gifted in background stuff like song writing and producing. Everyone simply can't be this super multitalented music person who can perform, sing, rap, dance, write music, play instruments and produce, etc, so working in teams is best for some people in order to create a good end result.

    If it's because her songs don't have deep meaning, then I guess that's OK, but I'm the type of person who doesn't really mind what a song is about first and foremost, and so I don't totally understand those who are so fussed over that stuff but to each their own.

    But if you simply just don't like the songs and music themselves because of how they sound, then I think that's fair enough. We all have different tastes after all. I personally love Britney Spears so I can't really argue on making you like her :p:. But with people like the Beatles, Oasis, and The Smiths, I can see how are talented and stuff, but at the same time I dislike them simply because they're not my sort of thing I like listening to, nothing more, nothing less.
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    (Original post by Dux_Helvetica)
    I really hate pop music. It appeals to the lowest common denominator and I think of myself as being above all that nonsense.

    Also, I can do nothing but laugh when people deride pop music and yet say that they like stuff like Muse and Foster The People.
    Dem idyuts darnt lark mah moosics...

    But in all seriousness, most pop doesn't appeal to me, but I refuse to deride those who like it. Those who like bad music within genres I do like is another story altogether.
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    Generally
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    (Original post by screenager2004)
    A song can sound 'pleasant' just like dinky music in an elevator, but I wouldn't have any respect for the performing musician if they didn't write it. They're reduced to the status of just an instrument. It severely reduces the impact of it.

    My enjoyment of music is extra-musical. The kind of music I like is socially conscious, and is accompanied by strong ideologies, responses current affairs, artworks and communities. I listen to it like I'd listen to the speeches of a great politician - Hitler was always applauded to be a strong orator, but you wouldn't keep listening to his speeches for their oratory merit alone when the entire ideology behind it and the man himself was a cretin.
    Do you find Shostakovich's compositions to be valueless now that he is dead?
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    Dem idyuts darnt lark mah moosics...

    But in all seriousness, most pop doesn't appeal to me, but I refuse to deride those who like it. Those who like bad music within genres I do like is another story altogether.
    It's hard to deride everybody who likes pop music because that would involve deriding nearly everybody.
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    (Original post by Dux_Helvetica)
    It's hard to deride everybody who likes pop music because that would involve deriding nearly everybody.
    lmao this actually sounds like a philosophical quote.
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    (Original post by Newbie123)
    lmao this actually sounds like a philosophical quote.
    I guess I shall take that as a compliment then?
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    (Original post by Dux_Helvetica)
    I guess I shall take that as a compliment then?
    Internet caches will forever preserve your musings.
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    (Original post by screenager2004)
    Yes precisely that. How is that 'not okay'? Enjoying music is about more than just sound vibrations entering your ear - that's just a crude audio-sensory stimulation. it's a pretty sound. The windows logon chime is a pretty sound, it's empty though.

    The message is still there, sure, but the cover artist didn't write it. They might still believe in it, which is just as good I suppose.

    Performing and writing are two different things - they're two halves of a whole. You can't enjoy a song purely on the performance, it's only half the experience.
    I think we have reached an impasse here - there's not much more I can do other than repeat that it makes no sense to dislike music on grounds which have nothing do do with its sound. If you can't know it from hearing a piece of music, and knowing it can't affect your listening in any logical way then it shouldn't be an issue. Appreciating music is not about 'respecting musicians', it's about, uh, appreciating music.

    To be totally honest, I don't like classical music very much. Aesthetically it's very pretty and all, but that's it. You can listen to it when you're too tired to think about music, but pretty noises don't teach me anything new. Doesn't challenge my ideologies and perspectives on life.
    I wasn't talking about classical music; there was a popular tradition before recorded music, you know. More than one, in fact.

    (I would also advice caution before writing comments such as yours above; more confrontational souls than me might take exception at the staggering ignorance it displays. You've studied sociology; you must know Adorno. Try reading his critique of popular music. It's interesting and especially relevant to the comments about 'challenging ideologies and perspectives' and 'listening without thinking').
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    I like it
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    I love pop music!

    I also enjoy:
    Metal
    Hip Hop
    Dubstep
    Drum & Bass
    50s
    60s
    Hard Rock
    Dance
    Electro


    Don't go getting stuck on one genre when there are loads out there

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