[chefdave]

(Original post by calumsteele1)
so aside from the fact your figures are horribly skewed, youd just sit by sand watch your family and friends die for some silly notion thats its a war for of money? this may just be a hypothetical but this really is a horrifically selfish answer.
abject poverty? good god sir this is Britain not bloody chad people here wouldnt know poverty if it came and smacked them in the face with a brick of gold.
and as for your comment regarding the land owners being in cahoots with the rich, you do know around 70% of homes in the uk are privately owned? are you saying these millions upon millions of people should all be shot then...?

Please leave friends and family out of this as that wasn't the question posed in the OP. The question was whether I'd put my life at risk to secure Britain's sovereignty, and the answer is a resounding 'No!' for the reasons given above.

While it's true that our new Argentinian overlords may be worse than the current British ones this isn't reason enough to sacrifice my life in pursuit of some imaginery British ideal. This country is rotten to the core and has tossed entire demographics aside so a minority of well placed troughers can benefit disproportionately from the corrupt state largess. Call me crazy and selfish if you will but I have absolutely no intention of fighting to secure such a system, why should I when it's not in my interests?

Fighting over Argentinian or British rule is like a slave actively picking one master in preference to another. I choose none of the above.

[calumsteele1]

(Original post by chefdave)
Please leave friends and family out of this as that wasn't the question posed in the OP. The question was whether I'd put my life at risk to secure Britain's sovereignty, and the answer is a resounding 'No!' for the reasons given above.

While it's true that our new Argentinian overlords may be worse than the current British ones this isn't reason enough to sacrifice my life in pursuit of some imaginery British ideal. This country is rotten to the core and has tossed entire demographics aside so a minority of well placed troughers can benefit disproportionately from the corrupt state largess. Call me crazy and selfish if you will but I have absolutely no intention of fighting to secure such a system, why should I when it's not in my interests?

Fighting over Argentinian or British rule is like a slave actively picking one master in preference to another. I choose none of the above.

sorry if i didnt explicitly mention it it was inferred however.
well thats your opinion and youre entitlted to it, funnily a right guarenteed to us by this 'rotten' country, just sayin'

but i do believe youre putting way to much stress on the evils of this country and putting a certain hyperbole around them on top of that, this country may have its flaws but compared to places like DPRK, PRC, DPRC etc. etc. we live like gods..

[Dwayne Hicks]

(Original post by ckingalt)
I think the amount of negative responses is disappointing. To be British and not fight for Britain is pathetic. Leave if you feel your home is not worthy of defense. I am American and I am ex-military. I have fought, and British soldiers have fought along side with me. I don't care if your population has contempt for me or my nation. The politics is inconsequential to me. Great Britain is an ally that has supported the U.S.. I would fight to defend Great Britain because a promise has been made and a debt is owed. I would fight for Britain because my honor demands it, and so should yours.

We are all very impressed by your code of honour. But not everyone is going to give their lives to defend 2 countries with enough innocent blood on their hands and against a non-existent enemy. If only we could all be as blind as you...

[noisy06]

(Original post by ckingalt)
I think the amount of negative responses is disappointing. To be British and not fight for Britain is pathetic. Leave if you feel your home is not worthy of defense. I am American and I am ex-military. I have fought, and British soldiers have fought along side with me. I don't care if your population has contempt for me or my nation. The politics is inconsequential to me. Great Britain is an ally that has supported the U.S.. I would fight to defend Great Britain because a promise has been made and a debt is owed. I would fight for Britain because my honor demands it, and so should yours.

Let me tell you something, if every nation had this disgusting American mentality of just fighting other people no matter what the reason and calling this "loyalty" and "honour" and "dignity", the world would be in perpetual warfare.

[nmudz_009]

Id fight to protect my home/family/friends, but I wouldn't lay down my life anonymously on a politician's orders, no way in hell. I can't do that for something I don't personally believe in.

[Notethis]

(Original post by Dwayne Hicks)
We are all very impressed by your code of honour. But not everyone is going to give their lives to defend 2 countries with enough innocent blood on their hands and against a non-existent enemy. If only we could all be as blind as you...

It's a hypothetical situation. For an enemy invaded, they would have to exist, and they would unlikely be innocent.
Learn to comprehension.

[orcprocess]

Not particularly for Britain but if we were morally right (e.g. WW2) then yes I would hope I would.

[cgraham15]

(Original post by Moa)
On the surface it seems like a decent argument. But it is not.


America was created by people holding more or less same values. Other cultures and races were crushed and/or enslaved. There was no culture, race or religious clash

Poll may be a little bit extreme. But I wonder how many of people living in UK truly identify themselves with the country.

Actually, before the civil war many of the Irish and German Catholic immigrants (who came in their millions) clashed very much with the mostly Protestant Americans. So yeah, you're kinda wrong mate.

[cgraham15]

If we were being invaded then I would fight for sure. We live in this country and it would be an insult if anyone was not prepared to protect it.
However, if our government was shooting people on the streets, for example minorities like the nazi's did, then that's a different story.

[chefdave]

(Original post by calumsteele1)
sorry if i didnt explicitly mention it it was inferred however.
well thats your opinion and youre entitlted to it, funnily a right guarenteed to us by this 'rotten' country, just sayin'

but i do believe youre putting way to much stress on the evils of this country and putting a certain hyperbole around them on top of that, this country may have its flaws but compared to places like DPRK, PRC, DPRC etc. etc. we live like gods..

Irrespective of our international socio-economic status I still don't see the point in securing the country only to hand it over to a cartel of state backed landlords, landowners and homeowners, it's their country not mine, so it stands to reason that they can do most of the fighting. It's a curious quirk of human nature that the poor often take up arms to defend an economic order that continuously bleeds them dry during peacetime.

[noisy06]

(Original post by Moa)
On the surface it seems like a decent argument. But it is not.


America was created by people holding more or less same values. Other cultures and races were crushed and/or enslaved. There was no culture, race or religious clash there.

And I think that is the main thing that makes people say that this country is not worth saving. It is just that UK is no longer like it was not so long ago, now this country looks like a patchwork of cultures that I think effectively kills the notion of country itself.

Poll may be a little bit extreme. But I wonder how many of people living in UK truly identify themselves with the country.

The US are far more "multi-cultural" than Great Britain, and yet they are as a whole more patriotic (even imperialistic). They are also more advanced in many aspects most important of which is militaristic and innovation.

[calumsteele1]

(Original post by chefdave)
Irrespective of our international socio-economic status I still don't see the point in securing the country only to hand it over to cartel of state backed landlords, landowners and homeowners, it's their country not mine, so it stands to reason that they can do most of the fighting. It's a curious quirk of human nature that the poor often take up arms to defend an economic order that continuously bleeds them dry during peacetime.

is this the same poor who have all their needs catered for them by the state and the de facto 'rich' through benefits and the like...?
the broader jist of the thread wasnt about purely economic reasons it was more for defending the people and the country you love such as during ww1/ww2 and the like

[chefdave]

(Original post by calumsteele1)
is this the same poor who have all their needs catered for them by the state and the de facto 'rich' through benefits and the like...?
the broader jist of the thread wasnt about purely economic reasons it was more for defending the people and the country you love such as during ww1/ww2 and the like

I would certainly consider fighting for a reformed Britain, but all the time we're propping up a failed economic regime with Bank of England funny money and deporting our own people to the U.S for trifling 'crimes' while protecting the rights of foreign terrorists here I have to say that on balance I couldn't give two hoots about British values.

Give me something to fight for and I'll consider fighting for it. Currently though Britain is a disgrace.

[calumsteele1]

(Original post by chefdave)
I would certainly consider fighting for a reformed Britain, but all the time we're propping up a failed economic regime with Bank of England funny money and deporting our own people to the U.S for trifling 'crimes' while protecting the rights of foreign terrorists here I have to say that on balance I couldn't give two hoots about British values.

Give me something to fight for and I'll consider fighting for it. Currently though Britain is a disgrace.

i'll agree with you on that some of the policies being employed by this government of jackanapes are disgraceful but none the less me personally at least if this beautiful nation were threatened id still answer the call, who knows might be able to do what the americans dad in vietnam and employ a little 'fragging'

[FranticMind]

I would fight for the UK. But we are fine for the next 20 years or so, America has our back as they wouldn't mind engaging in a bit of profitable conflict.

Although China and Russia can match America's size NO-ONE cannot compete on a technology basis. America is at least 10+ years ahead on ALL military technology AND its with the deployed troops.

We literally get the scraps.

[calumsteele1]

(Original post by Dwayne Hicks)
OH NO! How will I go on in life if calumsteele1 reports me!? Get a life and go ahead and report me again you mentally incompetent spanner.

oh the pain, the pain of it all.

[calumsteele1]

(Original post by FranticMind)
I would fight for the UK. But we are fine for the next 20 years or so, America has our back as they wouldn't mind engaging in a bit of profitable conflict.

Although China and Russia can match America's size NO-ONE cannot compete on a technology basis. America is at least 10+ years ahead on ALL military technology AND its with the deployed troops.

We literally get the scraps.

to be fair to russia and china their tech isnt that far behind the americans, theyve both rolled out new stealth fighters and can both turn america ingto a smoking hole as american can to them.
plus the russias are developing their new 'zombiefying' guns

[ckingalt]

(Original post by Dwayne Hicks)
We are all very impressed by your code of honour. But not everyone is going to give their lives to defend 2 countries with enough innocent blood on their hands and against a non-existent enemy. If only we could all be as blind as you...

(Original post by noisy06)
Let me tell you something, if every nation had this disgusting American mentality of just fighting other people no matter what the reason and calling this "loyalty" and "honour" and "dignity", the world would be in perpetual warfare.

Having no allegiance does not make you enlightened any more than being blindly loyal gives me honor. I know I have honor because I have proven to myself that I can stand by my beliefs even when to do so is unpleasant. I can say the same about my intellect. Can you?

[noisy06]

(Original post by ckingalt)
Having no allegiance does not make you enlightened any more than being blindly loyal gives me honor. I know I have honor because I have proven to myself that I can stand by my beliefs even when to do so is unpleasant. I can say the same about my intellect. Can you?

You're one of those people who'd be the first to sign up as a Nazi concentration camp guard during second world war in the name of the Motherland, isn't that right? You disgust me, I don't even consider you human with that attitude, even cattle have a better sense of right and wrong.

[calumsteele1]

(Original post by ras90)
No country has sucessfully operated when a relativly indignous population has been "invaded" by other people of other cultures.

america, australia, new zealand, britain etc....