[Davidragon]

(Original post by DarkTitan)
Ooooh...spelling correction...watchout people...we have a badass over here

If you have never told a lie in your life...then you would have reasonable grounds on accusing her of lieing...otherwise you are a hypocrite.

Again not really. Not all lies are equivalent. You're intentionally playing devil's advocate, because by that logic all lies are okay and you can't possibly believe that.

[DarkTitan]

(Original post by Davidragon)
Being convincing might be important, but for Medicine far less so than having integrity of character. Being a convincing liar isn't shouldn't be enough to get in to medical school.

You can't justify things that are wrong by saying other injustice happens. That doesn't make it okay.

It's got everything to do with medicine, being able to convince others, especially in a team is something that is needed, med has alot of presentation work to do with it. She lied? o well boo hoo...but to tell a lie and to pull it off in a uni for med is a feat initself...It shows your able to think underpressure and keep your cool...guess what....something surgeons go through every day.

She obv has the grades to go in, she has the charisma that is needed for med...why all the hate.

[yothi5]

Cheated and got a U and E?

Epic fail.

[DarkTitan]

(Original post by Davidragon)
Again not really. Not all lies are equivalent. You're intentionally playing devil's advocate, because by that logic all lies are okay and you can't possibly believe that.

The problem with this specific thread is that this girl apparently lied. And people going on about how she doesnt deserve the spot because she lied about her skills etc etc...Well if this is true she has the skills for med...why all the hate?

Not all lies are equivalent...but did this lie harm anyone? You can say it got her in and denied someone else of a position...but excuse me while I watch the world go by letting people get infront of me while I work at McD's all my life

[Melikeyflute]

(Original post by Elwyn)
I very much doubt she lied through the whole interview.
If you had actually gone through the application process for medicine you may know how thorough the interview process is and be able to comment on such a thing.

You said it was a white lie and I merely implied that you used the term incorrectly. A white lie is meant to be for the greater good so please could you be so kind as to explain to me how this is for the greater good, as I am clearly so clueless when it comes to the interview process and its thoroughness. By the way, I never stated or implied that she lied a lot.

[jameslad]

Don't be a snitch.
You wouldn't like if it was the other way round ..

[Davidragon]

(Original post by DarkTitan)
It's got everything to do with medicine, being able to convince others, especially in a team is something that is needed, med has alot of presentation work to do with it. She lied? o well boo hoo...but to tell a lie and to pull it off in a uni for med is a feat initself...It shows your able to think underpressure and keep your cool...guess what....something surgeons go through every day.

She obv has the grades to go in, she has the charisma that is needed for med...why all the hate.

I didn't say it isn't relevant, it is just far less important than integrity.

Lying isn't the only way you can show those traits, and it sure as hell isn't the best way

There are going to be plenty of times as a doctor where it would be fair easier just to lie to your patient, or lie to a co worker. As doctor you just can't do that. Dishonesty will destroy trust in the doctor-patient relationship, regardless of how charismatic you are. It's a bad trait in someone who wants to be doctor, where people essentially trust you with their lives.

Plus, in all likelihood there are a lot of other people with "the grades" who would be more deserving, otherwise they wouldn't have been invited to interview.

[Davidragon]

(Original post by DarkTitan)
The problem with this specific thread is that this girl apparently lied. And people going on about how she doesnt deserve the spot because she lied about her skills etc etc...Well if this is true she has the skills for med...why all the hate?

Not all lies are equivalent...but did this lie harm anyone? You can say it got her in and denied someone else of a position...but excuse me while I watch the world go by letting people get infront of me while I work at McD's all my life

You don't need to lie to get ahead, people work hard juggling school and volunteer work etc. who aren't even applying to Medicine. Universities want people who actually have grown from experience, if they just want you sound convincing it would be different.

[Surprises!]

(Original post by jameslad)
Don't be a snitch.
You wouldn't like if it was the other way round ..

I wouldn't lie at my medical school interview, period. Doctors should be honest and trustworthy, and this person doesn't seem to have those qualities, clearly.

[jameslad]

(Original post by Surprises!)
I wouldn't lie at my medical school interview, period. Doctors should be honest and trustworthy, and this person doesn't seem to have those qualities, clearly.

TBH, i'd do anything to get into something i really wanted to do..

[DarkTitan]

(Original post by Davidragon)
I didn't say it isn't relevant, it is just far less important than integrity.

Lying isn't the only way you can show those traits, and it sure as hell isn't the best way

There are going to be plenty of times as a doctor where it would be fair easier just to lie to your patient, or lie to a co worker. As doctor you just can't do that. Dishonesty will destroy trust in the doctor-patient relationship, regardless of how charismatic you are. It's a bad trait in someone who wants to be doctor, where people essentially trust you with their lives.

Plus, in all likelihood there are a lot of other people with "the grades" who would be more deserving, otherwise they wouldn't have been invited to interview.

Med usually lasts 5 years, with the final years being around alot of patients in the field itself. It's not like shes gonna lie for the rest of her life as a doc...shes not even one yet...For her to even be a doc shes gonna have to pass all the exams mmaking sure she knows her stuff...whats she going to lie about then?... Yea its not the best way of showing it, but it got her past the arguably the most hardest stage of med...the getting in.

I'll be honest if i were in her situation id do just the same just to get past the interview..cos gettin in is the only thing thats the hardest.

[DarkTitan]

(Original post by Surprises!)
I wouldn't lie at my medical school interview, period. Doctors should be honest and trustworthy, and this person doesn't seem to have those qualities, clearly.

She's not a doctor...wont be for another 5 years, so you should stop acting as if shes gnna tell a patient they aint got cancer when they do or telling someone theyr gnna be just fine when theyre gnna drop dead the next minute. Doctors should be honest and trustworthy about what? The illness? Shes gnna know them inside out...theres nothing shes gnna need to lie about.

[Surprises!]

(Original post by jameslad)
TBH, i'd do anything to get into something i really wanted to do..

If you already have the work experience, voluntary work and the grades, lying won't necessarily make you a better candidate.

It's also highly likely that your plan will backfire and you'll be caught out if the Admission tutors decide to prob you with a stick

[jameslad]

(Original post by Surprises!)
If you already have the work experience, voluntary work and the grades, lying won't necessarily make you a better candidate.

It's also highly likely that your plan will backfire and you'll be caught out if the Admission tutors decide to prob you with a stick

Fair enough. Just don't snitch, you can't prove it. They'll probably think that you're just jealous ..

Have you got an offer yet by the way?

[Surprises!]

(Original post by DarkTitan)
She's not a doctor...wont be for another 5 years, so you should stop acting as if shes gnna tell a patient they aint got cancer when they do or telling someone theyr gnna be just fine when theyre gnna drop dead the next minute. Doctors should be honest and trustworthy about what? The illness? Shes gnna know them inside out...theres nothing shes gnna need to lie about.

Knowing Gray's Anatomy inside out won't necessarily make you a reputable doctor, now would it?

[Davidragon]

(Original post by DarkTitan)
Med usually lasts 5 years, with the final years being around alot of patients in the field itself. It's not like shes gonna lie for the rest of her life as a doc...shes not even one yet...For her to even be a doc shes gonna have to pass all the exams mmaking sure she knows her stuff...whats she going to lie about then?... Yea its not the best way of showing it, but it got her past the arguably the most hardest stage of med...the getting in.

I'll be honest if i were in her situation id do just the same just to get past the interview..cos gettin in is the only thing thats the hardest.

You're miss understanding me. I'm not saying she'll lie out of ignorance.

Say you have a treatment that you think is perfect for your patient. However, there's a tiny chance of a significant negative side effect. You've got to tell them, even if you think it might mean they refuse treatment.

That's just one example, but the point stands. There are plenty of situations where you'll need to be honest, sometimes even if it isn't what the patient wants to hear. Sometimes you'll think it might even be kinder to lie but you can't, because patient's losing trust in their doctors is a big thing. That's not only for the doctors ego, but in the future patients are less likely to trust your advice, less likely to be open with you about their problems, less likely to adhere to treatments. Lying is a big deal.

[RowingGoose]

I'd say stay out of it. She's the one who lied, and it's only her who will be hurt if they found out. Some people do think we don't like but we just have to let them get on with it, unless they're planning world domination of course.

[DarkTitan]

(Original post by Surprises!)
Knowing Gray's Anatomy inside out won't necessarily make you a reputable doctor, now would it?

Well..would make you a knowledgeable one though :P

[lofaro]

It's true, she might have been exaggerating about how much she lied, or lying to you was actually just exaggerating in the interview. You're her friend though, right? So maybe the most powerful thing you can do is confront her about it. She's not going to give up her place, but she might think twice next time about lying so casually, and I think she deserves that second chance to tell the truth in the future.

[DarkTitan]

(Original post by Davidragon)
You're miss understanding me. I'm not saying she'll lie out of ignorance.

Say you have a treatment that you think is perfect for your patient. However, there's a tiny chance of a significant negative side effect. You've got to tell them, even if you think it might mean they refuse treatment.

That's just one example, but the point stands. There are plenty of situations where you'll need to be honest, sometimes even if it isn't what the patient wants to hear. Sometimes you'll think it might even be kinder to lie but you can't, because patient's losing trust in their doctors is a big thing. That's not only for the doctors ego, but in the future patients are less likely to trust your advice, less likely to be open with you about their problems, less likely to adhere to treatments. Lying is a big deal.

But how can one say a lie 5 years+ ago has an influence post med. If she still does it it would be caught out while at the final years.
Besides, with the way these lawsuits go, i don't think anyone in the right mind would lie to a patient in not telling the side effects.