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Scientific evidence in Islam? Age of the universe, the Big Bang and the Expansion.

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    i was wondering if what he is saying about evolution is correct?
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    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    There is no mention of "no evolution" in the Qur'an.

    There is an account of creation in the Qur'an which shares similarities with the creation story in Genesis, but it also has many differences. People tend to assume that because the Genesis story conflicts with evolution (or rather, because Christians/the church originally didn't like Darwin's idea of evolution very much), the Qur'ans account must also imply that there is no evolution. But in fact there is nothing in the Qur'an which, if you accept it as true, logically forces you to disbelieve in evolution.

    It was actually a Muslim scholar (Al-Jahiz) who came up with one of the earliest theories of evolution.


    Is this supposed to be an error?

    Look at it this way. Suppose God miraculously makes a car appear out of nowhere. He would be correct in saying that the car is made of metal (the body). He would also be correct in saying that the car is made out of rubber (the tyres). And he would also be correct in saying that he created the car from nothing - since he started off with no materials, and still managed to make a car.

    Similarly, humans can be made of more than one thing. And they can also have been originally created from nothing.
    That was the Greeks, although Al-Jahiz did contribute some ideas.
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    (Original post by amerzeb)


    i was wondering if what he is saying about evolution is correct?
    I stopped listening after the birds came from fish bit because that's not what most evolutionists think.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_birds
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    (Original post by Charzhino)
    Why would God have a throne.. it just reaffirms the idea that god was created by mans image of a powerful king/creator/ruler sitting high in the heavens looking down.
    I don't think by "throne", the Qur'an means that God sits on a fancy chair. If you talk about the "chairman" of a company, you're not talking about the chair he sits on. Lots of people sit on chairs. The point is that you're referring to a particular status of authority. The Qur'an states that God's throne "extends throughout the heavens and the earth". Of course, the entirety of space isn't taken up by God's golden chair. It is all subject to God's authoritative influence.

    Words like "throne" and "crown" and "chair" and "office" have more than one meaning.
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    (Original post by amerzeb)


    i was wondering if what he is saying about evolution is correct?
    His explanation of what secular science thinks about the origin of the universe/life is one of the worst misrepresentations I've ever come across. I'm five minutes in and I'm already having to resist banging my head against the wall, the guy's an utter moron.
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    (Original post by Ayshizzle)
    I stopped listening after the birds came from fish bit because that's not what most evolutionists think.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_birds
    so what is the process of evolution which caused man to come about?
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    (Original post by PandyAndy)
    That was the Greeks, although Al-Jahiz did contribute some ideas.
    I know, I did say "one of" the earliest theories.
    Though I suppose it doesn't really matter. The point is that belief in the Qur'an does not necessarily imply disbelief in evolution.
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    (Original post by tazarooni89)

    It was actually a Muslim scholar (Al-Jahiz) who came up with one of the earliest theories of evolution.



    .

    Dont be ridiculous, Al Jahiz was no scinetist, he was a poet and philosopher, who had happened to read greek works, such as aristole, as many muslim philosophers did.. He wrote a book of poems about animals and also a book about black slaves in arabia, in which he hypothesises as to 'why they are black' as well as animals that also happened to dark coloured,- coming to some roundabout conclusion its because the hot sun ie envrionment.
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    (Original post by amerzeb)
    so what is the process of evolution which caused man to come about?
    Google is your friend here.
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    (Original post by amerzeb)


    i was wondering if what he is saying about evolution is correct?
    If, at about 3 minutes, he's talking about the origin of the universe, then he's wrong. Evolution makes no such claims of an explosion (apart from maybe the Cambrian one), it merely explains how creatures came about once life had already begun.
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    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    I don't think by "throne", the Qur'an means that God sits on a fancy chair. If you talk about the "chairman" of a company, you're not talking about the chair he sits on. Lots of people sit on chairs. The point is that you're referring to a particular status of authority. The Qur'an states that God's throne "extends throughout the heavens and the earth". Of course, the entirety of space isn't taken up by God's golden chair. It is all subject to God's authoritative influence.

    Words like "throne" and "crown" and "chair" and "office" have more than one meaning.
    Literal interpretation of the Quran seems to be the majority opinion from most muslims I have experience with. They tend to favour the literal description of something like this throne rather than a metaphorical alternative. Same applies for stuff like paradise/allahs image/descriptions of hellfire/miracles etc.

    I do realise that a few may opt for the higher meaning rather than face value but its just something I've noticed over forums/real life discussions.
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    (Original post by tazarooni89)
    I know, I did say "one of" the earliest theories.
    Though I suppose it doesn't really matter. The point is that belief in the Qur'an does not necessarily imply disbelief in evolution.
    I suppose you use the term 'one of the earliest theories' in the same manner people use when they say Da Vinci 'invented the helicopter'?
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    (Original post by Ayshizzle)
    I stopped listening after the birds came from fish bit because that's not what most evolutionists think.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_birds
    Well, they did I suppose. But it's not like it went BIRDS>FISH with nothing in between lol.
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    (Original post by Ayshizzle)
    Google is your friend here.
    i will do god willing tommorrow but i need to go to sleep now so i can pray in the morning.

    i have another genuine question which i dont know the answer for. evolutionist say that humans came from monkeys if i am correct. so if man has evolved from monkey so why are there monkeys around. are they going to evolve to man?

    Not trying to be rude or anything just want to know.
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    (Original post by PandyAndy)
    Well, they did I suppose. But it's not like it went BIRDS>FISH with nothing in between lol.
    That's what that guy seemed to think
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    (Original post by amerzeb)
    i will do god willing tommorrow but i need to go to sleep now so i can pray in the morning.

    i have another genuine question which i dont know the answer for. evolutionist say that humans came from monkeys if i am correct. so if man has evolved from monkey so why are there monkeys around. are they going to evolve to man?

    Not trying to be rude or anything just want to know.
    A) No, evolutionists don't say we evolved from modern primates. We share a common ancestor.
    B) The question is akin to asking "If europeans colonised america, why are there still europeans?". Evolution occurs in populations, we split off from our ancestors and went in one direction to become humans, other populations became other species.

    Please, do yourself a favour and move away from the idiot in that video. As a biology student this sort of misinformation is painful to watch and even harder to think about how many people are buying into it.
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    (Original post by Indo-Chinese Food)
    Dont be ridiculous, Al Jahiz was no scinetist, he was a poet and philosopher, who had happened to read greek works, such as aristole, as many muslim philosophers did.. He wrote a book of poems about animals and also a book about black slaves in arabia, in which he hypothesises as to 'why they are black' as well as animals that also happened to dark coloured,- coming to some roundabout conclusion its because the hot sun ie envrionment.
    So?
    What has that got to do with anything I just said?
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    (Original post by amerzeb)
    i will do god willing tommorrow but i need to go to sleep now so i can pray in the morning.

    i have another genuine question which i dont know the answer for. evolutionist say that humans came from monkeys if i am correct. so if man has evolved from monkey so why are there monkeys around. are they going to evolve to man?

    Not trying to be rude or anything just want to know.
    We share a common ancestor with them, we aren't directly evolved from them.


    (Original post by Ayshizzle)
    That's what that guy seemed to think
    Some people are just deluded .
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    (Original post by Mouldy_Underwear)
    It's true that there are many scientific inaccuracies in the Qur'an such as as no evolution. There is also stuff such as it saying that living things are made from water but it also says that they are made from clay and nothing too. The earth being spherical is another one but the knowledge of that was already well established in the region at that time, so much so that the circumference of the Earth was calculated to a high accuracy.

    However something that is particularly interesting is the Islamic account of the creation story. According to Islam the Universe and the Earth were created in six days. Whilst many people would say that it would be silly to literally believe it took six days, from what I've gathered it may have actually have been six days. This is because, in Einsteins theory of relativity, there are factors which can affect the flow of time. One of the factors is mass, and it is mentioned in the Qur'an that God's Throne is much much more massive than the universe, and if that is so than the flow of time is much slower there. Therefore six days in God's Throne may well be 13.7 billion years. Since the universe was created in six days, the time taken for the creation of the solar system and the earth is believed to be 2 days. That is 2/6 or 1/3 of the 13.7 billion years. This gives a value of 4.57 billion years and the earth is believed to be 4.54 billion years, if you take into account the uncertainties than you can get 4.57 billion.

    This coupled with other things that the Qur'an says about the universe such as it all coming from one point and that is continues to expand seem to give the religion a lot of support especially since it this knowledge wasn't known at the time. I haven't gone through a great amount of research to find this information so some of it may be incorrect, if I made a mistake please point that out. Anyway what are your thoughts on this?
    There is this video I watched which has predictions that they made in the prophet (pbuh) time about today, and 80% of it is happening now! it made me realise how true it may be! If I find it i'll post it on here
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    (Original post by Algorithm69)
    I suppose you use the term 'one of the earliest theories' in the same manner people use when they say Da Vinci 'invented the helicopter'?
    I use the term in the sense that his idea of evolution was not identical to the idea of evolution we have today. It was an early theory.

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Updated: April 22, 2012
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