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Socialist Workers Party Candidate.

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    As you may know, I presently live in St Helens. The town has suffered since the cuts. It has never been a very modern town anyway; it was the last in the country to receive regeneration (Wigan were apparently amongst the first).

    In St Helens pound shops are opening up everywhere. I have nothing against them, you can get some good things for cheap, like chocolate, cereal, dog food, household items, and so forth. But the fact that three, including a Pound Bakery, has openned up in the last year probably reflects the fact that people have little money to spend. In fact, St Helens is a poor town, and unemployment for young males is serious, although not as serious as Merthyr Tidvile's unemployment. It is still bad with more than 6,000 young males currently out of work.

    Now, a new politics has emerged on the scene in this town: first BNP candidates and now, to date, a Socialist Party candidate is standing for the town centre wanting a revolution and a fight with the capitalist system. His presence has been the talk of the town hall for two weeks or more according to my Libdem friend.

    He asks 'why now?'

    Could we see such fringe parties emerge in the next year or so? You've all read about George Galloway's victory? We've seen the rise of the BNP and UKIP.

    My Libdem friend is now thinking of going independent, btw.

    So are things really that bad that such fringe parties are clambouring onto the political arena now? Is it mere opportunism? When things grow weak, when support becomes weakned, this foments the environment for other things to grow stronger; things that were previously unable to grow because of the unavailablity of certain conditions. In a crisis, there is chaos, and people become disillusioned eventually. This envirornment is perfect for any fringe movement (i.e., a political party) to make a move on the proverbial chessboard.

    It's hardly checkmate for these fringe groups, but all it takes is a sharp shift in thinking amongst the people, and then the old established order can be overthrown; that's what a revolution is.

    Is it time for a revolution? Or is this Socialist Party candidate for St Helens deluded?
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    Simply put, this is no time for a revolution and despite how many of us are pissed off at this current governments failure to get the economy under control, the majority of us are educated enough to know that not only that we've got 'it' good but also that a revolution would be pointless in this country unless we're living under a generally oppressive regime.
    Thanks in part to both social media and globalisation itself people are now more aware that although nationally they may be 'working class', 'middle class' ect they're a member of the bourgeois in global terms.

    Also, he's not factoring into account the fact that this country is overpopulated as far as resources distribution goes, we don't have the resources within our own borders to supply our population. Therefore we have to rely on global trade and the free-market in order to feed and clothe ourselves.. A revolution is not only incredibly unlikely but also one of the most ridiculous ideas I've heard as of late..

    If there's to be any kind of Socialist revolution it would have to be global anyway and there's little chance that a British revolution would cause a sufficient revolutionary wave across the world , it would simply be viewed as a nation throwing it's toys out of it's pram..
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    Scary that a BNP atmosphere has turned into an SWP one, the party that started the UAF.
    Isn't there a party literally called the "socialist working class party" or the "working class party" which is essentially an old syndicalist party, losing the unionism and ultra, ultra leftist social fascism of the SWP?

    I've always said that labour have been, and will be fragmenting off into the BNP, and socialist parties.

    For you're town, I don't think people who were in a former BNP atmosphere, will find a sanctuary in the SWP. Quite the contrary.
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    (Original post by travoot)
    Simply put, this is no time for a revolution and despite how many of us are pissed off at this current governments failure to get the economy under control, the majority of us are educated enough to know that not only that we've got 'it' good but also that a revolution would be pointless in this country unless we're living under a generally oppressive regime.
    Thanks in part to both social media and globalisation itself people are now more aware that although nationally they may be 'working class', 'middle class' ect they're a member of the bourgeois in global terms.

    Also, he's not factoring into account the fact that this country is overpopulated as far as resources distribution goes, we don't have the resources within our own borders to supply our population. Therefore we have to rely on global trade and the free-market in order to feed and clothe ourselves.. A revolution is not only incredibly unlikely but also one of the most ridiculous ideas I've heard as of late..

    If there's to be any kind of Socialist revolution it would have to be global anyway and there's little chance that a British revolution would cause a sufficient revolutionary wave across the world , it would simply be viewed as a nation throwing it's toys out of it's pram..
    That's exactly what somebody wanting to preserve status quo would say.

    Millions of (often young) people in this country lead lives comparable with the developing world, they face gang violence, drug crime/abuse, hunger it astounds me that middle-englanders can keep straight faces as they tell those beneath them how good they have it.

    This country isn't overpopulated as virtually everyone has the capacity to create and be of economical value as a person, our land could be used more efficiently easily feeding everyone here without the need for imports if the politicians were willing to do this. We could trade some of our staples (corn, wheat, potatoes etc) for the luxuries global capitalism has given us and if overpopulation were to ever become a problem, giving the poorest in society would lower their family sizes solving this problem, but the wealthy would hate for that to happen because they might have to start paying living wages.
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    There is also the Socialist Party too, its seems that they're bargaining on the cuts to push people toward a more extreme left wing leaning. I know a SP candidate is standing in a ward in my local town, however last year they stood 5 candidates and lost. I reckon this year their votes will increase but not by much.
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    During times of austerity and crisis, people often turn to the more extreme parties, non more so than in the late 1920's/ early 1930's Germany (sorry to bring the Nazi's in). I don't think this is the reason that George Galloway won the by-election, it was most probably a protest vote against the 3 big parties since the lib dems got into power. This is, most probably the reason why UKIP, the BNP and more extreme left parties have had more local councilors elected in the local elections in recent years. Despite their being massive economic injustice especially towards youths, I cant help but feel that the ones who need change the most are unlikely to vote for it as they're by the nature of the injustice somewhat less educated and therefore more politically ignorant.
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    (Original post by TheHansa)
    That's exactly what somebody wanting to preserve status quo would say.

    Millions of (often young) people in this country lead lives comparable with the developing world, they face gang violence, drug crime/abuse, hunger it astounds me that middle-englanders can keep straight faces as they tell those beneath them how good they have it.

    This country isn't overpopulated as virtually everyone has the capacity to create and be of economical value as a person, our land could be used more efficiently easily feeding everyone here without the need for imports if the politicians were willing to do this. We could trade some of our staples (corn, wheat, potatoes etc) for the luxuries global capitalism has given us and if overpopulation were to ever become a problem, giving the poorest in society would lower their family sizes solving this problem, but the wealthy would hate for that to happen because they might have to start paying living wages.
    I've lived on what is considered poverty in the UK my entire life, I am by no means a 'middle englander'. How dare you suggest anything otherwise.. I have to work 14 hours a week just to help pay the bills as my mothers disability doesn't go far enough - whilst going to college.. ****ing idiot..
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    (Original post by travoot)
    I've lived on what is considered poverty in the UK my entire life, I am by no means a 'middle englander'. How dare you suggest anything otherwise.. I have to work 14 hours a week just to help pay the bills as my mothers disability doesn't go far enough - whilst going to college.. ****ing idiot..
    I find that people like Hansa are either genuinly working class, far, far left revolutionary outcasts, there probably about 2000 around the UK and 20,000 fakers on forums, who coincidentaly, are probably middle-class psuedo socialists.
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    (Original post by prog2djent)
    I find that people like Hansa are either genuinly working class, far, far left revolutionary outcasts, there probably about 2000 around the UK and 20,000 fakers on forums, who coincidentaly, are probably middle-class psuedo socialists.
    Champagne socialists are the people that wind me up the most. I've lived a 'hard' life, but I've got the perspective to understand that I've got life great compared to a child living somewhere like Sao Paulo. I'm as open as the next person to discussing Marxism and you know, maybe one day it'll be viable if it was a global revolution - but we're nowhere near that yet.

    The truth is that people like Hansa are the sort of folks who will inevitably either turn their backs on Socialism as a whole as they progress up the socioeconomic ladder or they'll end up as sort of people who'll complain about everything and put little thought to realistic solutions. The sort of person who'll spend a grand on a 'plate' at one of these fancy charity doos and then spend the rest of the year bragging to their friends about how enlightened they are.
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    (Original post by travoot)
    Champagne socialists are the people that wind me up the most. I've lived a 'hard' life, but I've got the perspective to understand that I've got life great compared to a child living somewhere like Sao Paulo. I'm as open as the next person to discussing Marxism and you know, maybe one day it'll be viable if it was a global revolution - but we're nowhere near that yet.

    The truth is that people like Hansa are the sort of folks who will inevitably either turn their backs on Socialism as a whole as they progress up the socioeconomic ladder or they'll end up as sort of people who'll complain about everything and put little thought to realistic solutions. The sort of person who'll spend a grand on a 'plate' at one of these fancy charity doos and then spend the rest of the year bragging to their friends about how enlightened they are.
    We'll never be anywhere near a global revolution, when our government realise (which they will eventually) they can't police the world, and people decide to liberalise their markets and liberalise their society - abandon religion like euorpe or abandon dictatorships like the far-east and S.America.

    If there ever was a global revolution the results should be as much decrentralisation as possibly with as much of a free market as possible.

    Other than that it look like a technocratic future for all IMHO.
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    Suppose if the feeling that the major parties are incapable of getting to grips with the problems of 21st century britain radical parties might start to look like they have some answers.
    Not fond of the swp though... They basically want the working class to fight and did in order to install a new elite consisting of swp members.

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