Alleged rape by two footballers, woman too drunk to remember anything

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Any statistics to back up your statement that they are more likely to get off 'because they're footballers'?

I hope you never get on a jury considering you've decided they're guilty before the defence has even started it's case.

Two words: Marlon King (not got off every time but there is a limit to how much the courts are going to put up with!)

Well all I am saying is based on the evidence that has been reported on various papers - film of it, hotel staff hearing the incident, him telling hotel staff to keep an eye on her because she was unwell (therefore fully aware of how drunk she was) and her falling over repeatedly that night on cctv, then I would say guilty. She was obviously too drunk to consent.

Reply 21

walterwhite123

Original post by redferry

The same Marlon King who has not long come out of jail for a sexual offence?

Great example.

Reply 22

redferry

Original post by walterwhite123

The same Marlon King who has not long come out of jail for a sexual offence?

Great example.

The same Marlon King that got caught doing 130 mph on the motorway a few weeks ago and is still driving. The same Marlon King that has 16 offenses to his name yet has barely been inside.

Reply 23

Idle

It's about judgement though, if someone who is drunk by law is able to recognise what is right and what is wrong when it comes to anything else then it should be the same for sexual consent.

Reply 24

kka25

Original post by visa

Woman logic: I can't remember anything, so I must've been raped.

There's this sickening feeling of agreement here =/

Reply 25

lukas1051

I think regardless of the fact that she may not have been in the mindset to be fully aware of what she was doing, including consenting if that was the case, assuming she did technically consent I don't think you can call that rape because the men were under the impression it was OK. The fact she was visibly very drunk makes it a lot more complex, but I think the lines are blurred. At what level of inebriation does someone stop being able to make these decisions? The guys are clearly scumbags for doing it, knowing she was drunk, but whether they are rapists or not is not clear cut, and I think to draw conclusions without further details coming forward us unfair.

Reply 26

username402722

If they are found guilty and presumably then they are imprisoned, I hope no football club signs them upon their release. Seeing Lee Hughes and Marlon King earning quite large sums of money after what they were convicted (even though far lesser offences than rape) of is awful.

Reply 27

username129099

As has been said, it seems a bit of a grey area. If I get really drunk and get in my car, when I get arrested there is no suggestion that my state means that I wasn't able to make the decision the drive. The fact I was able to get in the car, and she was able to walk from the article, is enough for me to be responsible for my actions.

Its a pretty hard decision to make, but I'm sure the film will show whether she was a willing participant or not. If the two of them go to jail, not much they can complain about you pick a smashed girl up then tag team her in a cheap hotel then you run the risk. They sound pretty predatory, tbh, which pretty sad two 23 year olds with some money in their pocket are reduced to this for sex, might as well have just gone home and had a ****.

Reply 28

Tyraell

Original post by doggyfizzel

Though, there's more of an assumption that you were intending on driving before you started drinking if that is your only way home. I doubt she went out intending on a tag team.

Reply 29

Aspiringlawstudent

Original post by joan2468

If a man walks home drunk and he gets attacked by gang members, that must be his fault too then.

I quite agree.

Reply 30

Aspiringlawstudent

Original post by PoGo HoPz

Oh, I see. So it's the victim's fault for partaking in a leisurely pastime that's legal, is it? That makes sense.

Last time I checked, drinking alcohol was within the law and rape was against it. Did it ever occur to you that it could actually be the fault of the person(s) that think they are above the law?

What if the sex is consensual but the woman forgets what happened due to being so inebriated and falsely accuses someone of raping her?

Reply 31

username129099

Original post by Tyraell

Though, there's more of an assumption that you were intending on driving before you started drinking if that is your only way home. I doubt she went out intending on a tag team.

I don't think that is an assumption the courts make. I'm not saying she did, I'm just saying in all other areas of the law there is no acceptance being drunk makes you decision less valid.

Reply 32

Like a BAWS

Taking advantage of someone that's drunk =/= Rape.

Does it make everyone who goes to nightclubs, pubs etc with the hope of 'pulling' rapists? After all, nearly everyone there will be under the influence of alcohol to a greater or lesser extent. Nearly EVERYONE at some point or other has sex when one person was under the influence of alcohol. To have a criminal record of being a Rapist tagged on you for the rest of your life for having sex with a girl that consented but was mildly intoxicated, to me, is unfair. I'm sorry, but even though taking advantage of a very drunk girl might be immoral and a low-life thing to do, it is not of the same magnitude as rape.

Reply 33

blu tack

Original post by Aspiringlawstudent

What if the sex is consensual but the woman forgets what happened due to being so inebriated and falsely accuses someone of raping her?

If she's 'so inebriated' then she would have been too drunk to give real consent. Non consensual sex = rape.

Reply 34

PoGo HoPz

Original post by Aspiringlawstudent

What if the sex is consensual but the woman forgets what happened due to being so inebriated and falsely accuses someone of raping her?

Aspiringlawstudent eh? :facepalm2:

http://m.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-rape-kit.htm

Reply 35

joey11223

Original post by blu tack

If she's 'so inebriated' then she would have been too drunk to give real consent. Non consensual sex = rape.

What about the scenario of someone who isn't drunk when they have consensual sex, let's say they go up to someone's room relatively near the start of a party. But they subsequently drink a lot afterwards, so much that they become very ill and wake up the next day throwing up and have forgotten the entire evening. When they're told about the fact they had sex with so and so, they won't remember and may then claim they must have been forced, or their drink spiked (though statistically drink spiking is rather uncommon, inebriation and memory loss from too much alcohol is most likely).

Reply 36

Kdm4life

Original post by blu tack

If she's 'so inebriated' then she would have been too drunk to give real consent. Non consensual sex = rape.

So what if she was the one who brought up sex, and she actually asked them to have sex with her, are they still in the wrong? Thats BS. It doesnt matter how drunk you are, if you tell somebody they can have sex with you, that is the definition of the word consent. How are they in the wrong because a woman who consented to sex cant remember it? Just because you cant remember something in the morning doesnt mean you cant give consent to sex the night before.

Reply 37

NB_ide

Original post by Idle

It's kinda strange that if someone starts a fight when drunk, they won't get any leniency from a court.. Yet if you are drunk and say yes to sex then you can't help that.

yes, lol. Anything else you do that you regret while drunk, such as fighting, stealing, verbally abusing people, or whatever - it's still seen as your own damn fault for getting into such a state when you should know how you will behave before you decide to start consuming the drug.

But, poor helpless women, when they get drunk nothing is their responsibility any more and they can not, must not, be held accountable for what they choose to do in that state and later regret.

Super empowerment, sisters.

Reply 38

NB_ide

Original post by Kdm4life

Unfortunately most of TSR believe that basically a woman can never give legitimate consent, because if she was drinking, or was persuaded in any way, shape or form, the consent is not valid and u r rapist lol.

brb, 100% of men are rapists, brb millions of rapes happen every weekend. brb diluting the definition of rape until it's completely meaningless.

Reply 39

Tyler Varona

Did she even agree to go into the hotel with them? If she was so out of it that she wasn't even aware of her surroundings we can only guess one thing.

Also the article says they targeted her, sounds a bit rapey to me.