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Muslims- What are your opinions on Quranists? -POLL

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  • View Poll Results: Muslims- What are your opinions on Quranists?
    They shouldn't even be considered Muslims.
    60
    30.61%
    I don't know much about them to judge.
    37
    18.88%
    I don't really care about other sects in Islam.
    12
    6.12%
    We're all Muslims, it doesn't matter.
    59
    30.10%
    I'm a Quranist myself.
    22
    11.22%
    I don't agree with them but respect their views.
    29
    14.80%
    Other- please comment below.
    13
    6.63%

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    (Original post by mel0n)
    Someone already said it - how would you even know how to pray if you don't follow ahadith? Isn't being a Quranist a bit self-contradictory considering the fact that the Qur'an states on multiple occasions (correct me if I'm wrong) to follow the way and the sunnah of the holy prophet pbuh - how exactly does a Quranist go about doing that if they aren't willing to consider hadiths?

    Often there are less contradictions than an individual thinks and sometimes it is down to the person's own understanding.
    You're wrong the quran specifically states, you're only sunnah is the quran. No mention of hadiths, prophets sayings/actions...

    The biggest contradiction of all in the hadiths is, well in the hadiths the prophet is noted down as saying don't note down my sayings, if so destroy it, or something like that :confused: the contradiction there is obvious :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    Why do we need to subconsciously need to remember that, why not consciously? When we say it out loud, including his name in the same confirmation as Allah's. that's almost associating partners with him. We are here to worship God alone. If you worship Allah, then you will obviously recognise Muhammed, why do you need to reaffirm that? That's a basic principle if you believe in Allah.
    If Muhammad had not bought the message to the people, would we even know about Allah?

    It's a case of the Quranists "shooting the messenger" when they should respect him and pay heed to the messages that he bought.

    Do you, I assume you are a Quranist, believe in the Hadith Qudsi's?

    I'm just going to repeat my quote from above:
    [Quran 12:106] The majority of those who believe in God do not do so without committing idol worship.
    No one regards Muhammad as an idol, rather we respect him as a messenger.
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    (Original post by Reform)
    No, they would have the same version of the shahada. Friday prayers are obligatory on every Muslim because it is mentioned in the Quran.

    'O you who have believed, when [the adhan] is called for the prayer on the day of Jumu'ah [Friday], then proceed to the remembrance of Allah and leave trade. That is better for you, if you only knew.'

    I'm not a Quranist though and I reject the stance they take.
    No, the Shahada as meantioned in the Quran is "There is no Ilah (God) except Him, the Mighty, the Wise." which comes from the translation of Surah 3, Al-i'Imran Ayah 18 (although the phrase is used a lot in other places in the Quran). The Sunni "and Muhammad is his messenger" come from the Sunnah which is why Quranists don't use it. Arguably some probably view it as inappropriate as the Quran says Muhammad was just a man and including him in the prayer of devotion is bordering on idolizing him as more than that.

    As for the whole friday thing they reject the translation that yawmul-jumu3ah means friday (arguably quite rightly as the 'Lisanul-Arab' says that the pre islamic arabic for friday was yawmul-3arubah) and instead argue that the passage says "day of gathering" which is not specific to a day on the week.
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    (Original post by Darth Stewie)
    The Salat Al-Fajr and Salat Al-Isha are mentioned by name in the Quran (also seems the midday prayer is) apparently they incorporate all their prayers into those two, as for how the prayers actually go or where they learn to do it you would have to ask a Quranist.



    They believe the Hadiths are unreliable, according to them all they need to follow their religion is in the Quran, from those two passages alone i can kinda see their point. How do you know what you are following in the Hadiths is real and not a product of someone who lied over a thousand years ago for their own gain? Better to be safe than sorry.
    I have. To many. Mutliple times. Guess what? No answer.

    It's a totally flawed concept.

    The Quran says:

    Say (O, Muhammad): “If you love Allâh, then follow me, Allâh will love you
    and forgive you your sins. And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful”}; [3:31]

    So if the Allah tells us to follow his messenger in the Quran, how are we meant to do this if it were not for the sunnah and hadith?
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    [Quran 6:114] Shall I seek other than God as a source of law, when He has revealed to you this book fully detailed?

    Why do we need more than one book when God has already sent down the Quran "fully detailed"?
    "The word mufassal in 6:114-115 is understood by the Qur'an-only sect to mean "fully detailed" and with this understanding they deduce from the passage that the Qur'an is complete and perfect and therefore does not need Sunnah or Hadith in any way. But neither the statement that the Qur'an explains its verses nor the statement that the word of God is perfect in truth and justice can mean that the external context provided by the Hadith is not relevant in understanding, interpreting and applying the book of God."

    1) How do the Quranists know what day the "day of congregation is supposed to take place?

    2) How do Quranists perform Janazah (funeral) prayers?
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    Oh, okay. Thanks for that. I'm still in the process of reading the Quran

    I couldn't agree more though. There are some strange hadith such as:

    Book 023, Number 5022:

    Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: None of you should drink while standing; and if anyone forgets, he must vomit.
    .

    Volume 4, Book 54, Number 537:
    Narrated Abu Huraira:

    The Prophet said "If a house fly falls in the drink of anyone of you, he should dip it (in the drink), for one of its wings has a disease and the other has the cure for the disease."

    Book 002, Number 0462:

    Abu Huraira reported: The Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) said. When any one of you awakes up from sleep and performs ablution, he must clean his nose three times, for the devil spends the night in the interior of his nose.
    They're all nonsense. Are you reading an english version of the quran? if you are I recommend you ignore the brackets and interpret it for yourself, they're not the words of god.
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    If Muhammad had not bought the message to the people, would we even know about Allah?

    It's a case of the Quranists "shooting the messenger" when they should respect him and pay heed to the messages that he bought.

    Do you, I assume you are a Quranist, believe in the Hadith Qudsi's?



    No one regards Muhammad as an idol, rather we respect him as a messenger.
    Nope, I'm not a Quranist. I'm just exploring and it makes a lot of sense to me.
    Quranists don't shoot the messenger,they love him just as much as the other prophets just like the Quran says.

    I don't see why Muslims today follow the actions of the Prophet as if he was perfect, rather than following the words of God. I mean, in the Quran itself Muhammad is not perfect- surah Abasa starts off describing something Muhammad did wrong (turning away from a blind man). Why do we glorify him, and put him on a pedestal when Allah is the only one we should be worshipping?
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    (Original post by translucent)
    They're all nonsense. Are you reading an english version of the quran? if you are I recommend you ignore the brackets and interpret it for yourself, they're not the words of god.
    Yeah, I'm reading a modern version translated by Rashad Khalifa who disregards the hadith and any additions to the Quran in brackets.
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    (Original post by translucent)
    Maybe god purposefully made it broad to not suffocate people with all the strict guidelines?
    But then it wouldn't have any meaning as most of the practices mentioned in the Quran were practised and thus written down in the Hadith.

    How do Quranists even know when the "day of congregation" is or how to perform the funeral prayer?
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    (Original post by nosaer)
    I have. To many. Mutliple times. Guess what? No answer.

    It's a totally flawed concept.

    The Quran says:

    Say (O, Muhammad): “If you love Allâh, then follow me, Allâh will love you
    and forgive you your sins. And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful”}; [3:31]

    So if the Allah tells us to follow his messenger in the Quran, how are we meant to do this if it were not for the sunnah and hadith?
    They aren't saying that you shouldn't use Muhammads actions as an example, they argue that the Hadith and Sunnah are to unreliable to use and believe many contain historical inaccuracies. They also believe many of the Hadiths were influenced by culture and non Islamic beliefs, and as a result following them is a bad idea.

    Basically if your god didn't put it in the Quran it really isn't that important.
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    (Original post by nosaer)
    I have. To many. Mutliple times. Guess what? No answer.

    It's a totally flawed concept.

    The Quran says:

    Say (O, Muhammad): “If you love Allâh, then follow me, Allâh will love you
    and forgive you your sins. And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful”}; [3:31]

    So if the Allah tells us to follow his messenger in the Quran, how are we meant to do this if it were not for the sunnah and hadith?
    Everything God wanted you to know about Muhammad is in the Quran. The hadiths state Muhammad used to fondle his 9 year old wife and make her wash his semen off his clothes. It also states that he went round to all 9 (or 11 as it states in other parts) of his wives and had sex with all of them (even though the Quran only allows 4 wives).

    Now, how accurate does that sound? If we are going to follow the example of the prophet using the hadith, why don't the men of today do that?
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    Yeah, I'm reading a modern version translated by Rashad Khalifa who disregards the hadith and any additions to the Quran in brackets.
    Rashad Khalifa:

    (Original post by Wikipedia)
    Khalifa said that he was a messenger (rasool) of God and that the Archangel Gabriel 'most assertively' told him that chapter 36, verse 3, of the Quran, 'specifically' referred to him.[4][5] His followers refer to him as God's Messenger of the Covenant.[6] He promoted a strict monotheism and was a prominent Quranist, rejecting the hadith and sunnah as fabrications attributed to prophet Muhammad by later scholars.
    So do you regard Khalifa as a messenger do you? If not, how on earth can you disregard the books of the ahadith because you accuse the collectors of foul play, yet accept the translation of the Quran by someone like Rashida.
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    Nope, I'm not a Quranist. I'm just exploring and it makes a lot of sense to me.
    Quranists don't shoot the messenger,they love him just as much as the other prophets just like the Quran says.
    I do apologize.

    Who do you love more: The people who brought you into this world (i.e: your parents) or the authors who wrote manual books on "How to raise your kids"?

    Muslims do not distinguish between prophets but it's not fair to say that Isa and Musa had the same influence on our lives as Muhammad, is it?

    I don't see why Muslims today follow the actions of the Prophet as if he was perfect, rather than following the words of God. I mean, in the Quran itself Muhammad is not perfect- surah Abasa starts off describing something Muhammad did wrong (turning away from a blind man). Why do we glorify him, and put him on a pedestal when Allah is the only one we should be worshipping?
    The fact that Muhammad's mistakes are mentioned in the Quran is testament to the fact that we worship Allah as opposed to Muhammad.

    The fact is, If Muhammad had not bought the Quran as he did, we may not even be Muslims today. Just ponder over that....
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    (Original post by translucent)
    You're wrong the quran specifically states, you're only sunnah is the quran. No mention of hadiths, prophets sayings/actions...

    The biggest contradiction of all in the hadiths is, well in the hadiths the prophet is noted down as saying don't note down my sayings, if so destroy it, or something like that :confused: the contradiction there is obvious :rolleyes:
    :indiff:

    59:7 And whatever the Messenger has given you - take; and what he has forbidden you - refrain from.

    I don't understand what position/purpose Quranists think the prophet played if they reject his sunnah and his authentic teachings found in ahadith. What hadith is that?
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    (Original post by nosaer)
    Rashad Khalifa:



    So do you regard Khalifa as a messenger do you? If not, how on earth can you disregard the books of the ahadith because you accuse the collectors of foul play, yet accept the translation of the Quran by someone like Rashida.
    I'm not a Quranist and I definitely do not regard Khalifa as a messenger. I just like the idea that his version of the Quran translation is unaffected by any hadith/sunnah/interpretations other than what God had said Himself.

    Btw, I also have the non Khalifa version of translation and I read that too. They generally have the same meanings except Rashad Khalifa's one doesn't include brackets or long footnotes about something some scholar said.

    The hadith, however, has managed to cause so much problems in Islam, such as causing sects and divisions within the religion, even though God forbid that in His Quran.
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    Think of it like football, this is very basic

    The Quran - Rules

    Hadith - Teaches how to play

    You can't be a muslim by just following Quran, to be a muslim you believe in 1 god and that Muhammed PBUH is the last messenger.

    So to discard the hadith is like refusing to believe what the prophet says and does.

    Also I would advice you to not interoperate hadiths and quran by your self. If you have any questions go to a scholar. The fact that hadiths have contradictions is another matter, it's not a flaw the prophet might have said one thing to one person based on their circumstances and may have said something else to another person based on their circumstances even if it is on the same matter.

    I don't want to go into too much detail but I don't think any tom dick and harry can interoperate the quran and understand it's full meaning especially if you don't know Arabic. The same goes for Hadiths
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    I do apologize.

    Who do you love more: The people who brought you into this world (i.e: your parents) or the authors who wrote manual books on "How to raise your kids"?

    Muslims do not distinguish between prophets but it's not fair to say that Isa and Musa had the same influence on our lives as Muhammad, is it?



    The fact that Muhammad's mistakes are mentioned in the Quran is testament to the fact that we worship Allah as opposed to Muhammad.

    The fact is, If Muhammad had not bought the Quran as he did, we may not even be Muslims today. Just ponder over that....
    I understand your point, but the Quran repeats many times that we should not favour one prophet over the other. Why do we even include Muhammad in our prayers (I understand making dua for him, but almost dedicating your prayer to both him and God is just wrong)?

    [Quran 20:14] I am God; there is no other God beside Me, Thus you shall worship me and observe the ‘Salat’ to commemorate Me.
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    Everything God wanted you to know about Muhammad is in the Quran. The hadiths state Muhammad used to fondle his 9 year old wife and make her wash his semen off his clothes. It also states that he went round to all 9 (or 11 as it states in other parts) of his wives and had sex with all of them (even though the Quran only allows 4 wives).

    Now, how accurate does that sound? If we are going to follow the example of the prophet using the hadith, why don't the men of today do that?
    You mean, like how to pray? Exactly.
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    (Original post by Baddream)
    I understand your point, but the Quran repeats many times that we should not favour one prophet over the other. Why do we even include Muhammad in our prayers (I understand making dua for him, but almost dedicating your prayer to both him and God is just wrong)?

    [Quran 20:14] I am God; there is no other God beside Me, Thus you shall worship me and observe the ‘Salat’ to commemorate Me.
    Why do you even include "Ibrahim" in your duas in Salah?
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    (Original post by muh123)
    Think of it like football, this is very basic

    The Quran - Rules

    Hadith - Teaches how to play

    You can't be a muslim by just following Quran, to be a muslim you believe in 1 god and that Muhammed PBUH is the last messenger.

    So to discard the hadith is like refusing to believe what the prophet says and does.

    Also I would advice you to not interoperate hadiths and quran by your self. If you have any questions go to a scholar. The fact that hadiths have contradictions is another matter, it's not a flaw the prophet might have said one thing to one person based on their circumstances and may have said something else to another person based on their circumstances even if it is on the same matter.

    I don't want to go into too much detail but I don't think any tom dick and harry can interoperate the quran and understand it's full meaning especially if you don't know Arabic. The same goes for Hadiths
    No way. The last thing I'd do is go to a scholar. Is the scholar going to pay for my sins on the day of judgement if he tells me something wrong and go on throughout my whole life believing it? God gave US the ability to verify everything for ourselves.
    17:36- You shall not accept any information, unless you verify it for yourself. I have given you the hearing, the eyesight, and the brain, and you are responsible for using them.


    Scholars are just interpreting the Quran just like we are. Admittedly, they do have years of experiences, but I think scholars are those that misguide Muslims the most.

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