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Why is it that when you discuss homosexuality in any way, most of the people who want to have a say in it are men, and almost always most of the arguments are strictly concerning men? I find it quite interesting.
Reply 1141
Original post by chefdave
You need to have a word with your liberal brethren. They're on the verge of forcing people to accept gay couples as adoptive parents because to do otherwise would mean discwimination. I think we've finally discovered who the real bigots are.


-You?
-You do realise I am gay, yes?
Reply 1142
Original post by Pyramidologist
Its not a topic i dwell on. I regard homosexuality to be a mental illness, so the last thing i would do is waste time on the topic of it. I only have about 4 posts in this thread.:tongue:


I regard bigotry as a mental illness.

See, anyone can say it, doesn't make it true.
Reply 1143
Of course they should. You can say 'oh no they might get bullied because their parents are gay', or you can look at it realistically and see they'd have a much better life in a fixed family home instead of an orphanage.
Reply 1144
This seemed appropriate.

40-years-protest.jpg
Reply 1145
Original post by Jester94
-You?
-You do realise I am gay, yes?


Apologies, I didn't realise that only straight people were capable of bigotry (I'm sure there's irony in there somewhere). No matter, the principle I've being arguing is that your sexuality has absolutely no bearing on whether you should be considered a suitable adoptive parent. If a private agency/couple specified that they want the child to have gays adoptive parents I wouldn't start stomping my feet and waving the human rights charter around, I'd accept their decision with grace on the understanding that it's their business not mine. Why can't the gay community act with the same dignity and try to understand another persons point of view?
yes with the proviso that the child chooses to if they can consent.
Original post by FatCharlie
Why is it that when you discuss homosexuality in any way, most of the people who want to have a say in it are men, and almost always most of the arguments are strictly concerning men? I find it quite interesting.


I'm pretty certain (though I don't care enough to go find statistics to back me up) that male couples are a lot more common than female couples.
Original post by hassi94
I'm pretty certain (though I don't care enough to go find statistics to back me up) that male couples are a lot more common than female couples.


Mmmm. Off the top of my head, around 10% of the population is LGBT, and around half of those are "gay men". Bear in mind, though, that this is based on census data, which isn't necessarily going to be representative if people aren't declaring their sexual orientation.
Reply 1149
Original post by chefdave
Yes, and it stinks of BS. Obviously in some cases calculations and compromises may need to be made if the supply of children vastly outweighs the number of potential parents, but if the situation is reversed it puts children and their biological parents in a position where they're able to pick and choose. Your anti-discrimination model isn't flexible enough to be able to take this into account because it prevents people from choosing what they think is right for them, you're more concerned with the feelings of minorities. I don't see how this helps the adoption process.


The supply of children vastly outweighs the number of potential parents. Have you seen the number of adverts plastered on walls, buses, and anything else recruiting foster parents and adoptive parents?

And yes, I do object strongly to anybody choosing what is right for them. Anybody in a position to make a binding choice in this process is an adult, and I don't care about their bruised ego or what is right for said adult. I'm not even especially concerned with the feelings of minorities, whose rights in this begin and end with a right to be considered fairly, just the same as everybody else.

Where the child gets placed for adoption should be a utilitarian thing. They need to go to the parents most likely to raise them successfully, which for the purposes of this discussion I'm defining as meaning the kid grows up to be a happy, healthy and productive member of society. Even under ideal circumstances, this is not a calculation that the biological parents are in a position to make - their judgement cannot be relied upon because of proximity.
Reply 1150
Original post by hassi94
I'm pretty certain (though I don't care enough to go find statistics to back me up) that male couples are a lot more common than female couples.


I remember from the debate before the Civil Partnership Act was passed, some stats which showed that gay male couples were less common but tended to last longer than lesbian couples. Can't remember where those stats were, they're probably not useful any more anyway, but it was interesting at the time.

Original post by Tortious
Mmmm. Off the top of my head, around 10% of the population is LGBT, and around half of those are "gay men". Bear in mind, though, that this is based on census data, which isn't necessarily going to be representative if people aren't declaring their sexual orientation.


Should be just over half lesbians I guess. Women are slightly more than half of the general population.

Don't forget the bi and straight people that fall into LGBT too :tongue:
Original post by mmmpie
I remember from the debate before the Civil Partnership Act was passed, some stats which showed that gay male couples were less common but tended to last longer than lesbian couples. Can't remember where those stats were, they're probably not useful any more anyway, but it was interesting at the time.



Should be just over half lesbians I guess. Women are slightly more than half of the general population.

Don't forget the bi and straight people that fall into LGBT too :tongue:


Hmm that is interesting.


With your reply to tortious; if 50% are gay men, and a certain percentage are Trans-sexual/gender, bi etc. then it must be fewer than 50% are gay women.
Original post by chefdave
Apologies, I didn't realise that only straight people were capable of bigotry (I'm sure there's irony in there somewhere). No matter, the principle I've being arguing is that your sexuality has absolutely no bearing on whether you should be considered a suitable adoptive parent. If a private agency/couple specified that they want the child to have gays adoptive parents I wouldn't start stomping my feet and waving the human rights charter around, I'd accept their decision with grace on the understanding that it's their business not mine. Why can't the gay community act with the same dignity and try to understand another persons point of view?


No, that's what we've been arguing..you seem to want sexuality to be allowed to be considered, from what you're saying here..
Reply 1153
Original post by hassi94
Hmm that is interesting.


With your reply to tortious; if 50% are gay men, and a certain percentage are Trans-sexual/gender, bi etc. then it must be fewer than 50% are gay women.


That's what I mean. If you say 50% are gay men, you're probably talking about 50% of LG, and forgetting about BT and the rest of the alphabet.
Original post by mmmpie
That's what I mean. If you say 50% are gay men, you're probably talking about 50% of LG, and forgetting about BT and the rest of the alphabet.


No I think Tortious meant that 50% of LGBT are gay men, and so backing up my point that there are probably more gay couples.

You might be right, though. That is just the understanding I had.
Gay marriage? :yes:
Gay people adopting? :no:

The child will be isolated within society, it is going to be pretty rare to see someone with gay parents so the child is immediately attracting (potentially unwanted) attention. Sure, there are a few happy people with gay parents, but does that speak for everyone? I come from a rubbish background and if a kid with gay parents attended my old secondary school they would lead a very miserable life. They could, however, keep it a secret and when they progress to higher levels of eduction it will become less problematic.

There are a whole load of other issues which I cba to go through, but school life is definitely the most important.
Original post by Ilyas
Gay marriage? :yes:
Gay people adopting? :no:

The child will be isolated within society, it is going to be pretty rare to see someone with gay parents so the child is immediately attracting (potentially unwanted) attention. Sure, there are a few happy people with gay parents, but does that speak for everyone? I come from a rubbish background and if a kid with gay parents attended my old secondary school they would lead a very miserable life. They could, however, keep it a secret and when they progress to higher levels of eduction it will become less problematic.

There are a whole load of other issues which I cba to go through, but school life is definitely the most important.

Well that is something that your parents and your school could have stopped, right? The behavior of you(?) and the rest of the kids.

I have a really high number of friends who are teachers (all from small children around the age of 7 up to 15) and they claim to have several children in their schools with gay parents, non of the children being treated different from anyone of their peers. Personally I've grown up with friends who were raised by same-sex couples and if anything they, from what I've seen, are better functioning that most.
Original post by Pyramidologist
Its not a topic i dwell on. I regard homosexuality to be a mental illness, so the last thing i would do is waste time on the topic of it. I only have about 4 posts in this thread.:tongue:


Wow, where did you get your PhD in Clinical psychology that qualifies you to make that statement without a strict reference to one of the diagnostic manuals (although you should probably still use them unless homosexuality is your specific research area). Or maybe you could try one of the diagnostic manuals, oh no they disagree with you.
Sorry, try again.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by hassi94
No I think Tortious meant that 50% of LGBT are gay men, and so backing up my point that there are probably more gay couples.

You might be right, though. That is just the understanding I had.


Yes, that's exactly what I meant. I need something to do over lunch, so I'll see if I can find the stats. :p:

EDIT: Interesting - this BBC story from 2010 suggests that 1% are L/G, 0.5% B, 0.5% "other" and 3% didn't answer. 95% are heterosexual.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by JonathanM
Well that was an unnecessary way of phrasing it. :upyours::bl:

Well by defintion the child may call the gay couple looking after them dad(s) even though it would be a bit confusing. But it's generally my perspective that people who look after others are guardians, dad only applies if you're the biological father. Sure you got foster dad/adoptive dad, but it's just I didn't see the term dad as just a role to be played.


It's dumb just ignore this as they can call the gay couple individually dad.

There's a lot more to the concept of fatherhood than producing the sperm which fertilises the egg. Would you say single sperm donors have more of a right to call themselves dad than the person actually taking care of those children after they're conceived?
Also, how was my phrasing unnecessary?

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