[Cool Cat]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
Well, for all those who still feel aggrieved at being detached from Ireland - where they feel is their rightful heritage.

well, what about those of us who still feel aggrieved that even though we are detached from Ireland, most of the world is ignorant to this fact and still think we're all Irish? because of this you lot don't have to fight for your identity to be respected like us British NIers do

[Psyk]

(Original post by startitup)
What exactly have you done that needs rewarding? Just because you identify yourself as Irish doesn't make you warrant some kind of reward. I'll bet all of you applying with your Irish passport for no fees will be as quick to declare yourself British to make use of British student loans/grants.

It does seem a bit ironic that an arm of the British state is rewarding people for disassociating themselves from it

Although I suppose it's not really that ironic because the party in control of that arm also want to disassociate itself from the British state.

[startitup]

(Original post by Cool Cat)
well, what about those of us who still feel aggrieved that even though we are detached from Ireland, most of the world is ignorant to this fact and still think we're all Irish? because of this you lot don't have to fight for your identity to be respected like us British NIers do

Absolutely spot on. Sick and tired of explaining to people from other countries that I am a British citizen and live in Northern Ireland.

[medbh4805]

(Original post by Cool Cat)
because of this you lot don't have to fight for your identity to be respected like us British NIers do

Are you taking the piss? Are you completely oblivious to the history of Northern Ireland?

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by startitup)
I am totally against this. Just abusing the privileges and changing nationality to either British or Irish depending on the benefits available for each one in certain situations.

I view myself as Irish, very much so, however one passport, that can otherwise sit in your room and never be used, isn't much of a price to pay for no tuition fees.

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by Cool Cat)
well, what about those of us who still feel aggrieved that even though we are detached from Ireland, most of the world is ignorant to this fact and still think we're all Irish? because of this you lot don't have to fight for your identity to be respected like us British NIers do

True point, but the area I live in IS in the UK, my currency has the Queen's head on it. Also I don't think society has integrated me into considering supporting a Northern Irish state (independent) nor it seems have Britain attempted to include NI. E.g, Great Britain Olympic team? NI is in it, but NI isn't in Great Britain?

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by Psyk)
It does seem a bit ironic that an arm of the British state is rewarding people for disassociating themselves from it

Although I suppose it's not really that ironic because the party in control of that arm also want to disassociate itself from the British state.

Haha, true, never mind the Irish in the north wanting to engage in the prosperity of being part of the UK as it is economically strong (well, we'll see for how much longer )

The big problem here is the general EU ruling that all states pay equal fees. Rock and a hard place, on the one hand, face the wrath of the identity- deprived Nationalists, the wrath of Unionists or the wrath of the EU

[Psyk]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
True point, but the area I live in IS in the UK, my currency has the Queen's head on it. Also I don't think society has integrated me into considering supporting a Northern Irish state (independent) nor it seems have Britain attempted to include NI. E.g, Great Britain Olympic team? NI is in it, but NI isn't in Great Britain?

Team GB is actually poorly named for this reason. Really it's the UK's team.

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
The big problem here is the general EU ruling that all states pay equal fees. Rock and a hard place, on the one hand, face the wrath of the identity- deprived Nationalists, the wrath of Unionists or the wrath of the EU

Yes I think it's a stupid rule that hasn't been thought out. As I mentioned before, I think some US states offer cheaper education to those from that state, so surely it must have seemed possible that an EU country would do a similar thing.

I think either it should be made universal, so universities must charge all EU citizens the same, regardless of whether they are from the same country or not. Or they could do it so people from other EU countries will be charged the highest price a local (to that EU member state) student could be charged. So in Scotland, they'd be charged the same as an English student.

[Popppppy]

(Original post by medbh4805)
Are you taking the piss? Are you completely oblivious to the history of Northern Ireland?

Wait till you get to uni.
Half the people in Great Britain have no idea that Northern Ireland is even part of the UK. They have no ability to differentiate between Northern Irish and Irish, and get very disappointed when they asked you to say 33 and 1/3 and you don't say it how they were expecting.

[Cyanohydrin]

(Original post by Callum828)
I'm angry that UK taxes go towards Scottish-only benefits. The Scottish government isn't providing free tuition. The British taxpayer is providing free tuition, but only to Scottish students.

And as for your solution of 'the rest of the UK giving its students free tuition':

1. It's unaffordable. The only reason the Scots can do so is because they are subsidised by UK taxpayers.

2. The English are unrepresented. There is no English Parliament, only Westminster. And when the tuition fee vote went through, Scottish MPs were quite happy to vote in favour, knowing that their own constituents would never have to pay.

University education was free in England until the Westminster parliament, with a majority of MPs from English constituencies, voted in favour of student charges.

The English NHS and education system are, as you know, devolved to England so please take up your grievances with the respective English ministers.

Also, Scotland is not subsidised. The entire UK has done very well out of north sea oil.

[Cool Cat]

(Original post by Popppppy)
Wait till you get to uni.
Half the people in Great Britain have no idea that Northern Ireland is even part of the UK. They have no ability to differentiate between Northern Irish and Irish, and get very disappointed when they asked you to say 33 and 1/3 and you don't say it how they were expecting.

LOL yeah

thankfully though I rarely get the say this/ say that thing probably because most people who are unaware of my being from NI seem to think I'm Scottish even after conversing with me apparently I slip into an English accent sometimes too. Ofcourse that's all fine until they ask me where I'm from and I say NI they go 'you're IRISH??!'

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by Psyk)
Team GB is actually poorly named for this reason. Really it's the UK's team.



Yes I think it's a stupid rule that hasn't been thought out. As I mentioned before, I think some US states offer cheaper education to those from that state, so surely it must have seemed possible that an EU country would do a similar thing.

I think either it should be made universal, so universities must charge all EU citizens the same, regardless of whether they are from the same country or not. Or they could do it so people from other EU countries will be charged the highest price a local (to that EU member state) student could be charged. So in Scotland, they'd be charged the same as an English student.

A university should be able to charge people from it's own country less than any other country abroad. This will help promote further education in their own country.

[Psyk]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
A university should be able to charge people from it's own country less than any other country abroad. This will help promote further education in their own country.

I agree. I don't have a problem with the principle of the Scottish government giving free education to Scottish people and charging others. They are given a budget and they are free to spend that how they like. My problem is with the bizarre situation that English and Welsh people get a worse deal than people from a completely different country. So I think Scottish unis should be able to charge EU students the same as they charge English ones, then it would be fair.

[revrev]

(Original post by ripdumbledore)
If you're Northern Irish and have an Irish Passport you are eligible to have the standard £1820 tuition fees paid by the Scottish Government. If your university still chooses to consider you a RUK student and charge you £9000 you'll still have to pay the remainder. I think St Andrews at least will still charge RUK fees to these students.

Where are you getting this information from (the sentence in bold)? Wouldn't that be discriminatory against the non-UK EU passport holder?

[shortbrendan]

(Original post by ripdumbledore)
If you're Northern Irish and have an Irish Passport you are eligible to have the standard £1820 tuition fees paid by the Scottish Government. If your university still chooses to consider you a RUK student and charge you £9000 you'll still have to pay the remainder. I think St Andrews at least will still charge RUK fees to these students.

Hi there.

I'm from NI, and I heard about this whole situation in about november, unfortunately after I'd sent off my UCAS form. So i've since got offers from Aberdeen, St Andrews (where I really want to go) and Glasgow. I didn't want to lose my offers but didn't care about the Aberdeen one (sorry to anyone applying there!) so asked to be EU with them - no problem. I've since asked with Glasgow and they haven't got back to me and St Andrews are just being a pain. Why do you think St Andrews will still charge RUK fees to us? Would love to be told if I would keep my offer when getting my fee status re-assessed but I've asked and it doesn't seem to be possible. Any advice? Cheers

[kred]

I would say that if you apply as EU then you would get an offer as EU.

Your problem is probably that you applied with RUK.
The Scottish Govt. will only pay for a set quota of students so they are now offering on 3 different types - so they might have 10 Scottish/EU places funded by the Scottish Govt. 10 RUK places and 10 international. They will have already filled their quota of Scottish/EU students for this year - so thay can't just add you into that quota. I don't know what would happen if they found they had a space, you might still get in but there's probably no guarantee - you might just lose your place. Most of the Scottish people I know who are going to St Andrews (although that's only a few) have unconditionals.

You could always take a year out and reapply next year as EU?

[Macabre]

(Original post by Cyanohydrin)


Why anyway? If you want free fees in England then stop electing the tories!

Free fees in England? Are you on crack? Do you have any idea the billions of pounds that would be needed to keep around the 200 univerisites and FE colleges degrees free? Scotland has around 30. Nuff said.

[kred]

Much less than 30 - more like 14(?)

[Planar]

(Original post by Cyanohydrin)
The majority of the English electorate (nationwide, obviously I feel sorry for the English people in places like Newcastle, Liverpool, Manchester and so on who did not vote for them) voted for the Conservative Party. If you feel do aggrieved by the fees situation then start voting for parties that want free fees, and stop blaming Scottish people!

They didn't actually, now that you mention it

[Clip]

I'm surprised this hasn't become a Rangers/Celtic thing yet.