[canŵio]

My brother went to a private school for 12 years. I went for 14 years. My older brother and sister went for 6 years.

My mum's a teacher, my dad's a school caretaker and we live in a council house.

It happened because the local schools were rubbish and my parents gave up having a nice house so we could go to a good school. there are lots of rich people at private schools, but then there are lots of rich people at state schools, too.

-and i agree that selection should be brought back in the state system. then the kids that want to learn will learn and the kids that need help will be given the attention they need.

[kf289]

(Original post by gernumblies)
£13,800 a year makes mine look cheap. Sounds like you're taking very top-end schools as the basis for your argument.

I've always wondered how much it costs the government to fund one child right through state education, though. If you took everyone out of private and put them in state schools/academies they'd be in a mess.

This is an excellent point. According to a BBC article apparently the cost of secondary school state education per child per year falls between £4,000 and £9,000. Bearing in mind that there are well over 500,000 pupils in the UK in independent education, it would take a lot more money to funnel these pupils back into state schools.

[looneylamb]

(Original post by Tahooper)
I don't see the point in private schools.

Parents who are actively involved in their children's learning will go further towards the child doing well in school than paying thousands of pounds.

I go to a private school and there's no way that my family is defined as "rich". My mum works part-time with a fairly standard income, whilst my dad has just been made redundant. I received a bursary of up to 30% off of my annual school bill (roughly). I know that plenty of my friends currently at my school are in fairly similar situations where their parents only just scrape by to afford the school fees.

It's not a matter of the parents not CARING about their child, it's quite the opposite in my case. I used to go to one of the top 5 state schools in my area (well, it used to be) and I turned up and was given the worst set of teachers I've ever had (and I've had a fair few in my lifetime). My dad moved me into a private school because he knew that I wasn't getting the attention that I needed in order to excel and get a better education. It wasn't because I wasn't working hard enough, it's because I simply had NO place to start from. My classes were continually full of loud idiots who spoke during the entire length of the lesson. How was I meant to understand where to start, let alone what to revise? I was predicted a C or D for Double Science at GCSE at that school and after going to private school I ended up getting an A. I'm not having a stab at state schools, I know that there are plenty of good ones and even the one I was at wasn't bad at all, I just didn't have luck on my side when it came to teachers and other students in my class.

To be honest, I would have probably had the same negative opinion as several others of you if you'd asked me the same question 5 years ago. However, I think it's very rich of you (pun intended) to judge those who attend private schools when in fact you probably have had no experience with them.

[08rbut]

I wouldn't call my family wealthy... I mean they are both lawyers so lots of people in my year think they are really well off- they are not. They are paying 20 something grand a year for my brother and I. Scraping the barrel and working their butts off, and often when my parents can't give us anything, they feel really guilty. Little do they know I feel guilty too just for asking them in the first place.

We live in a 4 bed house which is perfectly fine and lovely, but nothing comparable to the mansions my friends live in, I just thank God there is no peer pressure to wear Jack Wills in my circle of friends, or anything else for that matter.

Tbh, i have about 3 or 4 good friends that are in fairly similar situations else, so no I don't think its for the rich and foreigners. For the not so rich kids(such as myself), its a great opportunity to do well and really help you in the future. I think often people get the wrong end of the stick with private school kids. Yes, i'll admit there are a few ungrateful people in my year but in my friendship group we are all grateful to our parents who have really given us a good life. I have friends who want to go into medicine, law etc, and the others in my year don't want to do much other than find a rich hubby. I have no idea where I would be if i had gone to the local school near my house, but if i had a guess, I'd guess i would be smoking weed behind a bush.

why neg me?

[Joinedup]

(Original post by 08rbut)
I wouldn't call my family wealthy... I mean they are both lawyers so lots of people in my year think they are really well off- they are not. They are paying 20 something grand a year for my brother and I. Scraping the barrel and working their butts off, and often when my parents can't give us anything, they feel really guilty. Little do they know I feel guilty too just for asking them in the first place.

We live in a 4 bed house which is perfectly fine and lovely, but nothing comparable to the mansions my friends live in, I just thank God there is no peer pressure to wear Jack Wills in my circle of friends, or anything else for that matter.

Tbh, i have about 3 or 4 good friends that are in fairly similar situations else, so no I don't think its for the rich and foreigners. For the not so rich kids(such as myself), its a great opportunity to do well and really help you in the future. I think often people get the wrong end of the stick with private school kids. Yes, i'll admit there are a few ungrateful people in my year but in my friendship group we are all grateful to our parents who have really given us a good life. I have friends who want to go into medicine, law etc, and the others in my year don't want to do much other than find a rich hubby. I have no idea where I would be if i had gone to the local school near my house, but if i had a guess, I'd guess i would be smoking weed behind a bush.

why neg me?

I didn't neg you..., but 20 grand is just a tad under the AVERAGE wage.

I think this might in some way be annoying to people.

[Fires]

(Original post by 08rbut)
I wouldn't call my family wealthy... I mean they are both lawyers so lots of people in my year think they are really well off- they are not. They are paying 20 something grand a year for my brother and I. Scraping the barrel and working their butts off, and often when my parents can't give us anything, they feel really guilty. Little do they know I feel guilty too just for asking them in the first place.

We live in a 4 bed house which is perfectly fine and lovely, but nothing comparable to the mansions my friends live in, I just thank God there is no peer pressure to wear Jack Wills in my circle of friends, or anything else for that matter.

Tbh, i have about 3 or 4 good friends that are in fairly similar situations else, so no I don't think its for the rich and foreigners. For the not so rich kids(such as myself), its a great opportunity to do well and really help you in the future. I think often people get the wrong end of the stick with private school kids. Yes, i'll admit there are a few ungrateful people in my year but in my friendship group we are all grateful to our parents who have really given us a good life. I have friends who want to go into medicine, law etc, and the others in my year don't want to do much other than find a rich hubby. I have no idea where I would be if i had gone to the local school near my house, but if i had a guess, I'd guess i would be smoking weed behind a bush.

why neg me?

You may not feel "wealthy" but of course to many people one of the definitions of "wealthy" is being at private school. It's all relative - but I've noticed on TSR that anyone deemed the least bit "wealthy" by the mob is immediately negged all to hell - on the other hand, most people who are wealthy seem very reluctant to admit to it. Not all, but many.

It sounds to me from your description as if you are very much at the lower end of the private school heirarchy though - your fees are fairly low by national standards. I assume you are not boarding?

[Indo-Chinese Food]

(Original post by lukas1051)
Doesn't surprise me. The cost to put your kid in a private school is completely ridiculous and not worth the money - £26,000 a year for five years to get a few more A's at GCSE? You can do that for £130,000 less with a bit of hard work. It's mad, you have to be clinically insane. It's no wonder only the very rich still send their children to them.

People arnt paying to get a couple of extra 'A's at gcse, it is also about the sort f envirnment they are putting their kids in, although it sounds elitist, theres no doubt that private schools kids will grow up next to less wasters and junior scumbags as comprehensives - and parents know its the envirinment kids grow up in that determines what sort of student and person they eventually grow into. The pricesa re however completly ridiculous and would hope in a 'free amrket' system we are suppossed to operaate, that more shcools will open and therefore offer more choice and lower fees.

[paddypower]

Coming from a private school, the absolute baloney being spouted about the relationship between private schools and oxbridge is quite surprising. More than 60 applied from my year, yet only 10 got in to oxbridge. This is in spite of the fact that almost all had 7A*+ and 4/5 A's at A-Level.
Moreover, from my own experience of private school they are not some sort of exam factory - everyone here had to sit an exam to get in (thus the above-average level of intelligence throughout the school) and the focus is very much on independent motivation to learn, rather than just providing us with the information and getting us to learn it.
While I would love it if the state provided institutions good enough to make private schools redundant, in the absence of significant improvements in state education the argument against private education is fundamentally flawed.
Having received a scholarship and bursary to my school giving me 40% off, I feel extremely grateful to have the opportunities I had. However, I understand that those criticising private schools and their relation to oxbridge are primarily those who under-achieved at school and can't face the fact that it's ultimately their own fault. Private schools instill a work-ethic and an environment where a desire to learn isn't mocked, it doesn't hand you 11A* and a place at Magdalen college, Oxford.
Bring on the negs.

[The Doggfather]

I used to go to a Private school and the VAST majority were middle class, including me. Both my parents are teachers and probably earn about £35K each and the cost of going to that private school was just under £10,000. Many students came from a background just like mine. Yes there were a few very wealthy students but there's some very wealthy students at state schools too. Currently I go to a Grammar School and it's the exact same as Private schools. Also I'd like to point out it's mostly foreign students from places like Hong Kong who board, only a very few students from here actually board so don't get carried away with the £26,000 boarding fees.

If you have no experience of going to a private school, then don't assume. I've been to state schools, private schools and grammar schools in the past.

Why all the hate for independent schools?

[HelenOn]

(Original post by The Doggfather)
I used to go to a Private school and the VAST majority were middle class, including me. Both my parents are teachers and probably earn about £35K each and the cost of going to that private school was just under £10,000. Many students came from a background just like mine. Yes there were a few very wealthy students but there's some very wealthy students at state schools too. Currently I go to a Grammar School and it's the exact same as Private schools. Also I'd like to point out it's mostly foreign students from places like Hong Kong who board, only a very few students from here actually board so don't get carried away with the £26,000 boarding fees.

If you have no experience of going to a private school, then don't assume. I've been to state schools, private schools and grammar schools in the past.

Why all the hate for independent schools?

Is OP hating private schools? He appears to be suggesting that their charitable status should end as they are becoming more elitist, something many would agree with.

There is a big difference actually between the "lower", "middle" and "upper" fee-paying schools in class makeup and in the levels of wealth. I went to one of the middle-tier private schools and the students were a mix - there were bursary students with parents with restricted means - but quite a few of us were from very well-off homes. I have friends at college who went to the "upper" type of private school and judging from their reports, the school body was in many cases fantastically wealthy - to - just very wealthy. So it really is like a whole class system in its own right.

I doubt that the old conveyor belt from the elite public schools to Oxbridge still exists in quite that form, but the overall figures for Oxbridge entry are undeniably heavily biased to fee-paying - even though they in fact apparently are more demanding of those students. Clearly lots of things are at work in that process.

My parents are very well-off people but they mainly wanted me to be in a fee-paying school for the culture, atmosphere, who I would meet, etc, as much as the educational standards. My parents are more snobbish than I am about it.

[Lutski]

(Original post by HelenOn)
My parents are very well-off people but they mainly wanted me to be in a fee-paying school for the culture, atmosphere, who I would meet, etc, as much as the educational standards. My parents are more snobbish than I am about it.

This is the same with me, although my parents aren't THAT well off, and it was more of an issue of who I would encounter at a state school, and how one would be more comfortable where there are more students from a more sophisticated origin. I'm quite tempted to believe this, too. The other night, three students from my school got in a scrap with three guys from the town, probably who go to a state school, and their provoking attitude just doesn't help this integration which everyone seems to desire.

[Manitude]

I went to a decent enough state school and I know people who went to grammar schools, boarding schools and private schools and it has made no difference at university, where the ability to think is more important than being taught to remember the mark scheme.

[patrickinator]

(Original post by Fires)
According to a recent article in the Telegraph, a combination of the recession and steadily increasing fees means that private schools in this country are becoming more and more the prerogative of really wealthy families and foreigners.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education...xcellence.html

To summarise the main points:

* British pupil numbers in private school have fallen every year since 2008 and the fall is accelerating.

* Private school fees are on average up 4.5 per cent in 2011, according to the ISC survey; up to an average £13,800 a year for day places, and £26,000 for boarders.

* Occupations of head of households for fee-paying schools are rapidly excluding middle-class families who used to use private schools. The bankers and lawyers are still queuing up, but architects, police officers, teachers and pharmacists have melted away.

* Only 8% on average of private school children receive bursaries - this figure falls as low as 2% at the upper end of private schools. It now costs more than £150,000 to send a child to Eton for five years.

Given this situation and the increasing polarisation of the fee-paying sector, can it be right that (heavily) state-funded Oxford and Cambridge still draw nearly 50% of their students from fee-paying schools?

How can these increasingly separate and privileged institutions possibly retain charitable status? The latter should be cancelled. The former should be critiqued and changed.

if you had just the tiniest bit of intelligence you would have looked at the comments at the bottom of your article that you posted. Look at them and you will see why so many people hate labourites like you who would follow the milipedes of this world to the death so that your communist policies could come into effect to ruin this country!

[littlemissmidget123]

i go to a private school.. its about 9 or 10k a year for a 6th former, and maybe 8k for primary school.. ive come right up through it.. these days people cannot pay, or do so whilst having to remortgage their house, grandparents helping to cover the fees, and many of my friends who have been at the school since the start left or are leaving simply because they cannot afford it... its stupid and not fair.. unis are already costing us a **** load now, and parents are expected to help their kids out at uni.. how can they do that when they have sent their kid to a private school?(well okay the dont have to but name a parent who doesnt give any help to their id at uni!)
okay so the argument is that they can just go to a state school or 6th form college.. but it should not be the case.. private school should be accessible to a lost more people than it currently is.. but in relation to your question, i do not believe that you need to be VERY wealthy to send your kids to private school, but having money is a help... because theres more than fees, its uniform, trips etc etc all these costs you dont think about but need to be paid, because if not your child will be left out.. and that isnt fair.. there are increasingly however more scholarships for less well off students and families...
but sadly it really does see that this country is ****ed.. putting students into debt which they will be paying off for most of their working life with an interest rate of 6 or 7% at least.. and also ****ing their parents over with school fees and taxes.. so that they cannot even provide enough for their kids.. get a grip government!

[AeroLB]

A lot of armed forces kids at my school get ~90% of their fees paid by the MOD...

[MrLuketastic]

I go to a private school on a 100% scholarship. I come from a poor background, and I am only where I am because I work hard and have earnt my place, so for you to say it's only for the rich is pretty wrong.

Anything else you'd like to know about private schools..?

[ThumbsUp]

(Original post by gernumblies)
£13,800 a year makes mine look cheap. Sounds like you're taking very top-end schools as the basis for your argument.

I've always wondered how much it costs the government to fund one child right through state education, though. If you took everyone out of private and put them in state schools/academies they'd be in a mess.

^ an absolutely excellent point which needs to be repeatedly highlighted. In addition to this, the government are barely funding any non-public sectors of education, and they are infact turning many comprehensive schools into academies, as well as the £9K uni fees.

I would pay hundreds of thousands of pounds quite happily to keep my children away from public sector school and ensure they have a secure future and not watch them with 'fingers crossed' actually manage to get into uni.

[cl_steele]

(Original post by Fires)
According to a recent article in the Telegraph, a combination of the recession and steadily increasing fees means that private schools in this country are becoming more and more the prerogative of really wealthy families and foreigners.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education...xcellence.html

To summarise the main points:

* British pupil numbers in private school have fallen every year since 2008 and the fall is accelerating.

* Private school fees are on average up 4.5 per cent in 2011, according to the ISC survey; up to an average £13,800 a year for day places, and £26,000 for boarders.

* Occupations of head of households for fee-paying schools are rapidly excluding middle-class families who used to use private schools. The bankers and lawyers are still queuing up, but architects, police officers, teachers and pharmacists have melted away.

* Only 8% on average of private school children receive bursaries - this figure falls as low as 2% at the upper end of private schools. It now costs more than £150,000 to send a child to Eton for five years.

Given this situation and the increasing polarisation of the fee-paying sector, can it be right that (heavily) state-funded Oxford and Cambridge still draw nearly 50% of their students from fee-paying schools?

How can these increasingly separate and privileged institutions possibly retain charitable status? The latter should be cancelled. The former should be critiqued and changed.

oxbridge draw only the very best candidates whether they be rich or poor, if you want more state schooled people going to these unis improve the state sector and stop laying into the private schools which contrary to this sensationalist clap trap are not becoming the sole preserve of lawyers and lawyers?

[lyrical_lie]

(Original post by Fires)
It isn't me stereotyping, the facts are the facts, they are drawn from surveys with the Schools themselves. British private schools are becoming narrower in their class-base and they are becoming less British. The only conclusions I've drawn are the obvious ones, that the privileged route into Oxbridge for them should be closed down, as there is no conceivable reason why the taxpayer should support these private businesses' closed-loop access via compliant academics in those universities and that their charitable status should end, since they are not charities.

You should have seen my school, I don't think there was single person there who wasn't Scottish. Sure we had the Irish and Italian blood but everyone was very Scottish. Out of my friends alone the vast majority were on bursaries, myself included. I don't know enough about their charitable status to comment on that. But please, maybe my school was the exception but you just had to look at it to know it wasn't class based. There was a huge range of people and classes there, from the girls who go their own cars and were so irratating you wanted to kick them( but to be fair, were very much in the minority.) To people like myself whose mother works for a call centre for direct line and worked hard to send my sister and I to the school. You say it's to pick up a couple of extra grades. I feel this is completely incorrect. My mum didn't send us to the school we went to get better grades. Sure it was probably a consideration but I think it was more the fact when we were touring the state schools they had bars on their windows. Their huge achievement was attempting to get the children to wear school uniforms as if this was the most important achievement ever (whereas the school I went to it was just presumed by the age of 12 we knew we had to wear our uniform). So no, I excelled at my school and not in my grades, my grades were fine, you're right I could have got them in a state school. However I excelled in my experiences and character. In my school you didn't get laughed at to be involved in charity work, there was often a waiting list to get onto programs such as "the children's fund holiday" and going to lourdes with disabled children. However I know, from my friends at state schools they would get mocked for getting involved with things like that. I have no idea why, but one of my friends was bullied for being involved in fair trade. I just find this crazy. So yes, sorry for the essay but I believe that my school personally wasn't becoming foreign or class based. And I can't really remember my point after all this. I think it was along the lines of don't think we're paying for a few extra As at Higher. We went for the experience.

[HelenOn]

(Original post by ThumbsUp)
^ an absolutely excellent point which needs to be repeatedly highlighted. In addition to this, the government are barely funding any non-public sectors of education, and they are infact turning many comprehensive schools into academies, as well as the £9K uni fees.

I would pay hundreds of thousands of pounds quite happily to keep my children away from public sector school and ensure they have a secure future and not watch them with 'fingers crossed' actually manage to get into uni.

Actually the government are paying substantial amounts into the fee-paying sector, partly through charitable status tax reliefs and partly through Armed Forces bursaries, etc.

If the fee-paying schools didn't exist, quality in the state sector probably would rise, because the activist parents would ensure it would - on the other hand, elite state schools would doubtless become even more elite. It's hard to stamp on the well-off paying for privileged education.