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FA Cup Final 2012 - Liverpool Vs Chelsea

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    (Original post by pinda.college)
    What channel is it on and what time is kick off guys?
    itv/espn i believe at 5.15

    and as much as id like to believe we can beat the plastics today i doubt its gona happen
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    That's precisely my point, you get a better 'reputation' for finishing inside the top 4 than you do winning the FA cup. I bet you'd rather finish fourth (not win the league, that's obviously different) than below but grab the domestic double. Teams like Arsenal only want to get into the top 4 so that they can cover their arses for another season. It's a joke.
    So.. your whole issue is that winning the FA cup isnt such a reputation and financial boost as being involved in CL football and thats a bad thing? ..

    'Teams like Arsenal' want to finish in the top four so they can gain Champions League football and reep all the rewards that brings. Failing to see any bad side to that at all.
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    (Original post by Tommyjw)
    So.. your whole issue is that winning the FA cup isnt such a reputation and financial boost as being involved in CL football and thats a bad thing? ..

    'Teams like Arsenal' want to finish in the top four so they can gain Champions League football and reep all the rewards that brings. Failing to see any bad side to that at all.
    I'm not saying that 'teams like Arsenal' shouldn't want to get into the top 4, or that it's a bad thing. I'm saying when clubs would RATHER purely break into the top 4 (even if theoretically being told beforehand that 'you're not going to win it') over the FA cup. Compared to winning the best domestic cup in the world, i know what i'd rather pick. I think you're underestimating just how big the cup used to be.

    It just shows yet again that money is more important than actual success and domestic cups, which brings me back to my first point. Modern football is ****.
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    . I think you're underestimating just how big the cup used to be.
    I think you are underestimating how big the CL is now

    It just shows yet again that money is more important than actual success and domestic cups, which brings me back to my first point. Modern football is ****.
    Ofcourse, a business being a business and wanting the best success it can achieve, modern football is ridiculous. :facepalm2:
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    (Original post by Tommyjw)
    I think you are underestimating how big the CL is now
    WINNING the champions league, yes.

    But is appearing in it PURELY for the financial rewards a) the purpose of the CL, b) right for football in general c) genuinely better than winning the best domestic cup in the world?
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    WINNING the champions league, yes.
    Partaking in it is too...

    But is appearing in it PURELY for the financial rewards a) the purpose of the CL, b) right for football in general c) genuinely better than winning the best domestic cup in the world?
    It isnt purely for financial rewards though....
    If you want to attract the best players, you need CL football.
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    (Original post by Tommyjw)
    It isnt purely for financial rewards though....
    If you want to attract the best players, you need CL football.
    Well done clever chops, and you generally need financial rewards to sign those 'best players'. And when do those 'best players' decide to move elsewhere? When you drop out of the top 4 - both because the player doesn't want to be there and they can't afford to keep them. So it is all tied in with financial reward, isn't it.

    But anyway, this is getting away from my point, i wasn't trying to talk about the Champions League. I was saying that it's a shame how overlooked the FA cup has become. 5:15pm whilst the league is still going is absurd. I know someone who was talking to a random bloke who funnily enough worked for them, and the reason it's 5:15 is so it can get a larger american audience.
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    Well done clever chops, and you generally need financial rewards to sign those 'best players'. And when do those 'best players' decide to move elsewhere? When you drop out of the top 4 - both because the player doesn't want to be there and they can't afford to keep them. So it is all tied in with financial reward, isn't it.
    Well done you clever boy.

    A business wants to be successful, shock horror. Get over it.
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    (Original post by Tommyjw)
    A business wants to be successful, shock horror. Get over it.
    I'll spell it out again, one last time. Once upon a time 'success' (your own words) didn't mean financially. Winning an FA cup was success, and one of the greatest things any club could do.

    Using words like 'business' just backs up my point that modern football is a ruined game, even if it is true.
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    I'll spell it out again, one last time. Once upon a time 'success' (your own words) didn't mean financially. Winning an FA cup was success, and one of the greatest things any club could do.

    Using words like 'business' just backs up my point that modern football is a ruined game, even if it is true.
    Whatever you say dude, whatever you say. Your complete over-exaggerations are boring tbh and just make your argument look pathetic. Continually rambling on pretending it is an actual point about 'once upon a time' doesnt a make your incoherent crap a point valid.

    Football was a business before the 'modern game', another embarrassing point you make.
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    Oh I thought I clicked on a match thread, not a bloody business and economics one.

    Chelsea to win tonight and United to win PL:manutd:

    To those debating how the FA Cup has lost its prestige, ask yourself this. If you was a club owner, would you rather win a cup which could be a result of luck of fixtures or would you rather be in the top four of the PL which is a result of consistency? Which then leads to the opportunity to play against the best teams in Europe.

    Times have changed in football, so move with the flow or get off the next stop.

    **Please excuse any errors in this post, I am drunk right now**
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    (Original post by Tommyjw)
    Football was a business before the 'modern game', another embarrassing point you make.
    We're getting way off topic now, but do you SERIOUSLY think that it's on the same level now as it was 30 years ago?
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    We're getting way off topic now, but do you SERIOUSLY think that it's on the same level now as it was 30 years ago?
    You mean before the modern CL competition was in place which allowed greater importance and challenge for all involved countries?

    Great comparison bro.
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    (Original post by pinda.college)
    If you was a club owner, would you rather win a cup which could be a result of luck of fixtures or would you rather be in the top four of the PL which is a result of consistency?
    Fans forget when they made the top 4 if it doesn't amount to anything, people never forget winning an FA cup.

    Simple, in my opinion. But then it's just an opinion aint it.
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    (Original post by Marshyy)
    Fans forget when they made the top 4 if it doesn't amount to anything, people never forget winning an FA cup.

    Simple, in my opinion. But then it's just an opinion aint it.
    Do you think Newcastle fans will forget their battle to make the top four this season and hopefully play CL football next season? I am sure they would much prefer a top four finish rather than winning the FA Cup. Of course this is subjective and everyone will have varying opinions on the matter.
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    (Original post by pinda.college)
    Do you think Newcastle fans will forget their battle to make the top four this season and hopefully play CL football next season? I am sure they would much prefer a top four finish rather than winning the FA Cup. Of course this is subjective and everyone will have varying opinions on tha matter.
    Or to spin it another way, would those Everton fans change their top 4 finish a few seasons back for an FA cup victory that year instead? I'd bet 99% of them would.
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    Who is more likely to start tonight, Drogba or Fernando?
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    I'd pick winning the FA cup over finishing in the top 4 every single time. An FA cup is an actual trophy that goes on the club's honours list whereas in twenty years nobody remembers who finished in the top 4.

    The FA cup is real success now. Finishing in the top 4 is a possible gateway to success which may or may not ever materialise.
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    Chelsea 2 - 0 Liverpool

    Lampard 19'
    Drogba 53'
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    (Original post by bluenose14)
    The FA cup is real success now. Finishing in the top 4 is a possible gateway to success which may or may not ever materialise.
    A team who get into CL football ever year will be better financially, have better world wide reputation, and better prospective players wanting to play for them and such than a team who wins the FA cup ever year.

    Why completely ignore the benefits? CL football isnt just 'Oh we may or may not do well' Its instant £40m+, instant recognition. These are things that raise a team, profile wise and strength wise, more than the cup.

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