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    (Original post by amime)
    Where have I attacked him?

    I've attacked the idea of a personal god, because there is no empirical evidence of one meaning that belief in it is unfounded. However I haven't attacked Him/Her/it.
    Okay. I was wrong!
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    (Original post by a.partridge)

    this isn't right - it's not even wrong


    If these things were to keep the population down then they have not worked... all these things are lower than 2000 years ago except the population which is up.

    Wouldn't stopping people getting pregnant be more sensible than making babies born with diseases if you had a perfect means of population control....

    really there's no sense in any of this even if you take god as an assumption
    I have absolutely no idea what you have written.
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    (1) Let's say for arguments sake, that God is present and is up there in the sky.

    (2) Let us say that he is in charge of everything (omnipotent).


    Now consider this scenario. If there was no disease, no suffering, cancer, murder, starvation, wars (and all the other things that Atheists claim "why does God not prevent this?") tell me what the population of the world would be?

    It sounds callous but stop and think about it. If not one person in the world died from "natural disasters", cancer, starvation, murder etc, would the world be overcrowded? If people are saying TODAY THAT THE WORLD IS OVERCROWDED, imagine if no one suffered or died from an "unnatural death".
    if he is omnipotent surely e could stop overcrowding ie larger earth or less easy to have cildren
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    Sure, if we say he's all powerful then that's great, however it doesn't change the fact that if he is unwilling to help those in need and those who are suffering then he's a terrible FANTASTIC being.
    You're suggesting he's helping those who are suffering? Wow you really don't keep an eye on world events do you!
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    (Original post by garfeeled)
    if he is omnipotent surely e could stop overcrowding ie larger earth or less easy to have cildren
    Already been discussed.
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    Quite stupid, It is very unlikely they can speak English to that level without schooling.
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    (Original post by gateshipone)
    You're suggesting he's helping those who are suffering? Wow you really don't keep an eye on world events do you!
    So er, who's helping funds reach starving children in Africa?
    Who's helping the construction of schools/hospitals in the THIRD world?
    Who's helping scientists create new drugs to ease pain and suffering?

    Do you want me to go on?
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    man is.
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    So er, who's helping funds reach starving children in Africa?
    Who's helping the construction of schools/hospitals in the THIRD world?
    Who's helping scientists create new drugs to ease pain and suffering?

    Do you want me to go on?
    1)Charities and other aid groups. Granted, some are religiously motivated but not all.
    2)See above.
    3)Helping scientists? That'd be other scientists and the work done by scientist over the past few hundred years.

    Do you want me to go on?
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    Stop the Presses!!!!!!!!!!

    You are claiming that "God" is behind the suffering, attributing it to a DIVINE being.

    Yet, when it comes to helping those people, you are claiming "MAN" helps them.

    Is that not contradictory?


    You can't argue by comparing two different unrelated things. That would simply be absurd.
    I never said God is behind the suffering, just that if he exists and he's all powerful then it means he's unwilling to do anything about the suffering that's happening.
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    So we should be "spoon-fed" everything?

    And why not answer my questions?
    Because yes, I think that all of that stuff is caused by humans, because I believe the idea of a God is ridiculous, for reasons I stated. The fact that 'god' does nothing to intervene to resolve suffering throughout the world contradicts the basis of his very existence. How the hell is not having people murdered/raped/tortured/killed/lives ruined by natural disasters being 'spoon-fed'?
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    (Original post by gateshipone)
    I never said God is behind the suffering, just that if he's all powerful then it means he's unwilling to do anything about the suffering that's happening.
    So then who's behind "the suffering"?
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    So then who's behind "the suffering"?
    Humans. I don't believe there is a God.
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    (Original post by ummm)
    Because yes, I think that all of that stuff is caused by humans, because I believe the idea of a God is ridiculous, for reasons I stated. The fact that 'god' does nothing to intervene to resolve suffering throughout the world contradicts the basis of his very existence. How the hell is not having people murdered/raped/tortured/killed/lives ruined by natural disasters being 'spoon-fed'?
    What is the cause of this "suffering"?
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    (Original post by gateshipone)
    Humans. I don't believe there is a God.
    So then why should "god" be there to clean up the mess and end suffering?
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    (1) Liking God to a father is insane. He is seen as the authority figure and in charge of everything. Let's give him the title of Prime minster as he can do whatever he likes.

    (2) You assume that all the "sons who want to leave" are guilt free and are not "accountable for their actions in their life". What would your reaction be towards a serial killer who has murdered 100 women and is slowly dying of a chronic illness? Would you be sympathetic?
    *However, I do recognize and understand that not all people fall under this category.

    (3) If everyone was to die "painlessly", then why would we go through life WITH PAIN?
    1. Within his own house, a father can basically do what ever he likes. We can call him PM if you like, but the PM still lives in an overcrowded house with too many children. The only difference now is he has some kind of power over things outside of his own house.

    2. I never said the children got a chance to decide if they want to leave, the Father decides that. Good people die from all manner of things, much the same as criminals who get shot and die of their wounds.

    3. Pain is a learning tool. You reach out and touch a hot stove, it burns. That pain makes you think "That wasn't fun, I didn't enjoy that at all." So you don't do it anymore. You break your leg, it hurts. It's excruciating. "Well I'm not falling out of that tree again, and I better not try and walk on this broken leg because it hurts to even move it. If I walk on it then it's going to get seriously damaged."

    Pain teaches us what we can and can't do to our body. It also tells us when something is wrong with us. Pain is indispensible. Have you ever met someone who can't feel pain? I have a friend who doesn't feel any extreme temperatures in her hand. If she grabs a tray out of the oven at Gas Mark 9 (that's pretty hot), but she doesn't compute that it's hot then she's going to get some nasty burns. This is what pain does to us, it serves as a warning. That is why we need pain in our life.
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    He is saying this hypothetically
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    So then why should "god" be there to clean up the mess and end suffering?
    I'm saying that IF there were a God then he would be unworthy of worship due to his lack of assistance.
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    (Original post by squishy123)
    So then why should "god" be there to clean up the mess and end suffering?

    (Original post by squishy123)
    What is the cause of this "suffering"?
    I already just said I don't believe there is a god and that suffering is caused by humans and natural events. You're the one claiming the existence of a god.
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    The child doesn't believe in "mom".

    This lack of belief has nothing to do with whether or not she exists and would be equally true if it was being grown is some matrix-esque vat.

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