[Kiss]

Recently I've noticed a lot of people commenting on certain issues and citing how free speech should have it's limits - some include issues on homosexuality, race, religion and gender. But I'm pretty sure there are more there I've not listed which have gone unoticed.

(I'm going to try not to sound patronising as I just want to sound informed, but if I come across that way I do apologise)

Do we/should we limit free speech? And is the a general moral standard to befit all of society that we should all adhere to?

To me, the obvious answer is no.

Free speech is not inherently providing anyone the right to 'be immoral' and get away with it, nor is it purposely for preaching the politically correct. It cannot be changed in any other way to mean, for me, saying something without fear of being persecuted/charged/imprisoned for doing so.

But why is free speech important? If ever I hated totalitarism the most, it would be now. I can only remind myself of the greatest of dystopian fictions, and the fear they instilled in me. But the likes of this, the likes of Orwell's '1984' or Burgess' 'A Clockwork Orange' only make me hate the tyranny of those in power more. Though fictional, these video examples were based from Nazi Germany and Communist Russian influence:



However, this isn't fictional and is a result of what can happen the worst case scenario:

The revulsion at what could happen, and the hatred which rises up in oneself when you're reminded of the cruelty of humanity and the limitless capacity to cause suffering, but what does happen nowadays? We let ourselves be silenced. You cannot let your free speech be removed from you, and you must not let them intimidate you. I'd rather die for that freedom than let our liberties be raped in front of us.

As for a limitation to free speech, we must first access the current laws in the UK:

"Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights itself recognises the need for some limits on free expression. It provides, however, that limits can only be imposed in order to achieve certain specified aims, and only insofar as is necessary to achieve those aims. The Convention lists several permitted reasons for limiting free speech, including national security, the protection of health or morals, and protection of peoples' rights and reputations."

As well as that, the Human Rights Convention Article 19 guarentees the right to freedom of speech/expression of opinions/right to hold opinions:

"Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers."

And when we compare the US system we are given a slightly more lenient version which is something I prefer over the UK:

"Freedom of speech in the United States is protected by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution and by many state constitutions and state and federal laws. The freedom is not absolute; the Supreme Court of the United States has recognized several categories of speech that are excluded from the freedom of speech, and it has recognized that governments may enact reasonable time, place, or manner restrictions on speech.

Criticism of the government and advocacy of unpopular ideas that people may find distasteful or against public policy, such as racism, sexism, and other hate speech are almost always permitted."

(Yes, quoted from wikipedia but it generally the same thing)

The American system permits most forms of free expression, even the right to be openly offensive as long as it does not instill 'fighting words'.

To me personally, I think along the similar lines of the American's First Amendment - I do not agree or condone racism, sexism, homophobia, heterophobia, religious hatred, hatred for people with disabilities etc., but I will defend the people on their right to have their opinions and express them.

I don't want to call for a complete reform of what we have already, I don't want the UK to become a place where ANYTHING can be said - I do have to draw the line in some aspects such as the fighting words example, or threats to national security. And I am greatful I live in the UK where I have the freedom to say what I want (generally). But I, like many others, can't simply allow certain things to be slowly taken away - the pornography example being a recent one, as well as the plans to monitor the internet. And it seems now you can get more of time in jail for saying something than actually doing something: take the man who made the Muamba comments - I am by no means defending the content of the racism, it was quite disgusting and personally I would have wanted to hit him. But there was an example of a man who had had 3 charges of being drunken and disorderly/doing illegal drunks/assult yet was was not imprisoned.

I know some of you will say what many others have said: Why are you telling me this, I know free speech is important? I'm just giving a reminder. And today I was reminded of why I hate facism so much. You also might say that freedom of speech does not free you from being hated/belittled for what you say - I don't disagree, and if people want to be made a spectacle of then let them; but they shouldn't simply 'be shut up', as I have heard some people on this forum say.

IN SHORT, I'm simply wanting to impress the need to bear in mind one of the most important liberties we have and that though I don't want to impose a reform of free speech rules, I believe that the American free speech system is much better than the UK's.

Thanks for reading, and again sorry if I came across as arrogant/patronising. I just got really pissed off earlier and needed to vent. I await your negs - I know many of you will disagree.

[Kiss]

Also, if you have any reasons why free speech should be limited further/be abolished I'd like to hear why.

[prog2djent]

If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all. ~Noam Chomsky

[Kiss]

(Original post by prog2djent)
If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all. ~Noam Chomsky

Yeah, that's one of my favourite quotes. And I was going to add it but I forgot.............

[Voleva]

agree with op. Wish the political elite would agree though.

[Llamageddon]

How are you defining freedom of speech? On the whole I don't think there should be limitations on speech based on how revolting I find the words, but if the speech itself breaks another law that's very different, and it's there that we come into issues with protecting freedom of speech.

For those that believe in absolute freedom of speech, does this include perjury? What about public order offences? Where do you draw the line and say "that's OK, that isn't"?

[Voleva]

(Original post by Llamageddon)
How are you defining freedom of speech? On the whole I don't think there should be limitations on speech based on how revolting I find the words, but if the speech itself breaks another law that's very different, and it's there that we come into issues with protecting freedom of speech.

For those that believe in absolute freedom of speech, does this include perjury? What about public order offences? Where do you draw the line and say "that's OK, that isn't"?

calling for murder / violence.

[Kiss]

(Original post by Llamageddon)
How are you defining freedom of speech? On the whole I don't think there should be limitations on speech based on how revolting I find the words, but if the speech itself breaks another law that's very different, and it's there that we come into issues with protecting freedom of speech.

For those that believe in absolute freedom of speech, does this include perjury? What about public order offences? Where do you draw the line and say "that's OK, that isn't"?

I think I want to define it based roughly on the American FA's style - you can say what you want as long as you're not actually incurring 'fighting words'.

Well I mentioned already of the examples where someone was given a longer time in prison for simply saying something than doing something - that leads into many different things like actions speak louder than words vs. pen mighter than sword. But using common sense, imprisonment for saying something seems ludicrous. I do believe there has to be a limit on freedom of speech, but only to prevent fighting words. But then you couldn't exactly call it 'free speech' if you couldn't say anything you want? I'm not advocating absolute free speech though, but certainly free-er than what we have currently.