Results are out! Find what you need...fast. Get quick advice or join the chat
Hey there! Sign in to have your say on this topicNew here? Join for free to post

Why is there more support for UKIP?

This thread is sponsored by:
Announcements Posted on
    • Thread Starter
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    For the past few days I have noticed more people announcing their support for the UKIP party.

    I don't really understand it.

    Some are saying that it was their protest vote, saying all the main parties are all the same. I mean, if that's true why not vote for the Green Party or another less controversial one.

    I read through some of the policies and positions and tbh they seem a little extreme.

    Things like:
    -repealing the human rights act,
    -scraping most/all green energy and going nuclear all the way as they don't believe global warming is proven(wut?)
    -increasing our defence spending substantially to ensure we stay relevant on the world stage(why more wars?)
    -freezing permanent immigration for FIVE years?

    I think most people are supporting them due to the EU immigration situation and since none of the other parties agree with that, they feel they must vote for UKIP regardless of their other policies.

    What do you think? Did you vote for UKIP, if yes, why?
    • 9 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    Abolishing the Human Rights Act is not extreme.

    Firstly, we've had human rights in this country a lot longer than since 1998... Secondly, it's just a recipe for abuse. Look at Abu Qatada for a current example. Then look at all the criminals who use human rights as an excuse to avoid/delay punishment or deportation. It's a sick and expensive joke.

    Wind power is inefficient and costly and destroys beauty spots. And because the wind doesn't always blow, it needs backing up with traditional coal stations. Hardly green, is it? Nuclear by contrast is very green, as much as the usual suspects would prefer to pretend it's not.

    We need to be able to protect ourselves and our dependent territories. Had we not given up on Defence in the 1970s, the Falklands would never have been invaded.

    5 years is an arbitrary number and I don't necessarily support it. I do however support the principle that we should be able to choose who we let in, and not be forced to let in people just because they're 'EU Citizens'.


    I'm not even a Ukip-voter...
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    couldnt agree more with the above, the human rights act is being abused to allow people to stay in this country when they shouldn't be here. I read on bbc a few months ago how and someone who came to this country illegally was driving without a license, hit and killed a 4 year old girl and drove off. When eventually caught, he was bailed, and when it came to court and they wanted to deport him, his lawyer said it was against his human rights as in the time during which he was bailed, he had gotten another person pregnant and it was apparently against his human rights to be separated from his baby, despite the fact he had killed someones child. This the kind of **** that is making people disillusioned with the main parties, as they're too scared to do anything controversia
    • Thread Starter
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I don't agree about your example about wind power - as wind power =/= all green energy, and I can sort of see the point of being able to defend our territories, especially the British Isles but the overseas territories, meh, altho the Falklands situation I am ignorant on.

    I just find it sad then that people have to compromise on some of their principles just to get something that they believe they need to get e.g. a option of EU membership, etc. I guess more support for UKIP or other less mainstream parties should have a sharp prodding effect on the main parties and divide them a little more as they make new, more in-touch policies.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    plus they want us out of europe which would save us billions a year which could go towards helping the country get out of the recession.

    I have no issue with immigration, as long as people coming in are prepared to work, not just jump onto our benefits system. So maybe a 5 year freeze is required to sort out all the legal logistical crap that is stopping people who actually need help getting it
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by laptopuser)
    For the past few days I have noticed more people announcing their support for the UKIP party.

    I don't really understand it.

    Some are saying that it was their protest vote, saying all the main parties are all the same. I mean, if that's true why not vote for the Green Party or another less controversial one.

    I read through some of the policies and positions and tbh they seem a little extreme.

    Things like:
    -repealing the human rights act,
    -scraping most/all green energy and going nuclear all the way as they don't believe global warming is proven(wut?)
    -increasing our defence spending substantially to ensure we stay relevant on the world stage(why more wars?)
    -freezing permanent immigration for FIVE years?

    I think most people are supporting them due to the EU immigration situation and since none of the other parties agree with that, they feel they must vote for UKIP regardless of their other policies.

    What do you think? Did you vote for UKIP, if yes, why?
    -There is no evidence of global warming in 10 years.
    -increasing defense spending does not mean they want more wars.
    -freezing immigration for 5 years is necessary to deal with the massed, open border immigration to the whole of eastern europe. It also gives time to deport illegal immigrants.
    -After the 5 years UKIP support immigration if they have work permits and are skilled workers that will benefit the country. They support a points based system similar to Australia.

    I like UKIP because they support EU withdrawal, smaller government, controlled immigration, lower taxes (including a flat rate tax), and grammar schools. Why the hell would I support the Green party?
    • 37 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    When the economy is in bad shape and the protest party has become the party of power, the protest goes elsewhere. Mainly in the form of anti-international fervour. Hence UKIP.
    • 48 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Cheese_Monster)
    When the economy is in bad shape and the protest party has become the party of power, the protest goes elsewhere. Mainly in the form of anti-international fervour. Hence UKIP.
    Anti EU.

    Probably because people agree with them OP.
    • 4 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Libertarian_Walrus)
    -increasing defense spending does not mean they want more wars.
    -freezing immigration for 5 years is necessary to deal with the massed, open border immigration to the whole of eastern europe. It also gives time to deport illegal immigrants.
    -After the 5 years UKIP support immigration if they have work permits and are skilled workers that will benefit the country. They support a points based system similar to Australia.

    Why the hell would I support the Green party?
    You're name is "Libertarian_Walrus",

    - I agree with their energy policies on principle, and that "global warming" has been vastly over-stated, however, I suspect they would provide subsidies for nuclear power, which is un-libertarian, withdrawing investment from wind energy and instead funding nuclear, is basically corporate welfare, they fund the people they like, and not the other. Very statist.

    - Increased defense spending is a very un-libertarian and an anti-economic liberal stance, I understand they don't want to be involved in all sorts of these wars, but they seem happy with occupation and national Defense (strong military, but not necassarily an active one). I think you are making excuses here.

    - Stopping immigration for 5 years, is again, very, VERY un-libertarian and un-right wing, the free movement of labour is a fundamentaly economic liberal/right wing policy, they also want to combat the welfare state, if they dismantle most of that, then shouldn't have the strict immigration policy, as those that come here, are coming as part of private industry. Its a big hypocricy IMO.

    - The points and permits system is very statist, not to mention all the controls they want of the internet, freedom of speach, religion, want to pour lots of moeny into school schemes they like, install "Brtitish Values" again, which can only come artificially by the state, this all sounds very nanny-statish. Conservatives are usually hypocrites when it comes to "small government" anyway, all they mean is ultra-capitalism and social conservativism. A living oxymoron.

    And lastly, if you really are a libertarian, the Green parties stance on Drugs, gay marriage, foreign policy and national defense are all socially libertarian (and economic if you count the anti-statist miliraty policies) and should interest you. I know farage leans to drug criminalisation, but it isn't the overall party line.


    But I'd say the greens and UKIP are as libertarian as each other in difference respects.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    I don't know why specifically UKIP, other than because they have an appealing name, but generally guys like UKIP, Green, Respect and independents are getting more success because the Conservatives have shown their true colours so soon after gaining power from a defeated Labour government, and even then they didn't gain power strictly via public vote.

    So for the first time in a while people are thinking "Conservatives are scum, but Labour were ****, and I can't even vote Lib Dems because they're complete liars while Clegg's in charge. I know, the newspapers told me so." so they're just going for independents and smaller parties. Hopefully it's the start of something wonderful. Probably not.
    • 5 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by laptopuser)
    For the past few days I have noticed more people announcing their support for the UKIP party.

    I don't really understand it.

    Some are saying that it was their protest vote, saying all the main parties are all the same. I mean, if that's true why not vote for the Green Party or another less controversial one.

    I read through some of the policies and positions and tbh they seem a little extreme.

    Things like:
    -repealing the human rights act,
    -scraping most/all green energy and going nuclear all the way as they don't believe global warming is proven(wut?)
    -increasing our defence spending substantially to ensure we stay relevant on the world stage(why more wars?)
    -freezing permanent immigration for FIVE years?

    I think most people are supporting them due to the EU immigration situation and since none of the other parties agree with that, they feel they must vote for UKIP regardless of their other policies.

    What do you think? Did you vote for UKIP, if yes, why?
    It certainly was a protest vote.

    A lot of people are unemployed, with many more only on part time jobs, or on low paid jobs, so people's living standards are declining. A lot of these people want to blame their predicament on something else, but don't know what - they are confused.

    Along comes UKIP, and tells them that their problems should be blamed on immigrants, and the EU, and, unfortunately, to a lot of ignorant people this makes sense, especially because it fits in with what the Daily Mail and Daily Express are always telling them, so they go ahead and vote UKIP.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    The Green party will never win, with UKIP we know there's a chance. Also, a small party will be careful to do what they promise, otherwsie they'll never be re-elected.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by prog2djent)
    You're name is "Libertarian_Walrus",

    - I agree with their energy policies on principle, and that "global warming" has been vastly over-stated, however, I suspect they would provide subsidies for nuclear power, which is un-libertarian, withdrawing investment from wind energy and instead funding nuclear, is basically corporate welfare, they fund the people they like, and not the other. Very statist.

    - Increased defense spending is a very un-libertarian and an anti-economic liberal stance, I understand they don't want to be involved in all sorts of these wars, but they seem happy with occupation and national Defense (strong military, but not necassarily an active one). I think you are making excuses here.

    - Stopping immigration for 5 years, is again, very, VERY un-libertarian and un-right wing, the free movement of labour is a fundamentaly economic liberal/right wing policy, they also want to combat the welfare state, if they dismantle most of that, then shouldn't have the strict immigration policy, as those that come here, are coming as part of private industry. Its a big hypocricy IMO.

    - The points and permits system is very statist, not to mention all the controls they want of the internet, freedom of speach, religion, want to pour lots of moeny into school schemes they like, install "Brtitish Values" again, which can only come artificially by the state, this all sounds very nanny-statish. Conservatives are usually hypocrites when it comes to "small government" anyway, all they mean is ultra-capitalism and social conservativism. A living oxymoron.

    And lastly, if you really are a libertarian, the Green parties stance on Drugs, gay marriage, foreign policy and national defense are all very libertarian.

    The rest, is not.

    But I'd say the greens and UKIP are as libertarian as each other in difference respects.
    You do make some good points here, and I agree that UKIP isn't fully libertarian, but I think that they are the most libertarian UK party. Their economic policies are liberatian (lower taxes, cuts in spending, smaller government). I do wish they would make more libertarian policies though, such as legalising/decriminalising drugs etc.

    Your point about UKIP wanting more control over the internet though is very wrong. They opposed the ACTA bill and Farage said he will oppose any other similar bills.

    As for Defense spending, Ron Paul makes the point that it is important to have a strong defense, and defense spending is different to military spending. I think UKIP hold a similar position. UKIP opposed the Iraq war.

    In terms of immigration, Libertarians are split on it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberta...on_immigration
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by prog2djent)
    EDIT: If you are going to neg me atleast provide a ******* response to each of my points.
    Reps are a good exercise in psychology, but in short if someone neg reps you, they're angry because they don't have any way to counter your point. I should no, I'm the negspert.
    • 4 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by mp373)
    plus they want us out of europe which would save us billions a year which could go towards helping the country get out of the recession.

    I have no issue with immigration, as long as people coming in are prepared to work, not just jump onto our benefits system. So maybe a 5 year freeze is required to sort out all the legal logistical crap that is stopping people who actually need help getting it
    Leaving the EU right now would just put us into a much worse recession, which will take several more years to get out of.

    As for OP, I think the majority of people who vote for UKIP do so because they only think of one of their political aims - leaving the EU. Of course these are the people who think that the commission is just imposing laws onto us at their whim, without considering that there is a European Parliament, Council and European Council, and the fact that laws are only valid if we confer the powers to them in the first place.
    • 0 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by zaliack)
    Leaving the EU right now would just put us into a much worse recession, which will take several more years to get out of.

    As for OP, I think the majority of people who vote for UKIP do so because they only think of one of their political aims - leaving the EU. Of course these are the people who think that the commission is just imposing laws onto us at their whim, without considering that there is a European Parliament, Council and European Council, and the fact that laws are only valid if we confer the powers to them in the first place.
    We pay around £50 million a day to the EU
    • 1 follower
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    The Conservatives aren't right wing nor conservative any more.
    • 36 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    You've listed the reasons for UKIP's growing popularity in the OP. UKIP are becoming more popular because they're not afraid to tackle the institutional idiocy protected by the Big Three. Take claim-it change for example. While the environment cause may be a noble one in theory, in practice it's meant widespread European unemployment as manufacturing offshores to places like China and India and the rise of a class of subisidy chasers who've jumped on the green energy bandwagon to line their own pockets. Whether claim-it change is man made or not UKIP's argument is that fleecing the public is a totally counter productive measure to a problem that may not even exist.

    UKIP is the party for bloody minded folk who prepared to tackle the tyranny of the status quo.
    • 1 follower
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by zaliack)
    Leaving the EU right now would just put us into a much worse recession, which will take several more years to get out of.

    As for OP, I think the majority of people who vote for UKIP do so because they only think of one of their political aims - leaving the EU. Of course these are the people who think that the commission is just imposing laws onto us at their whim, without considering that there is a European Parliament, Council and European Council, and the fact that laws are only valid if we confer the powers to them in the first place.
    Surely your not one of these fools that believe Britain can't trade with Europe without been in the EU?

    How did we trade before when we were the "Workshop of the World"? How does China trade with Europe when its not in the EU?
    • 36 followers
    Offline

    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Libertarian_Walrus)
    You do make some good points here, and I agree that UKIP isn't fully libertarian, but I think that they are the most libertarian UK party. Their economic policies are liberatian (lower taxes, cuts in spending, smaller government). I do wish they would make more libertarian policies though, such as legalising/decriminalising drugs etc.

    Your point about UKIP wanting more control over the internet though is very wrong. They opposed the ACTA bill and Farage said he will oppose any other similar bills.

    As for Defense spending, Ron Paul makes the point that it is important to have a strong defense, and defense spending is different to military spending. I think UKIP hold a similar position. UKIP opposed the Iraq war.

    In terms of immigration, Libertarians are split on it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberta...on_immigration
    Farage has gone on record as being pro-legalisation. Once again they're the only party willing to take a common sense viewpoint and argue for a cause the lib/lab/con coalition are too afraid to touch.

Reply

Submit reply

Register

Thanks for posting! You just need to create an account in order to submit the post
  1. this can't be left blank
    that username has been taken, please choose another Forgotten your password?
  2. this can't be left blank
    this email is already registered. Forgotten your password?
  3. this can't be left blank

    6 characters or longer with both numbers and letters is safer

  4. this can't be left empty
    your full birthday is required
  1. By joining you agree to our Ts and Cs, privacy policy and site rules

  2. Slide to join now Processing…

Updated: May 7, 2012
New on TSR

GCSE English mock revision

Revise together & check out past papers

Article updates
Useful resources
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.