[quattro94]

(Original post by antimilitarist)
How is this "Simply not true"? The cuts to public services expose their desire to wither away the welfare state and privatising aspects of the NHS is hardly left wing - why not cut spending on war and nuclear weapons to prevent its bankruptcy? I'm not sure why you're referring to the AV referendum when they campaigned extensively against it as they will always be against electoral reform since they well know the only thing that is keeping them in power is the first past the post system and their educational reforms are in reality cuts to state education. If they are maintaining higher tax rates for the rich then why did they cut the 50p tax rate and why are they letting company bosses receive giant salary bonuses while their employees wages are decreasing? Cameron apparently advocates a "Big Society" and he also said he wouldn't make any cuts to the NHS. Just because he says it does it mean it's true? The Conservatives are not even remotely left wing.

you are missing the point. They haven't removed the NHS, real terms NHS spending has actually increased. The cuts are to make the system work for the more deserving case example- my dad can barely walk 100 yards. Next door there is a guy with a blue badge in his car that spends most of his time messing with said car and spending his job seekers. Are you seriously going to tell me that we should pay for him to do that, and deny people like my dad? Funding is NOT infinite. The fact that they allowed a referendum puts them as more left that labour who quietly forgot that pledge. Education can deal with cuts it needs reform. Another example- my high school, the head spent over £30,000 on computer monitors, £150,000 on new windows and £50,000 on thumbprint doors but refused to hire a second physics teacher. We had one physics teacher for 600 pupils. That needs correcting, and this isn't an isolated case either. I know of similar ones within the county I live in so I can only imagine what it is like in some places. Yet again you are simple wrong on tax. government reports indicate that a top rate of 36% would be most efficient. Rich people aren't stupid, if you tax them too much, they go, taking their money with them. People like yourself mean that the government is losing revenue due to political perceptions. As for the NHS cuts there haven't been any. Honestly, look beyond the headlines for yourself. The NHS is being reformed and it is about time too. People always defend it for just existing. The NHS ought to provide universal care first before it should even be considered to be doing its job and that at the moment is certainly not the case.

[ScheduleII]

(Original post by Tedaus)
Respect is a ridiculous party. It's less the equivalent of UKIP, than it is to the Tea Party in USA.

Tea Party, through their influence on the Republican party, have MUCH more influence over US politics than either UKIP or Respect do here.

[tc92]

(Original post by MagicNMedicine)
It's interesting that if you look at p.6 of the latest GDP estimate http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/dcp171778_263578.pdf that the only sector that has grown every quarter is "government".

a) the government is spending (and borrowing) more than its predecessors. Merely papering over the cracks.

b) Gov't: 1.3/0.1/0.4/0.4/0.2 = 2.4%
water supply, sewerage etc.: 5.8/-2.2/0.1/1.4/0.5 = 5.6%
I know which one I'd rather have.

[antimilitarist]

(Original post by quattro94)
you are missing the point. They haven't removed the NHS, real terms NHS spending has actually increased. The cuts are to make the system work for the more deserving case example- my dad can barely walk 100 yards. Next door there is a guy with a blue badge in his car that spends most of his time messing with said car and spending his job seekers. Are you seriously going to tell me that we should pay for him to do that, and deny people like my dad? Funding is NOT infinite. The fact that they allowed a referendum puts them as more left that labour who quietly forgot that pledge. Education can deal with cuts it needs reform. Another example- my high school, the head spent over £30,000 on computer monitors, £150,000 on new windows and £50,000 on thumbprint doors but refused to hire a second physics teacher. We had one physics teacher for 600 pupils. That needs correcting, and this isn't an isolated case either. I know of similar ones within the county I live in so I can only imagine what it is like in some places. Yet again you are simple wrong on tax. government reports indicate that a top rate of 36% would be most efficient. Rich people aren't stupid, if you tax them too much, they go, taking their money with them. People like yourself mean that the government is losing revenue due to political perceptions. As for the NHS cuts there haven't been any. Honestly, look beyond the headlines for yourself. The NHS is being reformed and it is about time too. People always defend it for just existing. The NHS ought to provide universal care first before it should even be considered to be doing its job and that at the moment is certainly not the case.

I'm aware that they haven't removed the NHS altogether but they are in the slow process of doing so. NHS spending might have increased slightly but they aren't stopping the introduction of more private contractors in the NHS, I don't want Richard Branson having significant control over our healthcare to make a profit out of us. He has enough money as it is! In reference to your dad and neighbour why do we have to choose between the two? Why can they not both be treated by the NHS? It belongs to everyone. I know funding isn't infinite but the money can be taken from elsewhere. Cut war and tax the profits out of co-operations ffs.

The only reason the Tories had a referendum on electoral reform was because they were forced to as part of the coalition agreement and they made sure it wouldn't be the electoral reform that would win the vote - PR. I agree education needs a large amount of reform but how is cutting it going to increase it's quality and how is an unemployed 19 year old like myself to blame for the government losing revenue when co-operations are deliberately dodging taxes? The NHS needs to be reformed by having more investment and funding to abolish waiting lists and prescription charges but steadily private healthcare is gaining more influence. I do defend the NHS existing because I believe that everyone has the right to well funded healthcare free of charge which is something Thatcherites tend to disagree with. I am just making a point that the coalition government is not left wing in any sense and neither is the labour opposition for that matter.

[Keckers]

(Original post by antimilitarist)
I'm aware that they haven't removed the NHS altogether but they are in the slow process of doing so. NHS spending might have increased slightly but they aren't stopping the introduction of more private contractors in the NHS, I don't want Richard Branson having significant control over our healthcare to make a profit out of us. He has enough money as it is! In reference to your dad and neighbour why do we have to choose between the two? Why can they not both be treated by the NHS? It belongs to everyone. I know funding isn't infinite but the money can be taken from elsewhere. Cut war and tax the profits out of co-operations ffs.

The only reason the Tories had a referendum on electoral reform was because they were forced to as part of the coalition agreement and they made sure it wouldn't be the electoral reform that would win the vote - PR. I agree education needs a large amount of reform but how is cutting it going to increase it's quality and how is an unemployed 19 year old like myself to blame for the government losing revenue when co-operations are deliberately dodging taxes? The NHS needs to be reformed by having more investment and funding to abolish waiting lists and prescription charges but steadily private healthcare is gaining more influence. I do defend the NHS existing because I believe that everyone has the right to well funded healthcare free of charge which is something Thatcherites tend to disagree with. I am just making a point that the coalition government is not left wing in any sense and neither is the labour opposition for that matter.

Firstly, the tories have explicitly stated time and time again that the NHS will always remain free at the point of service. To say anything otherwise just shows ignorance.

Education needs reform, what it doesn't need is more tax payer money being thrown at it, which is what governments have been doing for the past 25 years.

When you say co-operations, do you mean co-operative run businesses or are you confusing it with corporations? In which case corporations are ridiculously wealthy because governments give them special treatment, both with regards to competition policy (which often favours one corporation over another) and corporate welfare.

Just to note that I am not a supporter of the Conservative party, however I do agree with some of their policies (as I do with every other party).

[antimilitarist]

(Original post by Keckers)
Firstly, the tories have explicitly stated time and time again that the NHS will always remain free at the point of service. To say anything otherwise just shows ignorance.

Education needs reform, what it doesn't need is more tax payer money being thrown at it, which is what governments have been doing for the past 25 years.

When you say co-operations, do you mean co-operative run businesses or are you confusing it with corporations? In which case corporations are ridiculously wealthy because governments give them special treatment, both with regards to competition policy (which often favours one corporation over another) and corporate welfare.

Just to note that I am not a supporter of the Conservative party, however I do agree with some of their policies (as I do with every other party).

The NHS is not free in every aspect though. Prescription charges, dental treatment, eye care ect and it's quality is generally in decline while private health care is gaining more influence.

I agree education desperately needs some reform with reduced class sizes and more teachers but I don't see how increased funding would harm this.

And I did mean corporations excuse my bad spelling.

[meenu89]

(Original post by antimilitarist)
You tell me how tripleling university tuition fees and allowing private companies to sponsor state schools is lefty.

Isn't that what New Labour done?

[antimilitarist]

(Original post by meenu89)
Isn't that what New Labour done?

Indeed it is and the Tories have continued this policy. I didn't say New Labour were left wing btw.

[meenu89]

(Original post by antimilitarist)
Indeed it is and the Tories have continued this policy. I didn't say New Labour were left wing btw.

I know you didn't. I was just remarking on how your post could apply to new Labour.

[Stanley Baldwin]

Ken Clarke's aim for rehabilitation over imprisonment is probably one such example.

Emphasis on foreign aid too?

[pinkfreekyfrog]

(Original post by ukip72)
Don't kid yourself. Cameron fully supports EU dictatorship and will adopt votes for prisoners because the EU says he must. He has no choice in the matter, the will of Brussels matters.

Gay marriage: Just because proper Tories oppose it. Officially the party supports it. Cameron will abandon conservative principles and ram it through parliament with a 3 line whip. (just like he did to stop an EU referendum).

PROPER TORIES PREFER UKIP.

We have to do what the EU says, that is the deal! He has done more than other leaders by even having a Commons debate about the EU. And I think the Gay marriage thing is more about morals than ideology. (I know that is gonna open a can of worms, sorry) Raming it through is a bit of an hyperbole, gay marriage should be a right not a priviledge!

(Original post by Tedaus)
I mean one that's as popular as UKIP seems to be becoming.

THE GREEN PARTY!!

(Original post by Steevee)
Nope. Nope it's not

Nahh, s'all about Supply-Side

What is Supply-side? I lack economics knowledge...
And feminism rules!!

[Steevee]

(Original post by pinkfreekyfrog)
We have to do what the EU says, that is the deal! He has done more than other leaders by even having a Commons debate about the EU. And I think the Gay marriage thing is more about morals than ideology. (I know that is gonna open a can of worms, sorry) Raming it through is a bit of an hyperbole, gay marriage should be a right not a priviledge!



THE GREEN PARTY!!



What is Supply-side? I lack economics knowledge...
And feminism rules!!

Basically Supply-side economic theory says that to maxamise wealth and efficiency you must remove barriers to the trading of services and goods. This tends to manifest itself with deregulation of the private sector and lowering of capital gains tax and such like. It's the opposition to Keynesian economic theory, which promotes government intervention in the private sector. Personally I think we do need a balance of the two, but up until the 70's the school of thought had been mainly Keynesian which led to a thing called Stagflation. Now, some have ascribed the failings of of 2008/09 to Supply-side style economics, which is fine, they are not perfect. But my issue is there have been loud calls from the Left to return to the same Keynesian model as we had in the 60's, which totally ignores how the markets have changed in the last 50 years.

Eh. Feminism by the dictionary definition is good, yes. But 'Feminism' today most certainly does not.

[ed-]

(Original post by pinkfreekyfrog)
I know supposedly we are a liberal country, but can you name any left-wing policies the Torries have propounded? To me they mostly seem to center around their 'Pillars of Society'. Plus it is not so clear who's policy is who's when the are in a coalition.

Thank you

Liberal doesn't = left wing

We live in a liberal democracy. So we have free and fair elections, a peaceful transfer of power after elections, tolerance of differing views, free information, accountable government (etc.)

I'm not sure if the Conservatives will have put left wing policies into place themselves, but they've kept some left wing ideas after getting into power. Like the welfare state - even Thatcher left the NHS alone.

[pinkfreekyfrog]

(Original post by Steevee)
Basically Supply-side economic theory says that to maxamise wealth and efficiency you must remove barriers to the trading of services and goods. This tends to manifest itself with deregulation of the private sector and lowering of capital gains tax and such like. It's the opposition to Keynesian economic theory, which promotes government intervention in the private sector. Personally I think we do need a balance of the two, but up until the 70's the school of thought had been mainly Keynesian which led to a thing called Stagflation. Now, some have ascribed the failings of of 2008/09 to Supply-side style economics, which is fine, they are not perfect. But my issue is there have been loud calls from the Left to return to the same Keynesian model as we had in the 60's, which totally ignores how the markets have changed in the last 50 years.

Eh. Feminism by the dictionary definition is good, yes. But 'Feminism' today most certainly does not.

Thanks

What is wrong with Feminism today?

[ed-]

(Original post by pinkfreekyfrog)
Thanks

What is wrong with Feminism today?

What's the need for feminism today? Women got the vote, and all the other rights.

[Steevee]

(Original post by pinkfreekyfrog)
Thanks

What is wrong with Feminism today?

In my opinion 'Feminism' today tends to manifest in the promotion of women beyond equality, such that it is discriminatory toward men, along with a lot of pseudo social science nonsense. I'm all for Feminism fighting for equal rights for women in other countries, but when I hear self proclaimed 'Feminists' in this country talk about how society is conspiring to keep women down with skinny models and whatnot I just laugh. The same goes for a lot of the same old tired arguments about wage gaps, and the total hypocrisy I see where statistics are used in any process regarding gender.

[pinkfreekyfrog]

(Original post by ed-)
What's the need for feminism today? Women got the vote, and all the other rights.

They DON'T have all other rights! Women still suffer sexism in every day life. Unemployment among women is higher, there is still an unfair pay gap, not to mention sexist language, porn, labeling of women by what they wear or say, the list goes on.

And Feminism is world wide, women are still oppressed in 2012 and you ask why we need feminsim...

Why shouldn't there not be Feminism today?

[ed-]

(Original post by pinkfreekyfrog)
They DON'T have all other rights! Women still suffer sexism in every day life. Unemployment among women is higher, there is still an unfair pay gap, not to mention sexist language, porn, labeling of women by what they wear or say, the list goes on.

And Feminism is world wide, women are still oppressed in 2012 and you ask why we need feminsim...

Why shouldn't there not be Feminism today?

Great - men suffer sexism too as the post above yours pointed out.
It often happens, when a group is opressed, that when they get their rights they actually become more powerful than those who oppressed them. Gay rights for example - they march around in 'gay pride' marches. If there were to be a straight march it would be stopped immediatly.

As for you points about discrimination against women:
Unemployment proves nothing - maybe you should look at the proportion of men working as nurses, or childminders (etc.) I agree that women aren't fairly represented in Parliament though
The pay gap is unfair to some extent but in some jobs it's neccesary (manual work, for example) as women aren't as capable at the job. It's just a fact that women are genetically not as strong.
Sexist language? Like what? Women have their own terms that could be considered sexist. I watch the Big Bang Theory and that girl constantly calling the guys 'sweetie' is really annoying.
Men are in porn to ............. and it's peoples' choice whether to be a pornstar, not yours.
Men are labelled for what they wear and say! Everyone is! Have you never made a remark on someone's appearence or what they've said? That's just as ridiculous as the porn point.

There shouldn't be feminism today because women have equal rights. Any more rights they get is counter productive to men.
If you go on to the Daily Mail website you'll see a section called 'Femail'. In my opinion that is sexist
If you watch a program on BBC 3 called World Championship Dating (or something) you'll notice that the whole point of the program is for the men to impress the women. If the women don't like the men they get to press a button to send them away. That is sexist. That's portraying dating as a farce where it's entirly up to the male impress the female.
Basically you have to accept that things aren't entirely equal. Yes women aren't represented by even half in Parliament but they do get it better in a load of other respects

[Harbour]

(Original post by pinkfreekyfrog)
Well then, can you name me some leftie policies please?

I was going to, but so many have been listed here for you I feel my own meagre contribution would be of no further value to you!
Support of gay marriage, paying lip service to euro-scepticism (but in reality the leadership are as pro-EU as any Lib-Dem), soft immigration policy and similar line on law and order, despite the tough talk in opposition. These are a few off the top of my head, there are many more, rest assured.
I wouldn't mind so much if there actual, 'I'm a liberal Conservative' policies were released and campaigned on before the election. That's democracy and if they were endorsed on such a platform, as a democrat I would accept that. But its criminal to decieve and dupe the public in the shameless way Cameron has. I hope he pays the price for it.

[pinkfreekyfrog]

(Original post by ed-)
Great - men suffer sexism too as the post above yours pointed out.
It often happens, when a group is opressed, that when they get their rights they actually become more powerful than those who oppressed them. Gay rights for example - they march around in 'gay pride' marches. If there were to be a straight march it would be stopped immediatly.

As for you points about discrimination against women:
Unemployment proves nothing - maybe you should look at the proportion of men working as nurses, or childminders (etc.) I agree that women aren't fairly represented in Parliament though
The pay gap is unfair to some extent but in some jobs it's neccesary (manual work, for example) as women aren't as capable at the job. It's just a fact that women are genetically not as strong.
Sexist language? Like what? Women have their own terms that could be considered sexist. I watch the Big Bang Theory and that girl constantly calling the guys 'sweetie' is really annoying.
Men are in porn to ............. and it's peoples' choice whether to be a pornstar, not yours.
Men are labelled for what they wear and say! Everyone is! Have you never made a remark on someone's appearence or what they've said? That's just as ridiculous as the porn point.

There shouldn't be feminism today because women have equal rights. Any more rights they get is counter productive to men.
If you go on to the Daily Mail website you'll see a section called 'Femail'. In my opinion that is sexist
If you watch a program on BBC 3 called World Championship Dating (or something) you'll notice that the whole point of the program is for the men to impress the women. If the women don't like the men they get to press a button to send them away. That is sexist. That's portraying dating as a farce where it's entirly up to the male impress the female.
Basically you have to accept that things aren't entirely equal. Yes women aren't represented by even half in Parliament but they do get it better in a load of other respects

Ok let me just stop you there! NONE OF MY POINTS ARE RIDICULOUS IT IS MY OPINION! People would not star in porn if there was no requirement for it i.e. men.
'Sweetie' is a term of endearment, if you don't like it don't watch it!
Ever heard of asymetrical language, the generic he... the list goes on
THe dating show is not sexist, it's a game show and no I watch other things...
And so women aren't allowed to be sexist but men are? Women suffered centries of oppression and still do...time for men to know how it feels so stop moaning and get a grip
Not all men are physically stronger, I know plenty of women you do manual labour...not to mention housewives!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!