[Tinberry]

I always wonder ( usually while stuck on a stationary train) why train in this country have such a bad record compared to other countries. Our rail system fails across the board on running times, value for money and customer satisfaction. How can other countries manage their railways so.much better? What is it that makes us so different?
As a daily rail commuter I honestly cant remember the last time my train arrived on time. Usually its only 5 minutes but often I end up waiting ages before giving up and finding alternative transport.
Is there a solution or at least an explanation?

[electriic_ink]

A lot of routes are run by companies who have monopolised a particular route, which I'm sure must be a factor.

[StarsAreFixed]

I would have thought that competition would mean better value, but it's not the case. Here in ROI there is only one train company (which is part of the one transport company covering everything). Trains are on time and comparatively cheap for similar distances and good discounts for buying online. You don't have to book way ahead to get a price, the price you get on the day itself is the same as booking before, just online has a discount. No fluctuation apart from that.

So..maybe one company monopolising it is a good thing? Though you would think the opposite. It also came to mind in the wake of the awful Paddington train crash that it can't happen here as we only have the one company.

[mimx]

Trains here are expensive compared to other countries, but other than that I don't think they're that bad.

[tamimi]

I think they're doing fine. I've lived in enough countries to know the difference.

I find that those of my friends who always lived in the UK have no idea how good they have it. In general, not just transport.

But heyho. I think the only country with a far superior train system would be Japan. Sehr impressive.

[callum9999]

(Original post by StarsAreFixed)
So..maybe one company monopolising it is a good thing? Though you would think the opposite. It also came to mind in the wake of the awful Paddington train crash that it can't happen here as we only have the one company.

Why would only having one company stop train crashes?

And to answer the original question, it's not nearly as bad as people imagine they are. People have a romanticised image of European trains, and their flagship high speed lines are generally very good, but on the whole there is nothing enormously different in price and quality. In fact, I often find equivalent journeys in the UK much cheaper than journeys I've made on the continent (with our "advance" or megatrain tickets). Plus our ticketing is far superior to the majority of Europe anyway - most places seem to force you to buy tickets for a particular train and time.

[mimx]

In my experience trains on the continent are cheaper but they're not that great. I'm rarely on a late train here, but the big thing we have is regular service and services to more places.


Honestly it's 1 train a day between major cities in some wealthy European countries. Virgin alone do 10 from Glasgow to London before it's even 11am.

[StarsAreFixed]

(Original post by callum9999)
Why would only having one company stop train crashes?

And to answer the original question, it's not nearly as bad as people imagine they are. People have a romanticised image of European trains, and their flagship high speed lines are generally very good, but on the whole there is nothing enormously different in price and quality. In fact, I often find equivalent journeys in the UK much cheaper than journeys I've made on the continent (with our "advance" or megatrain tickets). Plus our ticketing is far superior to the majority of Europe anyway - most places seem to force you to buy tickets for a particular train and time.

Having only one company diminishes the chances. Not of derailment certainly but of an outright crash. Only one set of trains on the lines, no chance of having two trains coming at each other basically.

[bishbash72]

a combination of Victorian-age infrastructure, poor investment and poorly thought-out privatisation.

[NDGAARONDI]

(Original post by StarsAreFixed)
I would have thought that competition would mean better value, but it's not the case

That's because the railway system can't be seen as a free market. I believe one company usually owns a section of the railway system so they can charge what they like, unless passengers essentially use the bus or coach, or use a different train operator, which means relocating. It's not the same when you shop around for your groceries.

[rockrunride]

In Western Europe yes, Britain compares unfavourably to France and Germany where trains are quicker and cheaper. I picked up a Avignon-Paris single advance ticket (460 miles) for 22 EUR without discount. Obviously prices go into the stratosphere from there, but I saw 45 EUR for the same journey a week before. ICEs in Germany are expensive, but the speed reflects the price.

In Spain AVE trains are amazing but heart wrenchingly dear. Lowest price Valencia to Madrid is 32 EUR, then going up to well over 50-60. Doesn't sound too bad but you can get a bus (4 hours) for about 15 EUR. Same really with Italy, Florence to Rome was 44 EUR for me.

Cross the old Iron Curtain and things seem like they're still in the 1980s. Elektrichka style services still pretty much in service in Poland albeit with better stock, but the stock in Hungary/Czech Rep needs replacing and modernising. Intercity trains are pretty slow in all cases.

[audi_turbo]

(Original post by StarsAreFixed)
Having only one company diminishes the chances. Not of derailment certainly but of an outright crash. Only one set of trains on the lines, no chance of having two trains coming at each other basically.

What are you talking about? All the operations of trains are overseen by Network Rail, not by the individual companies themselves. Also if there was only one company then there wouldn't just be one train, but there would be the same amount as there would still be the same amount of passengers.

[callum9999]

(Original post by StarsAreFixed)
Having only one company diminishes the chances. Not of derailment certainly but of an outright crash. Only one set of trains on the lines, no chance of having two trains coming at each other basically.

No it doesn't... They'd still have to be the same number of trains - and the rail system is controlled by one body. If each individual operator controlled their own trains then, as you say, crashes would be more likely to happen.

(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
That's because the railway system can't be seen as a free market. I believe one company usually owns a section of the railway system so they can charge what they like, unless passengers essentially use the bus or coach, or use a different train operator, which means relocating. It's not the same when you shop around for your groceries.

Well several lines are served by 2 or more operators. And they can't just charge whatever they like. The government regulate the price of a big chunk of fares. They can discount at their own discretion (my local operator generally won't) but they are given upper limits.

[NDGAARONDI]

(Original post by callum9999)
Well several lines are served by 2 or more operators. And they can't just charge whatever they like. The government regulate the price of a big chunk of fares. They can discount at their own discretion (my local operator generally won't) but they are given upper limits.

I stand corrected. The pricing is bizarre at times. Latest journey I made between London and Durham would have cost £60 minimum for advanced booking whereas the wonderful Megabus cost me £5.50 or something. Same applied for the return journey. I think a journey from London to Durham on the spot would have cost £140 or so. And you're not guaranteed a seat for some reason.

[StarsAreFixed]

Wow apologies for misinformation there. At the time of that crash the media and commentators here in ROI were quick to point out that it couldn't happen here because of the way our train system is set up with only one company etc. I was fairly young at that time and it clearly stuck in my head, regardless of how little sense it makes now seeing as all the companies are controlled by one.

[callum9999]

(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
I stand corrected. The pricing is bizarre at times. Latest journey I made between London and Durham would have cost £60 minimum for advanced booking whereas the wonderful Megabus cost me £5.50 or something. Same applied for the return journey. I think a journey from London to Durham on the spot would have cost £140 or so. And you're not guaranteed a seat for some reason.

In Britain you usually buy a ticket to use a train on a specific day. You aren't assigned to a seat and you have a choice of many different trains to use (apart from those Advance fares you mentioned - where you do have to use a specific train). Some trains do provide seat reservations but that isn't the norm. I personally prefer it that way - far more flexible. Though assuming you are a student or below 25, you can buy a rail card for £28 which gives you a third off for a year - so that £120 would go down to £80, and the £60 would go down to £40 (similar in France I believe). There is no way any train network in the world could compete with the Megabus if you book early or it's really quiet!

£120 is a lot, but then an equivalent journey in France (Paris to Lyon) is €123 (or £100) - so it's not a huge amount cheaper. And as mentioned above, is less flexible as you're tied to 1 train.

(Original post by StarsAreFixed)
Wow apologies for misinformation there. At the time of that crash the media and commentators here in ROI were quick to point out that it couldn't happen here because of the way our train system is set up with only one company etc. I was fairly young at that time and it clearly stuck in my head, regardless of how little sense it makes now seeing as all the companies are controlled by one.

Fair enough - the media do love to sensationalise things!

[Tinberry]

This is the sort of thing ive seen about the UK being the worst in Europe:

http://m.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/feb/...k&type=article

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/n...-railways.html

The other rail systems that I have personally been on in other countries have always been better than the terrible experience I have here on a daily basis.