B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012
TSR's model parliament.
| Announcements | Posted on | |
|---|---|---|
| Please change your TSR password | 23-05-2013 | |
-
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012
Surprisingly there's little here that I disagree on. My main concern is FTT because I think it needs to be applied worldwide. If you look at Sweden (it may have been) when they introduced FTT, their financial services sector stopped trading in Sweden and so I feel that the £50 billion figure doesn't take into account companies moving offshore because of this. Good costings though.
Were the Socialists to put FTT in a separate Bill and the rest of this stay here, I would vote for this.
-
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012
NonononononononnononoNO.
Why would companies want to stay here if a tax like this was interested. It would highly hurt the City and the economy as a whole (French companies considering relocating after Hollande's and Sarkozy's proposals) - making the £50 billion raised in taxes seem nothing. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012I'm glad. There's certainly an appetite among most governments to see one in each of their territories, the only real obstacle to this is the bogeyman of tax competition. The FTT in this bill is midget even by comparison to other versions of the tax. Its rate is 0.01%. This would not outweigh the benefits financial institutions reap from trading in the UK, our currently low taxes are certainly not the only asset the City has. We are uniquely well-placed to benefit from the opening up of markets world-wide, and an FTT would not change this. The revenue estimation takes into account the likely drop there would be in the volume of transactions (and, remember, trading on the UK capital market can only be undertaken in the UK, so in order for a company to avoid the tax they'd have to cease business in Britain completely which would be far more damaging than simply paying up).(Original post by toronto353)
Surprisingly there's little here that I disagree on. My main concern is FTT because I think it needs to be applied worldwide. If you look at Sweden (it may have been) when they introduced FTT, their financial services sector stopped trading in Sweden and so I feel that the £50 billion figure doesn't take into account companies moving offshore because of this. Good costings though.
Were the Socialists to put FTT in a separate Bill and the rest of this stay here, I would vote for this.
-
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012Where would the go?(Original post by MacCuishy)
NonononononononnononoNO.
Why would companies want to stay here if a tax like this was interested. It would highly hurt the City and the economy as a whole (French companies considering relocating after Hollande's and Sarkozy's proposals) - making the £50 billion raised in taxes seem nothing. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012I'd be willing to raise this in the MUN and see what response we get for a global tax. However, will the Socialist party be removing that section from this Bill? It could still be a separate Bill, but then it would certainly mean a definite aye from myself. I don't support unilaterally creating a FTT. The problem is relocation and I'm wondering if you're underestimating the strength of that.(Original post by JPKC)
I'm glad. There's certainly an appetite among most governments to see one in each of their territories, the only real obstacle to this is the bogeyman of tax competition. The FTT in this bill is midget even by comparison to other versions of the tax. Its rate is 0.01%. This would not outweigh the benefits financial institutions reap from trading in the UK, our currently low taxes are certainly not the only asset the City has. We are uniquely well-placed to benefit from the opening up of markets world-wide, and an FTT would not change this. The revenue estimation takes into account the likely drop there would be in the volume of transactions (and, remember, trading on the UK capital market can only be undertaken in the UK, so in order for a company to avoid the tax they'd have to cease business in Britain completely which would be far more damaging than simply paying up). -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012I'm glad the UK doesn't operate a system of government where the narrow interests of business dominate policy formulation. You completely forget that the City hurt us, and that measures like the ones in this Bill would hinder the repeat of such largescale devastation. This Bill balances the interests of the financial sector with those of both the British public and wider economy. Let's refrain from irrational speculation when deliberating on the merits of measures like these.(Original post by MacCuishy)
NonononononononnononoNO.
Why would companies want to stay here if a tax like this was interested. It would highly hurt the City and the economy as a whole (French companies considering relocating after Hollande's and Sarkozy's proposals) - making the £50 billion raised in taxes seem nothing. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012Is it in the interests of the British population for there to be a strong economy, providing plenty of well-paid jobs?(Original post by JPKC)
I'm glad the UK doesn't operate a system of government where the narrow interests of business dominate policy formulation. You completely forget that the City hurt us, and that measures like the ones in this Bill would hinder the repeat of such largescale devastation. This Bill balances the interests of the financial sector with those of both the British public and wider economy. Let's refrain from irrational speculation when deliberating on the merits of measures like these. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012Banking is the one industry which I would say needs more regulation. The economy is too fragile and exposed to banking mistakes so if we want to prevent more major recessions we have to do something. Whether that is add safeguards in and extra regulation, or have the Queen ensure banks are not bailed out in future but we cannot leave it as it is.(Original post by tehFrance)
**** no, we need more deregulation not more regulation.
We need to be Britzerland or Brichtenstein
-
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012As the Bill's baby-daddy, I would be reluctant to split the measures up. I don't believe relocation is a tangible threat posed by the FTT for two reasons. Firstly, a company doing business in our capital market would pay the same minute charges regardless of where they were listed, so there'd be absolutely no incentive for them to leave Britain because of this. Secondly, the 0.01% rate would affect the potential profit in a transaction by a whisper (if at all), so doing financial business in London would still be as worthwhile as anywhere else, even ignoring all the other benefits brought by being in the oasis of Canary Wharf or the Square Mile. Britain, after America, is the best-placed economy to implement an FTT since the success of our financial sector is not dependent entirely on low-taxes.(Original post by toronto353)
I'd be willing to raise this in the MUN and see what response we get for a global tax. However, will the Socialist party be removing that section from this Bill? It could still be a separate Bill, but then it would certainly mean a definite aye from myself. I don't support unilaterally creating a FTT. The problem is relocation and I'm wondering if you're underestimating the strength of that.Last edited by JPKC; 01-06-2012 at 22:55. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012Can't do much for you unless you let on why. Also, weren't you yourself a member of the Government that proposed increased financial sector taxation in 2010?(Original post by Birchington)
I support the separation of commercial and investment banking, the rest of this I strongly disagree with.
It's in the OED and bankers themselves often use it. It's loaded but that doesn't detract from the point being made.(Original post by Sdiff)
It doesn't help your cause when you use colloquial, loaded phrases like "Casino banking"Last edited by JPKC; 01-06-2012 at 23:00. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012Unfortunately I can't vote for a Bill that has FTT. The ball's in your court really. You have a lot of support for the first section so it might be worth splitting this Bill down a bit because the first part you'll get through the House no problems. The rest is where we're all split.(Original post by JPKC)
As the Bill's baby-daddy, I would be reluctant to split the measures up. I don't believe relocation is a tangible threat posed by the FTT for two reasons. Firstly, a company doing business in our capital market would pay the same minute charges regardless of where they were listed, so there'd be absolutely no incentive for them to leave Britain because of this. Secondly, the 0.01% rate would affect the potential profit in a transaction by a whisper (if at all), so doing financial business in London would still be as worthwhile as anywhere else, even ignoring all the other benefits brought by being in the oasis of Canary Wharf or the Square Mile. Britain, after America, is the best-placed economy to implement an FTT since the success of our financial sector is not dependent entirely on low-taxes. -
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012
This is ok except for the FTT. Trust me, I know bankers personally, and they move VERY easily. Like it or not, a stupid amount of our economy is dependent on the financial sector, and unless we build an efficient and cost effective manufacturing sector I don't see that changing very soon. It would be yes but for the FTT.
-
- Reputation:
- Community Assistant
- Wiki Support Team
- Secretary General of the Model UN
- Location: Leicester
- Posts: 5,209
Re: B457 - Big Banking Bill 2012Unfortunately, our economy is incredibly reliant on the financial sector. Any form of FTT will encourage banks to move elsewhere, potentially causing our economy damage. We must decentralise our economy and rebuild our manufacturing sector and ensure we have a sustainable, export led growth plan. Only then will I support FTT, but until this happens we must look beyond childish 'banker bashing' and realise thatalthough the financial sector may often act in a morally dubious manner, it heavily contributes to our economy.
Were the Socialists to put FTT in a separate Bill and the rest of this stay here, I would vote for this.