[Ferrus]

(Original post by Calllu-m)
I don't see why there's a stigma against wanting to do well.

A mentality among lower classes in many societies of such a nature that anyone attempting to improve themselves is a threat to the internal self-esteem as the culture by its identification against the higher classes.

[gintoki]

(Original post by green.tea)
I dont follow football. Can you put in terms a snooker fan would understand?

Don't know the background of any snooker players unfortunately

I like snooker though (especially playing it), Ronnie is awesome but my favourite is Judd Trump

[AnniexXx]

I think its to do with attitude, some people who do well like to brag, if you appear modest then you get better responses (at least I do!) and also don't mention your achievements unless they are in the right context. People get jealous.. fact of life, never let negative attitudes bring you down or stop you from doing well!

[Skaði]

(Original post by Octohedral)
I don't get it. If you say you got 5As at A-level on this website you get negged, if you say it in real life people tell you to stop bragging, and instantly dislike you. If you say you got 3Cs, but are trying really hard everyone likes you.

I'm willing to bet that in most cases the person who got 5As tried harder than the person who got 3Cs. Maybe that's not always true, but very few people get 5As by lazing around, so why is it a taboo topic? A couple of answers;

1. Jealousy. A bit of jealousy is healthy, it makes us stronger people. What's the point in just pretending someone didn't do better than you rather than using it as motivation to improve yourself?

If someone came up to me and started a conversation and halfway through said something along the lines of 'oh, guess what, I have 5 As at A Level*' (God knows how that would come up in a conversation, mind), and I punched them in the face, it would be down to being pissed off because of their arrogance (and anger issues).

If someone came up to me and we started a conversation and I asked them 'oh, what did you get in your A Levels?' and they replied with '5 As. You?' and I punched them in the face, it would be down to jealousy (and anger issues).

The way I see it, a lot of this 'intelligence is bad' crap is down to jealousy, though jealousy and arrogance overlap. For example, I don't get jealous by other's GCSE results, even though I did pretty crappy in mine by TSR standards. If someone asks the person and they reply, I don't get pissed off with how well they did, because they're not constantly showing off. Whereas if it's a really lengthy post in a thread about how bad a certain exam went, telling everyone how well they did in the exam and what they included and what their coursework marks are and what they're predicted, etc. (saw this the other day; the user had a post count of 2 and hasn't been on TSR since), then not only do I get pissed off, I get jealous too. I don't really know why. I assume it's because I hate arrogance, and when people show off their intelligence by constantly talking/writing about it (even on a student forum) not only do I feel pissed off, I feel sorry for those who did/do really badly in their exams, because it's almost as if the person is rubbing their intelligence in everyone else's faces.

Now I don't care about whether you're intelligent or not, but when it's all someone goes on about, even if they're sort of doing it without realising, I get really annoyed. Personally, if I neg someone because they're going on about their exam results without being prompted, it's moreso down to annoyance at their (perceived) arrogance than jealousy (although that does come into things a little). Hey, they might not even be arrogant; that's just the way I see it. On the other hand, I'm more likely to pos rep the person who mentions that they have 3 Cs because of the sheer balls they must have for saying that on TSR** I don't want to mention a certain one of my GCSE results because I fear it will make me look stupid.

(Original post by Octohedral)
2. 'Lad' culture. Work is uncool. This is just tragic, particularly coming from people writing on computers.

Tbh, I only really see this on Facebook, usually because the 'lad' has messed up an exam and just shrugs it off with 'yeah, well, work sucks anyway. Who's up for Weymouth?' Of course it exists, but the ones (or at least the ones at my school) who didn't bother doing any work never seemed to mix with the ones who were academically brighter/had a better work ethic anyway.

Tl;dr? Me too. It's quarter past five and I need to go to bed. I'll sort out this rant in the afternoon.

*Seriously, who in their right minds would do 5 A Levels? It's not as if universities care or anything...do they?

**For the record, I haven't negged anyone for saying they have exceptional grades on TSR. Yet.

[DannyJC]

I don't really regard what other people have to say about me anymore. I did get really good grades at GCSE, but not particularly A Level. I understand why I didn't do as well in the latter and so I aim to get on top again.
I have rubbed my grades in other peoples faces and they have done the same back to me. When my friends get upset about their own grades then I care not to mention it. Overall, I don't find that I have been held back by any getting good grades and if anyone has anything to say to me washes over me as I am proud of myself at the end of the day. I think that bad grades are more of a negative than good though. There are plenty of connotations like;": 'he is so dumb' ect. This isn't always the case, but people will always talk. Just try your best and see where you go.


This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App

[CUFCDan]

I think there's a very fundamental anti-intellectualism and anti-hard work in British culture. Because I come from a poor background and the vast majority of my friends work in menial jobs (so do I part-time) a lot of what I do is looked down upon, and I wouldn't suggest it was jealousy. It's more that it's not 'in'. Being smart isn't 'in', and neither is working hard. Because I work too, I'm up early (like this...) to do a 9 hour shift then revising for 6 hours when I get home. People don't like it, and people don't like it when you're having a conversation and undercut them. It's kinda got to the point I just plain avoid saying anything. And I'm not particularly intelligent either, more hard working.

On grades, I kinda ignore them. I'm proud of what I have done at Uni this year, but there's no point. If I say 'I got...' there's no way to reply; chances are, they didn't do as well, so no matter what you reply it sounds arrogant.

[green.tea]

(Original post by CUFCDan)
I think there's a very fundamental anti-intellectualism and anti-hard work in British culture. Because I come from a poor background and the vast majority of my friends work in menial jobs (so do I part-time) a lot of what I do is looked down upon, and I wouldn't suggest it was jealousy. It's more that it's not 'in'. Being smart isn't 'in', and neither is working hard. Because I work too, I'm up early (like this...) to do a 9 hour shift then revising for 6 hours when I get home. People don't like it, and people don't like it when you're having a conversation and undercut them. It's kinda got to the point I just plain avoid saying anything. And I'm not particularly intelligent either, more hard working.

On grades, I kinda ignore them. I'm proud of what I have done at Uni this year, but there's no point. If I say 'I got...' there's no way to reply; chances are, they didn't do as well, so no matter what you reply it sounds arrogant.

Its interesting. When i was at school me and my mates were in the same boat my smarts were appreciated. People loved my mind for mischief, cheek, penchant for making teachers look silly and occasional belittlement of the achievements of the opposing camp when i found the subject of a test interesting. Since then the attitude of the same people has gradually changed. They now think i should forget university, that im going to get nothing from it and that degrees are being replaced by nvqs anyway. It irritates me. They explain to me what "you do". Apparently "you" get a "steady away job", granted "you" dont make all that much but "you" get by. I would honest to god rather kill myself. What irritates me is that they havent thought "what do i wanna do?" theyve thought "what do "you" do".

Anyway, intelligence itself is fine in my experience so long as its used for the good of the boat.

[Indian_Prince]

(Original post by Octohedral)
I don't get it. If you say you got 5As at A-level on this website you get negged, if you say it in real life people tell you to stop bragging, and instantly dislike you. If you say you got 3Cs, but are trying really hard everyone likes you.

I'm willing to bet that in most cases the person who got 5As tried harder than the person who got 3Cs. Maybe that's not always true, but very few people get 5As by lazing around, so why is it a taboo topic? A couple of answers;

1. Jealousy. A bit of jealousy is healthy, it makes us stronger people. What's the point in just pretending someone didn't do better than you rather than using it as motivation to improve yourself?

2. 'Lad' culture. Work is uncool. This is just tragic, particularly coming from people writing on computers.

I think society has become far too overindulgent - at school we literally weren't allowed to do well because it would 'upset the other children'. Gifted and talented courses were opened to everyone in the interest of 'fairness'. Well, how about helping the other children, and giving them something to aspire to?

Thoughts?

Edit: I'm talking about school here, as it's important in how people develop - I know nobody cares when you grow up

I dont think it is punished, grades dont actually show how intelligent a person is, ofcourse having a high level of intelligence does help to understand things better but for exams all you have to do is remember information, for which you

Now about the grades, to be honest a trully intelligent person would not judge another person based purely on grades, an intelligent person knows that there is more to people that their alevels. Ofcourse on this site it is slightly bias and so doesnt represent the general population of students... to make an assumption that intelligent people are punished for having good grades is a silly one.

[green.tea]

(Original post by Indian_Prince)
I dont think it is punished, grades dont actually show how intelligent a person is, ofcourse having a high level of intelligence does help to understand things better but for exams all you have to do is remember information, for which you

That sentence was going so well.

[AspiringGenius]

From my experience of bullying, it's normally other eccenrtic traits rather than intelligence, that more often than not coincide with it.

[metalthrashin'mad]

(Original post by Octohedral)
I don't get it. If you say you got 5As at A-level on this website you get negged, if you say it in real life people tell you to stop bragging, and instantly dislike you. If you say you got 3Cs, but are trying really hard everyone likes you.

I'm willing to bet that in most cases the person who got 5As tried harder than the person who got 3Cs. Maybe that's not always true, but very few people get 5As by lazing around, so why is it a taboo topic? A couple of answers;

1. Jealousy. A bit of jealousy is healthy, it makes us stronger people. What's the point in just pretending someone didn't do better than you rather than using it as motivation to improve yourself?

2. 'Lad' culture. Work is uncool. This is just tragic, particularly coming from people writing on computers.

I think society has become far too overindulgent - at school we literally weren't allowed to do well because it would 'upset the other children'. Gifted and talented courses were opened to everyone in the interest of 'fairness'. Well, how about helping the other children, and giving them something to aspire to?

Thoughts?

Edit: I'm talking about school here, as it's important in how people develop - I know nobody cares when you grow up

I don't know but the media might have something to do with it.

Popular music is completely dumb, as is:
television
modern videogames
hollywood films (for the most part)
Even documentaries on television are so entry-level that if you know ANYTHING about the subject then you already know what they will talk about.

I don't think I'm THAT intelligent, I get average grades and not a lot better, but it seems that for EVERYTHING popular you can just leave your brain at home and not bother to think. Other than TV programs I have been watching for years, I refuse to watch TV programs besides sports anymore, same with popular music, and hollywood films. Perhaps that pervades people's attitudes when it comes to everything else?

[green.tea]

(Original post by AspiringGenius)
From my experience of bullying, it's normally other eccenrtic traits rather than intelligence, that more often than not coincide with it.

Only snooker fans will get this.

To me shaun murphy exemplifies absolutely perfectly the average bullying victim. He spends his life saying the right things and doing as he should but he has no understanding of why you dont insist that a player e punished for forgetting his chalk. He dislikes anyone who isnt as dull as him, he got his playing style from a textbook, honed it through hard work and to top it all off he's a christian.

[Indian_Prince]

(Original post by green.tea)
That sentence was going so well.

l0l my bad.... Phones suck.

[gemnomnom]

(Original post by Super Mario 64)
I think it's the gloating that annoys people, not actually doing well. It's like having a millionaire brag to a janitor that he's a millionaire. Just makes him look like a tool.
On the other hand I'm not saying you HAVE to be modest if you got good grades. You worked hard for them so it's nice to let other people know that you've done good, but it's the self-achievement that matters.

There will always be those people that are jealous of other people doing well, because no matter how hard they try themselves they never get the grades.
The 'Lad' culture thing.. well.. it'll hit them hard in the face in a few years time when they've realised they've ran out of 'banter' and money to rinse on pints of Guinness. Not saying they're all like that, but leave them to it.

Aha one of the best written posts on TSR.

[medbh4805]

When I was at school (and a grammar school to boot), I used to feel awkward about telling people my grades, or saying I found an exam easy when people asked me, because when I did people called me arrogant; but then I hear people bitching about 'false modesty' and saying things like 'I hate when people say they found an exam hard and then get an A'. You can't win.

[M1011]

A Levels? Intelligence? No. Memorising.

[MrHappy_J]

(Original post by Octohedral)
I repped the guy you quoted - he made a good point

I guess I just wanted to rant, because I think 'you are arrogant' equates to 'I am jealous', and I don't think that's a good message to give to our children.

you really need to stop thinking everyone's jealous of your grades. it just makes you look arrogant

[No Man]

(Original post by Octohedral)
I repped the guy you quoted - he made a good point

I guess I just wanted to rant, because I think 'you are arrogant' equates to 'I am jealous', and I don't think that's a good message to give to our children.

If that's what you think, you're lacking a bit of class.

Why should flashing how well you've done academically to people you don't know be seen any differently to flashing cash?

[Barden]

I don't really understand why TSR is playing dumb in this thread.

We all know that intelligence is stigmatised from an early age.


Or has nobody here ever heard the terms 'nerd' or 'geek'?

[Octohedral]

(Original post by No Man)
If that's what you think, you're lacking a bit of class.

Why should flashing how well you've done academically to people you don't know be seen any differently to flashing cash?

Class is part of the social construct I've just identified. Fear of 'arrogance' is so deeply ingrained into British society that people can't see that there isn't a logical reason why arrogance is a bad thing. As for academic achievement - it doesn't even have to be flashing it, we literally aren't allowed to talk about it.

And it's totally matter of having earned it - why can't people flash around money they've worked hard for?


I probably sound like I'm taking myself very seriously here - I don't - but I think it's an important thing to talk about if we want to improve our society and its aspirations.