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EU referendum

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    Once again there are growing calls for an EU referendum following Merkel's statement that there the EU should form into a political union.

    I am all for an EU referendum, but I don't believe that an in/out referendum is the right one - what EU referendum would you like to see and how would you vote in that referendum?
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    I like to see a referendum on in/or out, simple as that
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    I quite like Lord Owen's suggestion (and I don't usually agree with Labour peers) of a 2 question in/out on the EU then in/out on an expanded EFTA (free markets but none of the protectionism or federalism or subsidy programmes or all the other crap nobody in the UK ever voted for)
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    Just an In/out one. I also think there should be referendums for every member state every ten years or so, so that every generation gets a vote, in their lifetime at least.
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    I don't understand the impact leaving the EU would have, but all the main parties are strongly against leaving so it is very likely that staying is the right thing to do, otherwise labour would use it as an easy vote winner against the tory's.
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    Both options are fraught with problems and could potentially push Europe to disaster. But yet, a decision needs to be made otherwise Europe and it's economy will collapse completely.

    A political union I think is unnecessary, but the EU needs to have more economic authority and power in terms of the running and overseeing of finances and fiscal spending. It may be hard, but politics and economics should be kept seperate - do we really want the French to be living under German law or vice-versa?
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    (Original post by james22)
    I don't understand the impact leaving the EU would have, but all the main parties are strongly against leaving so it is very likely that staying is the right thing to do, otherwise labour would use it as an easy vote winner against the tory's.
    Labour and the Tories also agreed on Afghanistan and Iraq, while only the front bench of the Tories is committed to staying in the EU. Many backbenchers have expressed desires for a referendum.
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    I am unsure of the worth of a referendum on a subject over which a minority of people actually have a decent grasp of the issues. A mandate from the masses is a good thing, don't get me wrong, but opinions for opinions' sake aren't, necessarily. I think a worthwhile referendum would have to be on a much narrower topic than in/out. The latter provokes visceral reactions as well as reasoned ones.
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    (Original post by TurboCretin)
    I am unsure of the worth of a referendum on a subject over which a minority of people actually have a decent grasp of the issues. A mandate from the masses is a good thing, don't get me wrong, but opinions for opinions' sake aren't, necessarily. I think a worthwhile referendum would have to be on a much narrower topic than in/out. The latter provokes visceral reactions as well as reasoned ones.
    Even if the entire public are not completely informed of all the issues should they not still have a vote, we are still apparently a democracy so if someone is not fully informed but just dislikes the EU why should they not have a vote. I'm sure everyone voting in a general election is not fully informed of all the issues but still have the right to have a vote. The reason why people are not fully informed on this issue is because the government and the opposition parties have been reluctant to discuss the matter because they know a referendum (even with three options) would result in a vote to leave the EU.
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    I'd want an in/out with the out meaning a return to something like an EEC.

    <3 x
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    (Original post by Ace123)
    Even if the entire public are not completely informed of all the issues should they not still have a vote, we are still apparently a democracy so if someone is not fully informed but just dislikes the EU why should they not have a vote. I'm sure everyone voting in a general election is not fully informed of all the issues but still have the right to have a vote. The reason why people are not fully informed on this issue is because the government and the opposition parties have been reluctant to discuss the matter because they know a referendum (even with three options) would result in a vote to leave the EU.
    I'm not saying they shouldn't have a vote, necessarily. I'm (i) saying that in/out might be overly simplistic, and (ii) voicing a certain disquiet I have about democracy that it assumes all opinions are equal. Unfortunately, it's the best we have.
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    It would be a brave decision for the government in power at the time to create a referendum on EU membership.

    Personally I would love the chance for a referendum as it would really force us to examine the arguments both for and against and have a healthy national debate on the topic. There are too many half-truths and mis-conceptions on the issue at the minute from both sides.
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    I think we should get as far away from Europe as possible. It is going to become an economic backwater of the Western world. We do not want to be in an economic union with what is going to be, a very stagnant region.
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    (Original post by tomcol23)
    Once again there are growing calls for an EU referendum following Merkel's statement that there the EU should form into a political union.

    I am all for an EU referendum, but I don't believe that an in/out referendum is the right one - what EU referendum would you like to see and how would you vote in that referendum?
    She said the Eurozone should take steps to integrate more, not the wider EU.

    I support the idea of a referendum, but I'd vote pro-EU.

    Britain isn't Britain any more, millions of people here I have little in common with so I'd rather share a state and government with my fellow north Europeans than with Somalians and Pakistanis.

    The Norman invasion was one of histories great tragedies, without it our connection with other North Sea cultures would be much more obvious to those who struggle to see the truth.*

    We're all Europeans and it's time to stand together.

    We've seen what politicos like Liam Fox (bitch boy to American defence interests), Osbourne (seems to live in the USA), Cameron ("Whatever you want Obama, we'll give you it"), Hague ("Our position on this is..hang on let me ask clinton").

    These so-called British patriots would have us on our knees slaving to the Americans and American interests. We're Europeans and we can have a relationship as equals with our fellow Europeans to stand up for our European interests.

    *Yes, I know the Normans were viking descendents.
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    (Original post by Classical Liberal)
    I think we should get as far away from Europe as possible. It is going to become an economic backwater of the Western world. We do not want to be in an economic union with what is going to be, a very stagnant region.
    The European Union has the largest economy in the world and contains richer countries than ours, what kind of *******s are you sprouting?

    You do realise that £100 million of trade with an area growing at 1% a year is £90 million more than £10million of trade with an area growing at 10% a year?

    I don't see any projections for Chinese per capita GDP overtaking German ones, do you?? where is it?

    Your trade plan is to trade with every third world economy that has a high growth % and then as it becomes richer and the growth % falls, we move on to trading with the next poor country????
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    Merkel's not wrong to talk about a pan-European identity as talk of democracy, liberty, equality etc is wrapped up in almost every single EU treaty of trade deal. These values should define the modern day Europe and guide our membership negotiations with the Ukraine, Turkey and other countries.

    However, if we let in countries such as Turkey purely for economic reasons (without first addressing their discrimination of Gays, Kurds, Armenians etc) then all of Merkel's talk about "identity" would go down the toilet.
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    I want a yes/no referendum on should we scrap all taxes and make public transport free yes or no
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    It really is about time for the the British public to have a say on whether we want to be part of the EU.
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    It is a pointless exercise to have an in/out referendum only to then have another question on whether or not to have an EFTA/EEA area membership request.

    Being in the EFTA/EEA essentially compels you to enact most if not all of the EU sourced regulations, it might save taxpayers some money (though it is nowhere near what UKIP likes to say) but it won't do anything with regard to other redtapes.

    As for me, if ever Switzerland gives out a referendum on EU membership, I'd vote Nein. If ever there was a vote to cancel that EFTA membership, I'm definitely voting that it should be cancelled, ripped up and stuffed into Francois Hollande's big backside.

    As for UK, it should have a referendum on just in/out. Personally I think it is better to negotiate a separate trade deal outside the EFTA/EEA.

    Maybe to save time and money as well as to get as much people out to vote, they should also call on a referendum on whether there should still be a monarchy, whether Scotland should be independent and if the union survives whether it is time for England to have her own Parliament.
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    Simple: In or Out.

    I would in obviously.

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