[pearlypearl]

As a mature student, you know how hard it is to get on the right track to enter ideal universities, well, especially if you want to apply for science courses in uni. I wonder how Access to HE diploma compare to A levels? For example, they require candidates to have good A level Maths grade and even good GCSEs grades if I want to do Natural Science in Cambridge. Or am I just daydreaming? Is it impossible at all? Universities like Oxbridge will not even consider Access diploma for science courses applications? Does any mature students have experiences in applying Oxbridge? Please share yours here. I really appreciate your advices.


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[Yasir]

Although not aware of Access Diploma myself, but I recommend you go through A level's mathematics syllabus, which is readily available online (just google it), and compare it with your diploma. If your course is quite different from A levels, you have a golden opportunity to shine: watch Khan Academy's A levels videos and teach yourself the material that your diploma does not already cover (the amount of time required simply depends on your level of motivation). Then mention this in your personal statement!

This will show that you're are passionate about your intended degree; passion is something that is highly regarded.

In essence, it you can demonstrate your command as well as passion about the subject you wish to pursue, you can get into Oxbridge.

[King-Panther]

(Original post by pearlypearl)
As a mature student, you know how hard it is to get on the right track to enter ideal universities, well, especially if you want to apply for science courses in uni. I wonder how Access to HE diploma compare to A levels? For example, they require candidates to have good A level Maths grade and even good GCSEs grades if I want to do Natural Science in Cambridge. Or am I just daydreaming? Is it impossible at all? Universities like Oxbridge will not even consider Access diploma for science courses applications? Does any mature students have experiences in applying Oxbridge? Please share yours here. I really appreciate your advices.


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It depends what you're applying for but for sciences I would definitely do A levels.. It says on the cambridge website they accept the access course for architecture, so I did one but when I attended an open day, the lead tutor at one of the colleges told me 'if I was serious, to go and do A levels'... even when I went to the mature summer school, they said they preferred A levels over an access course and for something as competitive as the sciences, I wouldn't bother with the access course.

A levels are only one year longer and will open so many more doors for you.

[cambio wechsel]

(Original post by pearlypearl)
As a mature student...I want to do Natural Science in Cambridge.

assuming you're a woman, and the username suggests it, you might have a look at Lucy Cavendish college, which has more experience than most in managing non-standard applications. http://www.lucy-cav.cam.ac.uk/

Why not write to an admissions tutor or director of studies? It is their job to manage this kind of enquiry, they'll know a lot better than will the people on here, and it as well gives you opportunity and excuse to make a first-contact.

[evening sunrise]

(Original post by pearlypearl)
As a mature student, you know how hard it is to get on the right track to enter ideal universities, well, especially if you want to apply for science courses in uni. I wonder how Access to HE diploma compare to A levels? For example, they require candidates to have good A level Maths grade and even good GCSEs grades if I want to do Natural Science in Cambridge. Or am I just daydreaming? Is it impossible at all? Universities like Oxbridge will not even consider Access diploma for science courses applications? Does any mature students have experiences in applying Oxbridge? Please share yours here. I really appreciate your advices.


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It depends. On what you are offering in terms of your overall application, and as another poster said whether you are undertaking other "beyond the call of duty study". What branch of the natural sciences are you seeking to follow? What wider reading have you done on that branch and which aspects of that material caught your interest, did not sit comfortably with you or whatever and why?

What are your GCE/GCSE grades for English Language, Mathematics, and single/double/triple science and geography if your thinking Earth sciences ?

Are you a member of your local branch of the natural history society or maybe a local astronomy club, or conservation society, are you a secret chemical whizz, developing manipulating your own images from film ? Do you play competitive bridge or chess. None of these examples are close to mandatory but all are examples of things that would enhance an application for this kind of subject over and above predicted grades at A level or Access. There are many others.

What is very unlikely to work, for Oxbridge and other institutions near the top of the league tables, is "I have always been interested in science and now inspired by Brian Cox on the telly, I have decided I wish to study it." "Don't worry about the fact I failed GCSE maths and obtained a D at double science I am a changed person, I realise there is no supporting evidence, you will have to trust me on this one."

Only about 300 mature students study the physical sciences each year after completing Access; that is they received offers, they subsequently met the offer and hence started their degree course. UCAS did not publish data for how many applied. BTW: the number of mature students starting physical science degrees each year after doing A levels is about 300 also. We have two in this years cohort doing Physics with mathematics and Physics with Astrophysics respectively.

I do believe you will need a coherent answer as to why, if your really committed to doing natural sciences at Oxbridge, you are not investing the extra year to take A levels. If you have a coherent answer and they do exist for sure, then I do not think the fact your doing Access will be detrimental, it is all the other stuff and if your down selected, performance at interview, that will be the make or break. Loads of A* AA to A*A*A* students are interviewed each year and they fall at that stage.

We did not apply to Oxbridge as financial factors (house prices) required us to apply in the North and subsequently relocate North. But the principles above are sound for applying to any institution that is ranked relatively highly and hence popular and hence competitive.

But as others have implied A levels would be the percentage bet for Oxbridge natural sciences.

Good luck

[evening sunrise]

(Original post by cambio wechsel)
Why not write to an admissions tutor or director of studies? It is their job to manage this kind of enquiry, they'll know a lot better than will the people on here, and it as well gives you opportunity and excuse to make a first-contact.

I think the above is sound advice and the OP should execute the suggestion as a priority. But it requires a health warning, at this stage of the cycle one gets stock answers from university admissions. Every university we rang including the ones we applied to, stated "we require evidence of recent (within the last 3 years) relevent study". Had we believed them we would have forked out somewhere between 2K and 3K for us both to do Access and received, conditional offers on them. So the student has to consider all input and then decide what to do based upon their conviction in their application content.

[uninspirational]

For sciences I honestly don't think so, BUT, as above, please do double check with a call/e-mail! I only say this because my friend (who was an Engineering applicant) was told it was A-Levels or no offer (and this was one of the mature colleges). Of course NatSci and Engineering aren't the same, but this is just to give you an idea.

Also I would highly recommend attending the Cambridge Mature Student's Summer School; it'll give you a great insight into the process and it's great fun .

[JohnnytheFox]

Regardless of whether they would accept you or not, you're very likely to struggle with the degree itself without an A-level background.

Unfortunately, Access courses don't really provide sufficient background knowledge for a modern science degree in a top university. I'm speaking from personal experience. My first year at UCL following an access to science course was hell. Indeed, the only person to fail all of their first year exams on my course was also an access student. There are things that you are expected to know in your first year of a science degree that just aren't able to be taught to a sufficient level in one year of an access course. It was for this very reason that I was told flat out by Imperial that they no longer accept applications from access students.

Access is fine for vocational degrees like nursing and what have you, but I do feel that you're better off actually doing the A-levels if you want to study a core science at degree level.

[Heinz the German]

(Original post by JohnnytheFox)
Unfortunately, Access courses don't really provide sufficient background knowledge for a modern science degree in a top university.

100% agreed. Access science is a bit of a joke. I took a Chemistry module as part of Access and it was ridiculously simple. It contained nothing that I had not studied at the same - or even a higher level - at GCSE 17 years prior to taking my Access course.

I'm speaking from personal experience. My first year at UCL following an access to science course was hell.

Hello fellow UCL'er Having seen what some of my housemates have to do (one is doing Physics, another is doing Biochemistry), the amount of work - and the standard it is at - is pretty damn serious.

There are things that you are expected to know in your first year of a science degree that just aren't able to be taught to a sufficient level in one year of an access course.

Yup, i'm in agreement there.To stand a chance you need to push yourself way beyond what you have to do for Access.

It was for this very reason that I was told flat out by Imperial that they no longer accept applications from access students.

50% in agreement, 50% not - Imperial are arrogant bastards at the best of times - so bad they actually make LSE look humble by comparison, and they always look down on non-traditional qualifications.

Access is fine for vocational degrees like nursing and what have you, but I do feel that you're better off actually doing the A-levels if you want to study a core science at degree level.

It very much depends on the degree. If it's something like the BSc Geography degree course I'm on, then not so much. If it's something like the Biochem or Physics I mentioned earlier, then i'd agree.

[evening sunrise]

You guys highlight some excellent points.

How the depth and sophistication level of what is covered, as you guys and others have posted in this and other threads, can be so low yet deemed L3 is something that perplexes me.

Going back to the original question then yes Access can get you into Oxbridge in the sense that it will tick the "relevent recent study" box, it will also refresh study and organisational skills and demonstrate commitment to the cause etc. It does not prepare you to land running upon arrival. That capability to land running would be demonstrated through other aspects of the application and at interview. This is also true for A level students of any age and is why so many A*AA to AAA students do not receive offers. Whether the mature student does Access or A levels, the above and beyond factor is equally applicable.

It would be very useful if the colleges advised students on the aptitudes certain subjects require for successful pursuit at degree level and given Access will attract substantial loans in the future maybe test these, advise the student on what might be their best field of study. The final decision however lies with the student. They could also advise students on the measures they can take to exercise the muscle between their ears and develop certain mental faculties.

[Heinz the German]

Access can certainly get you into Oxbridge - but I have a feeling there is a split between humanities and sciences. My other half had an offer from Oxford (to read History), but turned it down. There is another TSR mature student on here who is now at Cambridge reading Law off the back of an Access course.

[evening sunrise]

(Original post by Heinz the German)
Access can certainly get you into Oxbridge - but I have a feeling there is a split between humanities and sciences. My other half had an offer from Oxford (to read History), but turned it down. There is another TSR mature student on here who is now at Cambridge reading Law off the back of an Access course.

Agreed, my only point is that with the right coaching (not teaching) and support beyond the Access content exceptional individuals will be identified by the higher ranked Uni's and offered places even if personal circumstances mandate the Access to HE route. If the coaching suggestions are continued by the student, especially once their Access has finished, then the student will land prepared enough for year 1 survival and their talent and aptitudes will soon kick in.

Anyone who simply completes their access course and then spends the time until September "gardening" is off their trolly.

How UCL managed to offer a place to someone who failed all their year one modules (I assume no personal life or health meltdown occurred) seems rather strange, no doubt the selection criteria will be reviewed. I hope the outcome is not a blanket "no Access" one, for the reasons given above. Imperial's position is quite pathetic, it borders on cowardly, they should take more responsibility to select correctly, rather than cut off folks who may be exceptionally talented but have no option but to take the Access route.

I have no Access axe to grind on this, we did not do Access. Plus as already stated even if opting for A levels all the "above and beyond" will be required to secure a place at Oxbridge and similar.

[TomU]

(Original post by pearlypearl)
As a mature student, you know how hard it is to get on the right track to enter ideal universities, well, especially if you want to apply for science courses in uni. I wonder how Access to HE diploma compare to A levels? For example, they require candidates to have good A level Maths grade and even good GCSEs grades if I want to do Natural Science in Cambridge. Or am I just daydreaming? Is it impossible at all? Universities like Oxbridge will not even consider Access diploma for science courses applications? Does any mature students have experiences in applying Oxbridge? Please share yours here. I really appreciate your advices.


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Firstly, I would suggest applying to a mature college; they seem to understand Access students better! I've just finished my first year of Law here at Hughes Hall in Cambridge and have really enjoyed my year, but have found the workload to be extremely high as compared to an Access course, so from that perspective it wasn't hugely helpful preparation.

On the other hand, they were welcoming of my application and they treated me just like any other student during the interview process. I can't speak for NatSci courses, but Access was certainly sufficent for me to get in to study law. I would ensure that you call the college you are intending on applying to and ask them of any specific prerequisites for the course - some Access courses may not cover everything you need, whereas an equivalent A level in the right subject would.