[miser]

(Original post by SoNottingH)
It's easier for a camel to enter than a "miser" though.

Funny how people disregard that bit and hope to get into heaven anyway.

[Perseveranze]

(Original post by PandyAndy)
We get to the entrance and are told 'atheists only'.

Or, you get to the entrance and do this;

And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

I remember an Atheist person I was talking to, who said even if he saw Jesus(pbuh) raise someone from the dead, he wouldn't believe it but think there's some logical/scientific explanation for it. (Not saying all Atheists would prescribe to such conclusions).

[SoNottingH]

(Original post by Perseveranze)
Or, you get to the entrance and do this;

And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

I remember an Atheist person I was talking to, who said even if he saw Jesus(pbuh) raise someone from the dead, he wouldn't believe it but think there's some logical/scientific explanation for it. (Not saying all Atheists would prescribe to such conclusions).

Does it make it more true if the letters are large and turquoise?

[bahjat93]

(Original post by Lollyage)
I just don't see how it's possible to create a place where everyone can live happily for eternity without getting bored.

Besides, the Islamic heaven sounds like hell for me personally. I mean, rivers made of milk and honey?

I like to imagine that my heaven will have naked ladies
My mum told me heaven will have what ever you want

[Rat_Bag]

(Original post by Perseveranze)
Or, you get to the entrance and do this;

And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

So do you concede that it is possible that there might be a sign saying "Atheists Only".

(Original post by Perseveranze)
I remember an Atheist person I was talking to, who said even if he saw Jesus(pbuh) raise someone from the dead, he wouldn't believe it but think there's some logical/scientific explanation for it. (Not saying all Atheists would prescribe to such conclusions).

To be fair, there are tons of Muslims who say that there is nothing whatsoever that could ever cause them to stop believing in Islam.

[Perseveranze]

(Original post by SoNottingH)
Does it make it more true if the letters are large and turquoise?

Nope, it just makes it stand out. Thanks for the re-quoting in the same stand-out font though.

[PandyAndy]

(Original post by Perseveranze)
Or, you get to the entrance and do this;

And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

I remember an Atheist person I was talking to, who said even if he saw Jesus(pbuh) raise someone from the dead, he wouldn't believe it but think there's some logical/scientific explanation for it. (Not saying all Atheists would prescribe to such conclusions).

Or, you get to the entrance and it's like this;

Now heaven would be a DJ
spinning dub all night long
and heaven would just kicking back
with Jesus packing my bong
and if you don't believe in Jesus and Muhammad or Buddha too
and while the world is warring
just sit back and laugh at you singing.. OPM, Heaven is a Halfpipe. Verse 1.


Now most people think of heaven
they see those pearly gates
but I looked a little closer
and there's a sign says "do not skate"
so if you wanna come to my heaven
well we're all gonna have a ball
and everyone u know is welcome
'cause we got no gates or walls singing. OPM, Heaven is a Halfpipe. Verse 2.

[Perseveranze]

(Original post by PandyAndy)
[/SIZE]
Or, you get to the entrance and it's like this;

Now heaven would be a DJ
spinning dub all night long
and heaven would just kicking back
with Jesus packing my bong
and if you don't believe in Jesus and Muhammad or Buddha too
and while the world is warring
just sit back and laugh at you singing.. OPM, Heaven is a Halfpipe. Verse 1.


Now most people think of heaven
they see those pearly gates
but I looked a little closer
and there's a sign says "do not skate"
so if you wanna come to my heaven
well we're all gonna have a ball
and everyone u know is welcome
'cause we got no gates or walls singing. OPM, Heaven is a Halfpipe. Verse 2.

We will see

[SoNottingH]

(Original post by Perseveranze)
Nope, it just makes it stand out. Thanks for the re-quoting in the same stand-out font though.

And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

That's OK.

Maybe if it's this size people will believe there's something real about the Quran and it wasn't just a load of nonsense used by Arab politicians in the 7th Century to justify some war or other or the takeover of Mecca?

[Xotol]

(Original post by Perseveranze)
We will see

I don't think we will... our brains will cease to function when we are dead. It's just a shame that all of the religious people that devoted their lives to their faith will never understand that if they are indeed wrong. And the young generation continue to carry on wasting their time believing oblivious to that knowledge.

(Original post by Perseveranze)
Or, you get to the entrance and do this;

And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

What if we accept that our eyes have not been dazzled and we weren't 'affected by magic'. Did God take this occurrence into consideration?

[Lilio Candidior]

(Original post by SoNottingH)
LOL, he defines "secular" as follows:

"Second, the group I call “secular” report attending religious services less than a few times per year or explicitly say they have no religion."

People in the Dawkins report are people self-declared as Atheists. In the report you cited, it's anyone who doesn't go to Church as often as the Bible-thumping Fundamentalists do.

Really, a "report" which cites gross amounts of money instead of percentage of income is lacking seriously in methodology. The report I cited at least has a scientific methodology which lends itself to credible comparison, instead of the non-scientific trash you came dragging with.

[Arekkusu]

(Original post by blueray)
For all of you who believe in heaven/moksha etc, what do you think happens in heaven?

I mean it's all very well describing it and saying it's amazing etc etc, but i'm thinking wouldn't you eventually get bored?

I think their is something beyond heaven. Or that heaven is so great you can't get bored, and God is there to keep you company so you wouldn't be anyway.

Anyway let's try and put our imagination, religious scripts etc to try and describe it.
I know many will say we can't describe it and what goes on it, because we have never been there, but I say that's defeatist, lets just try anyway for the sake of it.

So go and explain.

Ps word of warning: any that don't believe in it atheists etc, please stay out of this (or hylean will kick you out).

What you wrote there in bold is what it is. You don't "do" anything, but you don't care, the point is you are in the presence of God, which is the pure state of bliss to which earthly activities try to approximate.

The static nature of heaven, to my mind, makes it absolutely consonant with consciousness actually stopping at death. If you remain in a static state for eternity, how is that different from a single second, from an experiential perspective?

[Perseveranze]

(Original post by Xotol)
What if we accept that our eyes have not been dazzled and we weren't 'affected by magic'. Did God take this occurrence into consideration?

Then you didn't quite understand the meaning of the verse. Which is surprising considering the Jesus example I gave. The meaning of the verse is simply saying that there are people who no matter what conclusive and apparent evidences you put in front of them, they still won't believe.

Btw, did you say you were ex-Muslim?

(Original post by SoNottingH)
And [even] if We opened to them a gate from the heaven and they continued therein to ascend, They would say, "Our eyes have only been dazzled. Rather, we are a people affected by magic." (Quran 15:14-15)

That's OK.

Maybe if it's this size people will believe there's something real about the Quran and it wasn't just a load of nonsense used by Arab politicians in the 7th Century to justify some war or other or the takeover of Mecca?

And that is what I was waiting for, the insincere, troll side.

And thanks yet again for not only quoting the verse, but increasing its stand-out, no one is going to miss this now. A shame there's no audio, that verse sounds even more beautiful in Arabic.

[ExMuslim]

In the Islamic heaven you get to have sex with "black eyed virgins", provided you martyr yourself in the name of God, and you get waited upon by young boys while you recline on a throne wearing "bracelets of silver and fine green silk". Apparently God doesn't like melanin, because everyone will have shinning white faces aswell. There will also be rivers of milk and honey and as many dates and raisins as you can possibly consume. This concept of heaven may have sounded appealing to seventh century desert dwellers, I personally think its weird and not all that appealing.

[SoNottingH]

(Original post by ExMuslim)
In the Islamic heaven you get to have sex with "black eyed virgins", provided you martyr yourself in the name of God, and you get waited upon by young boys while you recline on a throne wearing "bracelets of silver and fine green silk". Apparently God doesn't like melanin, because everyone will have shinning white faces aswell. There will also be rivers of milk and honey and as many dates and raisins as you can possibly consume. This concept of heaven may have sounded appealing to seventh century desert dwellers, I personally think its weird and not all that appealing.

Yes and from what you hear a lot of Arab gentleman confuse the two and have historically assumed that the "black eyed virgin houris" available 24/7 and "boy attendants" are one and the same thing.

[sumzy101]

(Original post by Giant)
Can you get kicked out of heaven?

Haha, I would get so bored...a frikkin' eternity! What is the point of life once your in heaven? Nothing!

is pretty much senseless...
what is the point of life once u r in heaven? that's gonna be a new life! a new beginning....nd the Heaven is going to be an award for you for being good in this life...don't we awl enjoy nd love awards in this word? then y not after life too? don't u love this life? dont u have so much to do? then y not tht life?

[sumzy101]

(Original post by blacklistmember)
God comes up to you and says he doesnt exist

errmmm so how does he come?

[sumzy101]

(Original post by ExMuslim)
In the Islamic heaven you get to have sex with "black eyed virgins", provided you martyr yourself in the name of God, and you get waited upon by young boys while you recline on a throne wearing "bracelets of silver and fine green silk". Apparently God doesn't like melanin, because everyone will have shinning white faces aswell. There will also be rivers of milk and honey and as many dates and raisins as you can possibly consume. This concept of heaven may have sounded appealing to seventh century desert dwellers, I personally think its weird and not all that appealing.

its not that it was more appealing to desert dwellers...nowadays the rate of sinning has been gradually increasing nd awl those pleasure which have been promised to be given in heaven are not being waited for anymore....people now have more nd better access to worldly pleasures...back then getting awl this wasn't as easy as it is now...but for ppl who even at today's date stay away from awl this..for them awl those rewards are most definitely rewarding...

[ExMuslim]

(Original post by sumzy101)
its not that it was more appealing to desert dwellers...nowadays the rate of sinning has been gradually increasing nd awl those pleasure which have been promised to be given in heaven are not being waited for anymore....people now have more nd better access to worldly pleasures...back then getting awl this wasn't as easy as it is now...but for ppl who even at today's date stay away from awl this..for them awl those rewards are most definitely rewarding...

LOL, contrary to what Pat Roberston says, sinning isn't a recent invention. The people of ancient times enjoyed just as much premarital sex and vices as we enjoy today. Even Muhammad couldn't wait for all the sex of heaven, seeing as he was married to nine women, with the youngest being just six years old.

[Xotol]

(Original post by Perseveranze)
Then you didn't quite understand the meaning of the verse. Which is surprising considering the Jesus example I gave. The meaning of the verse is simply saying that there are people who no matter what conclusive and apparent evidences you put in front of them, they still won't believe.

And my reply was that disbelievers who finally see heaven and a figure of divinity might actually accept God. I responded to the text you quoted.

Apparently the "evidences" is not so conclusive though.

Btw, did you say you were ex-Muslim?

Yes.