[Aethra]

(Original post by noisy06)
Islam is not based on ethnic lines. The poster was being racist to all whites, regardless of faith.

If Islam is not based on ethnic lines, how come some posters accused me of racism for criticising halal slaughter?

[alex5455]

(Original post by Hamsey45)
Im not indoctrinated. I disagree with a lot of things in Islam. I don't even consider myself a 'good' muslim. Im just stating the fact that when an animal's neck is sliced, on average, it takes around 20 seconds for death. With the stunning, usually 40 seconds. Also, Blleeding to death is MUCH less painful than being electrocuted because with stunning, you are attempting to close all synapses and neurones which may or may not work whereas if it is with a clean knife and it is done quickly on the carotid, the animal barely feels it. That is simple biology. I just disagree with two things. One that you, who clearly has just done the groundwork, feels that they can tell others who know more than you what the situation is Also, what does it matter to you if it is Halal or not? You eat it when it is stunned. Don't act like they taste different because that would make you a liar and ruins any validity your argument may have.

Finally, stunning does not always leave the animal unconscious. A better term would be 'a vegatable' or 'Brain-dead'. So the animal cannot do anything but still realises the situation. I suggest that rather than kicking up a fuss, just enjoy the food, Halal or not. I do not understand why people create arguments when they are unnecessary

actually none of what you have said is simple biology it is entirely wrong for instance, you cannot "close" neurones or synapses, and being in a braindead state means that the brain is no longer functioning so the entire conciousness shuts down which means no feeling at all you clearly do not understand anything. secondly a do not eat meat. however i do want to see a cruel and barbaric way of killing animals outlawed in the uk

[noisy06]

(Original post by Aethra)
If Islam is not based on ethnic lines, how come some posters accused me of racism for criticising halal slaughter?

Well that's wrong too then isn't it?

[tamimi]

oh nooo halal food oh nooo take shelter hide yo kids hide yo wife

[Hamsey45]

(Original post by alex5455)
actually none of what you have said is simple biology it is entirely wrong for instance, you cannot "close" neurones or synapses, and being in a braindead state means that the brain is no longer functioning so the entire conciousness shuts down which means no feeling at all you clearly do not understand anything. secondly a do not eat meat. however i do want to see a cruel and barbaric way of killing animals outlawed in the uk

whatever man. You think what you want. Meat is delicious and I love it anyway. To be honest, i do not give a **** about the animals. They would just as easily eat us and they taste too good. But you believe what you want to believe.

[smd4std]

it's the same ****

[Aethra]

Someone from the email address famalam247@hotmail.co.uk has emailed me with a spam message saying U RACIST BITCH! over and over again repeated thousands of times. So this is what happens when people criticise Muslim practices, is it? Do you think this is going to make me less likely, or more likely to try and do somehing about this, and similar issues?

[alex5455]

(Original post by tamimi)
oh nooo halal food oh nooo take shelter hide yo kids hide yo wife

hide your animals unless you want them torturing to death

[ads22uk]

(Original post by Aethra)
If Islam is not based on ethnic lines, how come some posters accused me of racism for criticising halal slaughter?

So you're basing Islam on what some posters on TSR said to you? In all seriousness though. If you want to know so badly whether you're eating something that is halal or not, you should go and ask the person you're buying it from. I doubt making a thread about it on TSR will give you much help.

Or maybe you're looking for some like minded individuals with an Islamaphobic perspective who you can have a conversation about with regards to how "disgusting" halal slaughter is. I don't know.

Anyway, just because your opinion is that the halal method of slaughter is cruel and unethical, that doesn't necessarily make it true. There are plenty of posters on here that will say that the halal method is just reasonable as other methods of slaughter. Either way you're entitled to your opinion even though its likely you probably haven't looked into it a great deal.

[alex5455]

(Original post by ads22uk)
So you're basing Islam on what some posters on TSR said to you? In all seriousness though. If you want to know so badly whether you're eating something that is halal or not, you should go and ask the person you're buying it from. I doubt making a thread about it on TSR will give you much help.

Or maybe you're looking for some like minded individuals with an Islamaphobic perspective who you can have a conversation about with regards to how "disgusting" halal slaughter is. I don't know.

Anyway, just because your opinion is that the halal method of slaughter is cruel and unethical, that doesn't necessarily make it true. There are plenty of posters on here that will say that the halal method is just reasonable as other methods of slaughter. Either way you're entitled to your opinion even though its likely you probably haven't looked into it a great deal.

how about you read the scientific perspective given by someone who understands this (i.e me) given earlier in the thread before calling people islamophobic (which is a made up word to marginalise people who criticise islam and the great beardy guy in the sky and the equally beardy "prophet"), there are many legitimate reasons to dislike halal slaughter, i have no problems with islam but i have problems with animal cruelty

[ads22uk]

(Original post by alex5455)
how about you read the scientific perspective given by someone who understands this (i.e me) given earlier in the thread before calling people islamophobic (which is a made up word to marginalise people who criticise islam and the great beardy guy in the sky and the equally beardy "prophet"), there are many legitimate reasons to dislike halal slaughter, i have no problems with islam but i have problems with animal cruelty

I didn't refer to anyone as Islamaphobic. Maybe you should take your own advice and read properly.

[RESIDUAL FLUX]

this is a disease

[Hamsey45]

(Original post by alex5455)
i have explained things many times to people like you, i do not care about people eating meat i think the animal should be treated well through its life and slaughtered as humanely as possible, i have already explained why halal does not meet this criteria, since a cow never will eat me that is a null and void point.

My phone keeps going off so im going to end this. I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE ANIMAL. Said that 3 times now. Also, the cow point is not void since you brought it in. You just cannot accept I made a valid point as YOU THINK YOU ARE BETTER THAN PEOPLE. IF you say that you do not care about meat-eaters, why are you making this big fuss then about how we conduct our business? Did I come and preach to you about why vegetarianism is bad? NO. So go away to your little Greenpeace meeting and decide which animal testing lab you are gonna break into next.

[charlotte-rose]

(Original post by 3309will)
The future of our country is worrying about something as ridiculous as Halal meat slaughtering

(Original post by James0507)
People ... stop believing in such utter nonsense as the idea that animals should be slaughtered after prayer and in a certain way.

I think these points best sum up both views. Those who will not eat Halal meat do so because of religious grounds and/or "humanitarian" grounds. These points cannot be argued, as they are simply opinion.

The same applies to the other side of the argument. The notion that the animal gets killed either way, so the slaughter process is irrelevant is also opinion.

As we are humans and shall never agree on these things, we can conclude that everyone should have the right to choose. Which brings us to this statement:

(Original post by Rainingshame)
It's a very black and white picture...... It's either Halal or not. Hence if it is labelled then it is. If not it's fair to assume that it isn't.

Unfortunately this is not the case. Usually the fact that meat is halal is either written in small print or not advertised at all. The only logicial conclusion seems to be that meat that is ritualistically slaughtered should be clearly labelled as such (kosher, halal etc).

There's my two cents at least.

[frankieboy]

When I get a MacDonalds I don't care whether it has testicle, sinew, brain, eyeball, scrotum, mucus, "head cheese", or "rim cheese" in it. But when it has Kosher meat in it, it offends my mainly agnostic principles and I end up chucking it at the nearest passing Jew.

[alex5455]

(Original post by frankieboy)
When I get a MacDonalds I don't care whether it has testicle, sinew, brain, eyeball, scrotum, mucus, "head cheese", or "rim cheese" in it. But when it has Kosher meat in it, it offends my mainly agnostic principles and I end up chucking it at the nearest passing Jew.

just because its not an issue for you does not mean its the same for everybody, some people are against it for religious reasons some are against it for animal rights reasons

[frankieboy]

(Original post by alex5455)
just because its not an issue for you does not mean its the same for everybody, some people are against it for religious reasons some are against it for animal rights reasons

I know, I know. I was just muckin abaaaaht ....

[Rat_Bag]

(Original post by noisy06)
Islam is not based on ethnic lines.

And yet a huge amount of honour and regard is showered upon anybody is who "Sayyid", or a decedent of Mohammad. You may argue that it is not Islamic, but why has this attitude evolved to dominate Islamic culture?

[noisy06]

(Original post by Rat_Bag)
And yet a huge amount of honour and regard is showered upon anybody is who "Sayyid", or a decedent of Mohammad. You may argue that it is not Islamic, but why has this attitude evolved to dominate Islamic culture?

That's more Shia Islam, we don't give a crap what they do. The only reason why there's more vigilance to Sayids in Islam is because of the Prophecy that one of them will be the Mahdi and also because it is prohibited to give any charity to Sayyids. In reality, they are just like anyone else.

[Jennybean]

(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
And if it is okay to eat meat then it is okay to have sex with animals. Consent is not an issue with the former, so it should not be an issue with the latter. Otherwise it's just a form of legal moralism. Thank you for stating that you're not a vegan though, it was expected though it does show in your posts.

What on earth are you talking about? This is pure slippery slope fallacy. Animals cannot give consent for anything we do to or for them, including positive acts such as health care to protect them, and conservation efforts/breeding programs for endangered species. Why should we be worried about consent? They are not sentient and cannot reason in the way that humans can, therefore it is our responsibility to act as compassionate advocates for their best interests. I notice you have not even bothered trying to argue with sense, with regards the question of cows being "raped" (lol).

(Original post by NDGAARONDI)
And fishing? Veal? Intensive battery farming with chicken broilers? Foie gras? Even dears when hunted do not always die instantly. Many furs are also products from animals that are skinned alive too. The problem with considering animal killing for meat being "humane" is that it is ultimately subjective. I'd have less of an issue if no animals were prohibited from being killed for meat and bestiality was not outlawed, as it's just hypocrisy.

Everything is subjective. You can't escape that. However, to claim that because animals die at the hands of humans, judgement of the method by which they are killed is pointless, is absolutely nonsensical. You are actually trying to tell me that it is silly to try and ensure that slaughter for the meat industry is as painless as possible, purely because some other animals live and die in horrendous conditions?

To be clear, inhumane conditions for veal calves, battery farming of chickens and force-feeding of poultry for liver paté are all unacceptable forms of animal cruelty that should be illegal, and the vast majority of sensible people within my profession agree. The fur trade in this country no longer exists, and there are tight controls over the hunting of livestock including "dears" (sic). And in my professional opinion, it won't be very long before the issue of ritualistic slaughter being permitted to continue in this country becomes a current issue once again. I would certainly expect to see it made illegal within my lifetime, and this is an opinion shared by many of the public health experts currently advising the government.