[Charlotte_19]

I'm doing Othello and Doctor Faustus/Pardoners tale, the later two are fine and my teacher has given us loads of useful information on them etc. However, my teacher for Othello is pretty poor and I really don't feel prepared for the exam and I don't feel like I have any real substance in my essays! They're practically GCSE standard!!

Any help on Othello would be amazing! Thanks


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[daniellaUS]

I'm having the exact same problem.
not WGGS by any chance?

[dragonkeeper999]

I did Othello back at GCSE, and found the York Notes books really helpful - they have more advanced versions available than GCSE. Might be worth a look - you can buy them pretty cheap on amazon/ ebay if you look.

[retrodisco666]

I did othello for my a2 coursework this year so if you have any questions i'd be happy to try and answer

[LOUDLOUD]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
I did othello for my a2 coursework this year so if you have any questions i'd be happy to try and answer

Is there any specific place online you found useful info from? we are studying it too next year, edexcel exam board

[Charlotte_19]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
I did othello for my a2 coursework this year so if you have any questions i'd be happy to try and answer

Do you have any useful context? My teacher has given us nothing!!


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[retrodisco666]

(Original post by LOUDLOUD)
Is there any specific place online you found useful info from? we are studying it too next year, edexcel exam board

No sorry, it's been from my notes and the front of the book... If you google something like "feminism desdemona othello" however you should get what you need. Mine has been aqa, the coursework is a comparison of 3 texts.

[retrodisco666]

(Original post by Charlotte_19)
Do you have any useful context? My teacher has given us nothing!!


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You mean stuff like;

An audience at the globe would not have felt sympathy for Iago not being promoted as he was a commoner, so contextual his rant of "he has already appointed an officer, a great arithmetician, one micheal cassio" has no real justification as there was no reason for him to feel jealous.

Did you mean stuff like that? Or just points about when it was written, perceived excetra

[Charlotte_19]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
You mean stuff like;

An audience at the globe would not have felt sympathy for Iago not being promoted as he was a commoner, so contextual his rant of "he has already appointed an officer, a great arithmetician, one micheal cassio" has no real justification as there was no reason for him to feel jealous.

Did you mean stuff like that? Or just points about when it was written, perceived excetra

Mainly stuff about when it was written and the way in which that alters the perception of the play


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[retrodisco666]

(Original post by Charlotte_19)
Mainly stuff about when it was written and the way in which that alters the perception of the play


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Well it was written about 1604. It is based on an Italian short story. It is not a play about racism; an original audience wanted to see plays about status so that Is what it would have been perceived as that is why it was very much othello's play until the mid 20th century when it became iago's play because people became interested in relationship. Things such as desdemona being slapped or iago yelling at emilianwould not have shocked them as it was a woman's place in society, things like iago assuming he would have been promoted or desdemona leaving brabantio's power without his permission would have shocked them. The second you consider it a play about racism you're screwed because there are very few lines in the play about othello's race, you could take those out and get the same affect. When they go to war in the play they go to Greece to an original audience this has significant point as there had been war with greece recently, so it makes that point even more poignant.

[Charlotte_19]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
Well it was written about 1604. It is based on an Italian short story. It is not a play about racism; an original audience wanted to see plays about status so that Is what it would have been perceived as that is why it was very much othello's play until the mid 20th century when it became iago's play because people became interested in relationship. Things such as desdemona being slapped or iago yelling at emilianwould not have shocked them as it was a woman's place in society, things like iago assuming he would have been promoted or desdemona leaving brabantio's power without his permission would have shocked them. The second you consider it a play about racism you're screwed because there are very few lines in the play about othello's race, you could take those out and get the same affect. When they go to war in the play they go to Greece to an original audience this has significant point as there had been war with greece recently, so it makes that point even more poignant.

Thank you!! That's brilliant


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[sj1994]

I find Othello the easier part of the exam as the second part of the exam you have to compare two texts (Duchess of Malfi and The poetry of John Donne for me).
For Othello there will always be a character question which is usually Othello or Iago - or women as a whole (I did see a paper where they asked about Cassio alone though :L )
There is also a themes question which could be for instance; jealousy, heroism etc.
Just make sure in each paragraph you include the usual example and deeply ANALYSE the language as this is where most of the marks lie. - also try and include social historical context and opinions from critics.

[Tsunami2011]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
The second you consider it a play about racism you're screwed because there are very few lines in the play about othello's race, you could take those out and get the same affect.

An old black ram is tupping your white ewe

Because we come to
do you service and you think we are ruffians, you'll
have your daughter covered with a Barbary horse;
you'll have your nephews neigh to you; you'll have
coursers for cousins and gennets for germans.
[…]
I am one, sir, that comes to tell you your daughter
and the Moor are now making the beast with two backs.
you'll have your daughter covered with a Barbary horse;
you'll have your nephews neigh to you.

To fall in love with what she fear'd to look on

Your son-in-law is far more fair than black.

Of her own clime, complexion, and degree,
Where to we see in all things nature tends—

I'm not sure I agree..

[retrodisco666]

(Original post by Tsunami2011)
I'm not sure I agree..

Moor is not Neciserily(sorry I can't spell it) used to mean black; it was more of a point to make him seem different rather than black.
And the far more feared than black; when Shakespeare was writing colour was used to denote things about personality (I.e. Skin like monumental alabaster when talking aboutD.) so the use of he is black would most probably of meant he has evil tendencies and if it's from the scene I think it is they are trying to scare brabantio so calling him evil is much more threatening. Obviously old black ram and thick Black lips are points about his race; but there is no part of the play which shows characters as racist really; iago has grevance due to lack of promotions, roderigo because he loves desdemona, desdemona and cassio adore him. Iago has many problems yes, but he doesn't say it's because he's "black" it's because of his personality and things he has done.

This is of course just what we've been taught, read and watched and everyone is entitled to their own opinion but from studying the time period and style of writing (I had to do othello for theatre as well so had to look at that) and things I've watched, a lot of Shakespeare experts agree it's not a play about racism

[sj1994]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
Moor is not Neciserily(sorry I can't spell it) used to mean black; it was more of a point to make him seem different rather than black.
And the far more feared than black; when Shakespeare was writing colour was used to denote things about personality (I.e. Skin like monumental alabaster when talking aboutD.) so the use of he is black would most probably of meant he has evil tendencies and if it's from the scene I think it is they are trying to scare brabantio so calling him evil is much more threatening. Obviously old black ram and thick Black lips are points about his race; but there is no part of the play which shows characters as racist really; iago has grevance due to lack of promotions, roderigo because he loves desdemona, desdemona and cassio adore him. Iago has many problems yes, but he doesn't say it's because he's "black" it's because of his personality and things he has done.

This is of course just what we've been taught, read and watched and everyone is entitled to their own opinion but from studying the time period and style of writing (I had to do othello for theatre as well so had to look at that) and things I've watched, a lot of Shakespeare experts agree it's not a play about racism

it baffles me that anyone can even so much as consider that othello is not a racist play...

[retrodisco666]

(Original post by sj1994)
it baffles me that anyone can even so much as consider that othello is not a racist play...

Care to elaborate? As if you take it as a play about racism then I think you're missing the point

[sj1994]

(Original post by retrodisco666)
Care to elaborate? As if you take it as a play about racism then I think you're missing the point

it's completely full of racial connotations, the beastiality throughout with links to the colour of his skin...

[retrodisco666]

(Original post by sj1994)
it's completely full of racial connotations, the beastiality throughout with links to the colour of his skin...

There are a handful of references to his color and his bestiality is to do with his character not race, it's a play about many things but not racism as moor literally meant foreigner. If you consider him as a character one of the main things he is different to everyone else, and the easiest way to do that in 1604 is to make him a foreigner; but it is not intrisic to the plot; some of the best performances have not had him black (1984, south Africa, othello was the only White member of cast. 1996, set it in veitnam and othello was from Texas. 2000, made desdemona a man so the thing that made him different was sexuality)

[lettucesoap]

I think the issue of race is subjective to context; in the 1600s audiences would not have seen Othello as a play about race as they would have considered his treatment as the norm, as seen in Queen Elizabeth's denouncing of "blackamoors" as barbaric animals.
Now, we consider race to be one of the main aspects of the play because of the progression of race relations, particularly in Britain and America which has larger black communities.
It's also subject to opinion, some contemporary critics have argued that without the race aspect and Othello being cast out as a black man in a white society, the drama would disappear, as Othello would not have been reacting to the prejudices placed against him - perhaps he would not have gone so far as to kill Desdemona so violently if he didn't feel the pressure of being black in a white society. This contrasts with others who argue that the play's central theme is jealousy and love, with race being largely irrelevant.
Retrodisco's point about him just being a foreigner, not necesserily black, is also valid, but then wouldn't that still make it a racist (perhaps the word is xenophobic) play? Discussing this would be a brilliant AO1 point given the right question. The word 'Moor' at the time was actually used to describe Muslims, not just black people. Shylock in the Merchant of Venice is similarly outcast because he was Jewish in a Christian society. We must also remember that Iago also dehumanises pretty much all of the characters he dislikes (especially the women) in similar ways, but the extent to which he does so could be argued.
At the same time though, I think it is right to question why Cassio is not referred to as a barbarian despite his status as a foreigner too (perhaps it was because he is essentially white? Or merely because despite being from a different province he is still Italian)..
As long as you can back up your opinion with quotes and context, you can propose your own argument. One of the things I love about English Lit.

[retrodisco666]

(Original post by lettucesoap)
I think the issue of race is subjective to context; in the 1600s audiences would not have seen Othello as a race about play as they would have considered his treatment as the norm, as seen in Queen Elizabeth's denouncing of "blackamoors" as barbaric animals.
Now, we consider race to be one of the main aspects of the play because of the progression of race relations, particularly in Britain and America which has larger black communities.
It's also subject to opinion, some contemporary critics have argued that without the race aspect and Othello being cast out as a black man in a white society, the drama would disappear, as Othello would not have been reacting to the prejudices placed against him - perhaps he would not have gone so far as to kill Desdemona so violently if he didn't feel the pressure of being black in a white society. This contrasts with others who argue that the play's central theme is jealousy and love, with race being largely irrelevant.
Retrodisco's point about him just being a foreigner, not necesserily black, is also valid, but then wouldn't that still make it a racist (perhaps the word is xenophobic) play? Discussing this would be a brilliant AO1 point given the right question. The word 'Moor' at the time was actually used to describe Muslims, not just black people. Shylock in the Merchant of Venice is similarly outcast because he was Jewish in a Christian society. We must also remember that Iago also dehumanises pretty much all of the characters he dislikes (especially the women) in similar ways, but the extent to which he does so could be argued.
At the same time though, I think it is right to question why Cassio is not referred to as a barbarian despite his status as a foreigner too (perhaps it was because he is essentially white? Or merely because despite being from a different province he is still Italian)..
As long as you can back up your opinion with quotes and context, you can propose your own argument. One of the things I love about English Lit.

Isn't it just what I mean about moor was rather than making it race related it was to make him different and visually at the time it's simpler...does that male sense?

But like you say as long as you back it up it doesn't matter