[exe]

We all know UKIP is associated with some rather unsavoury views. People's views on Europe vary, so I'd like to keep their actual policies on Europe out of this thread, and concentrate on their other stuff, especially increasing defense spending and their immigration scaremongering. I fear that if they become mainstream the racist views of some people that doubtless are among their ranks may, in turn become mainstream also.

[chrisawhitmore]

(Original post by exe)
We all know UKIP is associated with some rather unsavoury views. People's views on Europe vary, so I'd like to keep their actual policies on Europe out of this thread, and concentrate on their other stuff, especially increasing defense spending and their immigration scaremongering. I fear that if they become mainstream the racist views of some people that doubtless are among their ranks may, in turn become mainstream also.

If you're worried about racism becoming mainstream, imaginary racists in UKIP aren't your biggest problem. Labour have a shadow cabinet member with a documented history of racism. As to their defence spending, they advocate returns to 2001 levels, though the bulk of the increase in funding would go on improving pay, conditions and medical care for armed forces personnel. Finally, on immigration, they are almost unique in advocating a fair immigration system which does not discriminate based on country of origin, instead looking only at the qualifications and job prospects of the potential immigrant.

[exe]

Imaginary racists? You are aware UKIPs founder resigned because he felt that the party was too racist? You think that Racism has basically been totally eradicated from the party in 15 years even though no obvious effort has been made to do so? Give me a break.

Any increase in spending at all is a poor idea. If you DO increase it though, not spending it on boosting demand significantly and instead spending it on bolstering our army is a waste of time. Our army just needs serious top down reform

[natninja]

(Original post by exe)
We all know UKIP is associated with some rather unsavoury views. People's views on Europe vary, so I'd like to keep their actual policies on Europe out of this thread, and concentrate on their other stuff, especially increasing defense spending and their immigration scaremongering. I fear that if they become mainstream the racist views of some people that doubtless are among their ranks may, in turn become mainstream also.

I'm half ethnic but have been a British citizen since birth. UKIP are not really racist, those who are racist tend to be drawn towards the BNP. I do however share their anti-EU views and slightly right wing tendencies and think that actually at the moment they may make a better government than our current one.

[Martyn*]

Like someone said here: UKIP are Tory lite. Just listen to their accents! All of them are yuppies who believe that the only thing wrong with this country is that the EU is going to take away sovereignty.

[Macabre]

I find it interesting the current argument. I would have thought that the argument would have focused more on the EURO question rather than racism. Having an effective immagration policy which very strongly focuses on what the migrant has to offer our nation is a very sensible idea and does not make people racist for having border controls.

Secondly when any small party starts and gains attention unsavory characters are always present. I'm sure many political parties including the two largest have issues with keeping racist individuals out of their parties, so to accuse UKIP only having a racism problem is unfair. Thier sole objective is to challenge the rise of the euro which they feel are slowly breaking down our sovereign power to govern ourselves.

As for defence the UK must always have a capable armed force to deter attacks on our nation and help support other nations using our extensive experience in many theatres of warfare to help keep the world a safe place. Increases or decreases cannot be based solely on political ideology but on what is actually required for our boys and girls in green to do their jobs to the highest standards and as safe as possible.

[exe]

I actually agree with their immigration policy, just recognising that they use it in a sensationalist manner, I'm not suggesting supporting them is racist, but simply noting the fact that their policies might be appealing to racists who in turn might make racism further permeate a party where it has existed previously

[Macabre]

(Original post by exe)
I actually agree with their immigration policy, just recognising that they use it in a sensationalist manner, I'm not suggesting supporting them is racist, but simply noting the fact that their policies might be appealing to racists who in turn might make racism further permeate a party where it has existed previously

This is a very lightweight fear. Im sure all political party senior MPs and even high profile figures and celebrities have what they say and stand for used by racists to justify their short sighted and heavily misguided views on others.

You are perhaps right that there may or still be issues with racism within the party, but so are other parties and organisations within the UK and worldwide. Im sure they are working hard even to this day to try and manage any issues regarding such with great haste an efficiency.

[LETSJaM]

Since Farage took over all the more extreme members have left the party. Having said that. It seems you're making a mountain out of a mole hill.

<3 x

[Samd603]

(Original post by exe)
We all know UKIP is associated with some rather unsavoury views. People's views on Europe vary, so I'd like to keep their actual policies on Europe out of this thread, and concentrate on their other stuff, especially increasing defense spending and their immigration scaremongering. I fear that if they become mainstream the racist views of some people that doubtless are among their ranks may, in turn become mainstream also.

A bigger armed forces would mean a lot more jobs, especially for people who come from deprived areas and have little prospects of a stable career; and it would also mean having more influence abroad. Do you think Syria would be so defiant of foreign pressure if there were three state of the art aircraft carriers in striking distance? When the Falklands were invaded in 1982, Britain responded with a task force of over one hundred ships; today, Britain lacks the military resources to mobilise any sort of task force without help from allied nations. Not so good if no one really fancies getting involved, which is exactly what happened in 1982.

Mass immigration has devastated communities more than anyone cares to realise, to such an extent where people fear to go outside at night because drunk eastern Europeans rule the streets. Would you like to see your child in a school where students with English as their first language are in a minority? And not to mention the thousands of menial jobs that they have taken away from unskilled British workers.

UKIP are the only party committed to addressing these problems.

I think you need to do a little more research before you go comparing them to the National Front.

[johnaulich]

Apart from the jingoism, the (supposed) racism, and general immigration scaremongering, the thing that worries me about UKIP most is their tax policy, which includes the abolition of inheritance tax altogether; reduction of corporation tax, and a flat rate of income tax.

Why is it so terrifying for the poster above to have their child in a school where English as a first language is in the minority? The lessons are taught in English and kids pick it up quickly. This is the kind of language UKIP use instead of saying what they actually mean. People who don't have English as their first language are not English, so let me correct that for you:

'Do you want your child to go to a school where he could mix with people of different nationalities and/or races?'

And my answer to that, is a firm yes. Hopefully it would stop him/her turning out like you.

[Samd603]

(Original post by johnaulich)
Apart from the jingoism, the (supposed) racism, and general immigration scaremongering, the thing that worries me about UKIP most is their tax policy, which includes the abolition of inheritance tax altogether; reduction of corporation tax, and a flat rate of income tax.

Why is it so terrifying for the poster above to have their child in a school where English as a first language is in the minority? The lessons are taught in English and kids pick it up quickly. This is the kind of language UKIP use instead of saying what they actually mean. People who don't have English as their first language are not English, so let me correct that for you:

'Do you want your child to go to a school where he could mix with people of different nationalities and/or races?'

And my answer to that, is a firm yes. Hopefully it would stop him/her turning out like you.

Well you must be a deluded f...er to think that multiculturalism has been great for the UK.

[johnaulich]

(Original post by Samd603)
Well you must be a deluded f...er to think that multiculturalism has been great for the UK.

I think the things people are quick to blame on immigrants are just as often your fault or mine. Take some responsibility. The far right's modus operandi is to turn people against each other by blaming one group or the other rather than trying to get to the root of complex issues.

Guess what? British louts get drunk and frighten people too.

[Gales]

Yes, UKIP are homophobes.

[SpiggyTopes]

(Original post by chrisawhitmore)
If you're worried about racism becoming mainstream, imaginary racists in UKIP aren't your biggest problem. Labour have a shadow cabinet member with a documented history of racism. As to their defence spending, they advocate returns to 2001 levels, though the bulk of the increase in funding would go on improving pay, conditions and medical care for armed forces personnel. Finally, on immigration, they are almost unique in advocating a fair immigration system which does not discriminate based on country of origin, instead looking only at the qualifications and job prospects of the potential immigrant.

So true!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Tc6Cb3wHu8 I love Portillo's face in this (not in a dodgy way)!

and she's a fraud... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4wHx0oVUMM

She has also said she doesn't like blonde haired and blue eyed Finnish nurses because they don't understand her culture!

[TheHansa]

The immigration policy taken on its own is probably fairer.

Right now a white person from eastern europe can just move in no questions asked, but an Indian/Pakistani has to apply for a passport, simply because of where they were born and who their parents were, UKIP says everyone who is not already a UK national has to apply and puts them each on an equal footing so it's about what their credentials are. Sounds less racist imo.

The increase in military spending seems pointless but it's mostly for wages which would increase aggregate demand rather than being for buying new kit from the 'mericans/private sector, the important thing is keeping the troops at home unless they're actually defending this country.

[patrickinator]

What a ridiculous thread. UKIP embraces European co-operation and trade. What it stands up against is EU bureaucrats taking powers away from Westminster and creating ridiculous laws. Furthermore, this is the party that predicted the Eurozone crisis when bond markets started to waver in 2009.

JUST BECAUSE ITS NAME IS SHORTENED TO UKIP DOES NOT MAKE IT RACIST. STOP ASSOCIATING IT WITH THE BNP!

[patrickinator]

(Original post by natninja)
I'm half ethnic but have been a British citizen since birth. UKIP are not really racist, those who are racist tend to be drawn towards the BNP. I do however share their anti-EU views and slightly right wing tendencies and think that actually at the moment they may make a better government than our current one.

This

[james22]

I will never vote for them because of their very strict policies on crime and punishment which they say will reduce srime, but as we can see in countries with similar policies do not work.

[ukip72]

(Original post by exe)
We all know UKIP is associated with some rather unsavoury views. People's views on Europe vary, so I'd like to keep their actual policies on Europe out of this thread, and concentrate on their other stuff, especially increasing defense spending and their immigration scaremongering. I fear that if they become mainstream the racist views of some people that doubtless are among their ranks may, in turn become mainstream also.

UKIP is not associated with unsavoury views, that seems to be just you. UKIP wouldn't be polling 8% if people believed them to be racist. As for defence, British troops are fighting in Afghanistan and have been woefully under equipped, extra spending is just what we need. Recognising the problems of mass immigration is not scaremongering, because Labour and the Tories are afraid to speak about it UKIP should be applauded for being prepared to speak about it.

Don't talk about things you know nothing about.