[Harlee24]

LOL, right... not THAT bad eh?
I know what you mean though, i just think these kinds of threads are pointless, people will believe what they want to believe, often what others say doesn't make a difference...
I'm Muslim, i get abuse sometimes... but hey like i said, I'm going to be the better person and judge every person by their character, and defy stupid stereotypes

[.eXe]

(Original post by NuckingFut)
Kinda like you've been doing on TSR.

.exe: making himself look like an idiot, est April 2011

Hm, the number of PMs I get in support say otherwise

Also, just to make clear, I do make very charged points. But I dare you to "prove" me wrong on a single one of them.

Go ahead.

If I am so ridiculous then proving me wrong should be easy for you.

What I say are facts of your belief system. You may not like them, you may not agree with them and majority of muslims may not agree with them...but that doesn't mean that the facts change unfortunately.

And it's .eXe

[etothepii]

This thread is yet another example.

[Harlee24]

(Original post by Banishingboredom)
Bull****. You can't choose your race or your sexuality, but your religion and any other beliefs you hold are fair game.

And don't come out with the "oh let everyone believe what they want" line because religion plays a huge role in public life and it dominates society.

When people are incorrectly educated (e.g. dismissing evolution) or persecuted for their sexuality or non-belief in a religion (e.g. the crusades) or for contravening an illogical religious law then I have a problem and so should any rational human being.

Hey, i totally agree with you, but your religion and beliefs don't have to be exactly the same thing...
You could be Muslim but not believe in capital punishment... and i know many Muslims who actually do disagree with it, so that's why you judge a person by character and not religion.

[Ayshizzle]

(Original post by G-STAR01)
The point is that the breaking of a special allegiance and brotherhood, it still amounts as the person being a traitor.

No, it's different.

I'll give you a working example:

I do not have allegiance to the coalition government. I do not agree with some of their policies.
However, I am allowed to do so with no punishment.
If, however, I made a plot to assassinate David Cameron, and had a go at it then I would be subject to punishment, which is fair enough.

With regards to apostasy:

Someone leaves Islam and becomes an apostate as they no longer believe in the ideologies of Islam, and/or disagree with some of it. Therefore, they cannot call themselves a Muslim.
If they left the religion and made plans to start killing Muslims, then they should be punished.


Also, you are ignoring the fact that someone cannot just choose whether or not they believe.

If you "disbelieve" in the government you won't be punished.

So no, apostasy is not the same as treason.

[.eXe]

(Original post by Harlee24)
LOL, right... not THAT bad eh?
I know what you mean though, i just think these kinds of threads are pointless, people will believe what they want to believe, often what others say doesn't make a difference...
I'm Muslim, i get abuse sometimes... but hey like i said, I'm going to be the better person and judge every person by their character, and defy stupid stereotypes

I agree with you, they actually are relatively pointless because they fail to motivate any real change. However, even if they affect one individual, this forum has accomplished something.

My intention is never to enforce muslims globally to renounce their religion.

Rather, i just want them to acknowledge the objective facts about it, that's all. You can be muslims all your lives...all the power to you. Just don't deny al the negatives about your belief system.

That's my only goal.

[NuckingFut]

(Original post by .eXe)
Hm, the number of PMs I get in support say otherwise

Also, just to make clear, I do make very charged points. But I dare you to "prove" me wrong on a single one of them.

Go ahead.

If I am so ridiculous then proving me wrong should be easy for you.

What I say are facts of your belief system. You may not like them, you may not agree with them and majority of muslims may not agree with them...but that doesn't mean that the facts change unfortunately.

And it's .eXe

Care to share these pm's of support?

I'm to lazy to argue with the points to make, but other members refute them just fine.

What you say is not facts of my belief system. Firstly they're none of your business. And you don't understand them, that much is obvious from your posts, so why bother?

exe, exe., ExE:, whatever man, its all the same to me lol

[Florrick]

(Original post by .eXe)
See you have nothing left to argue so now you're just making yourself look foolish.

You do know what you say here is seen by a lot of people who are regulars on the religion sub-forum right?

How do you think any of your future arguments will be seen, in light of your ridiculous behaviour right now?

I strongly suggest you stop responding so you don't get embarrassed further.

Well when these people quotes on wikipedia come to effect in India and the verses in the Vedas that have sanctioned discrimination against non-Aryans goes, then I'll believe the people quotes on wikipedia.



I'll stop responding now to make you happy. Your happiness is something I genuinely endear.

[Frankster]

(Original post by DanLorenzo)
Everyone attacks everything on TSR

LOL Haha! That's what TSR is for!

[Harlee24]

(Original post by .eXe)
I agree with you, they actually are relatively pointless because they fail to motivate any real change. However, even if they affect one individual, this forum has accomplished something.

My intention is never to enforce muslims globally to renounce their religion.

Rather, i just want them to acknowledge the objective facts about it, that's all. You can be muslims all your lives...all the power to you. Just don't deny al the negatives about your belief system.

That's my only goal.

Look, I know what you mean, but when you've been raised by values your whole life, they make sense to you, and you will do anything to stand up for them, especially after 9/11 and when the "proper" dicrimination started, that's why Muslims have gotten so defensive, because now, after all these years, everything "seems" to be aimed at us, i know it probably isn't but many Muslims see it that way especially older ones...
Personally, I think the world really needs to get over all types of discrimination i mean we're all human, if someone's nice to you, you have no reason to not be nice to them.

[Florrick]

(Original post by .eXe)
You'd be surprised at how amazing many of the muslims I know are.

We argue all the time, gets heated quite often but it's never about stupid things. they don't make foolish arguments like yourself and they understand that my dislike for Islam does not automatically mean I dislike muslims.

I haven't met any Christians but an ardent anti-theist who unfortunately felt the bible should be burnt. I don't think she admired Islam either.


That said, I don't tend to discuss religion outside TSR.

[.eXe]

(Original post by NuckingFut)
Care to share these pm's of support?

I'm to lazy to argue with the points to make, but other members refute them just fine.

What you say is not facts of my belief system. Firstly they're none of your business. And you don't understand them, that much is obvious from your posts, so why bother?

exe, exe., ExE:, whatever man, its all the same to me lol

There's a reason they are called "private messages"

I'd have to go ask each of them for permission.

Why does it matter if it's my business or not? Anything that affects this world is most certainly my business because I live in this world. Sadly, I do understand them. That's your biggest issue. You have no argument against me so you just say that I am misunderstanding stuff.

Also, neither of those 3 are correct.

It's .eXe

Are you dyslexic or just pretending to be?

[.eXe]

(Original post by Florrick)
I haven't met any Christians but an ardent anti-theist who unfortunately felt the bible should be burnt. I don't think she admired Islam either.


That said, I don't tend to discuss religion outside TSR.

You should. It's always nice to get into in-person debates about things like this.

The last thing you want is to have followed a faith blindly, without ever hearing the opposing perspective. Stuff like this can only better inform you, it cannot possibly lower your knowledge.

[sheepstick]

i thought this was supposed to be a disscusion so why are people insulitng each other? and plus scince when did hindus and other religons become a part of this? if you cant fight your own battle dont start one!

[prog2djent]

Or what OP, for criticising Islam will atheists and anti-theists end up the same way as Theo van Gogh?



Will we have to live under police protection like the cartoonists from Sweden, Denmark and Holland, will there be PROTESTS by people frothing at the mouth, calling for the death, fatwa's, attempted murders and bomb threats like Salman Rushdie



Will we have to live under police protection and leace our home country, then move from our second country we feel like home is, like Ayaan Ali?




Liberal muslims, are they targetted aswell? Of course!! http://www.ahl-alquran.com/English/s...p?main_id=8086

Will atheist and secular convention be boycotted by Salafist ***** trying to break in and attack members or threaten to blow up the place? Which happened?



(Bremner is great)

OP, you've inspired me to go watch Fitna, and I was hoping to post various pictures of Muhammed just to take a stab at you, but unfortunately the TSR mods against free speach would blocke me,

"islamophobia is word invented by apologists who want to silence criticism where it is best deserved" - Geert Wilders.

[Rhiannonymous]

Not bothering to look back at the pages and pages of posts before me to see if anyone's actually said this but, Fahim711.......f****ng genius troll eh? -_-

[.eXe]

(Original post by Harlee24)
Look, I know what you mean, but when you've been raised by values your whole life, they make sense to you, and you will do anything to stand up for them, especially after 9/11 and when the "proper" dicrimination started, that's why Muslims have gotten so defensive, because now, after all these years, everything "seems" to be aimed at us, i know it probably isn't but many Muslims see it that way especially older ones...
Personally, I think the world really needs to get over all types of discrimination i mean we're all human, if someone's nice to you, you have no reason to not be nice to them.

Yes I do. They can argue but they aren't allowed to waste my time.

If you see my post history, you will see that I make extra effort to be courteous to those who make good arguments. And many of them do actually. Many of them are muslim or atheist and yet I often agree with them and am never rude or mean.

But then there are the special cases. The ones who argue for arguments sake, never actually look at the responses, make nonsense and gibberish points and when cornered...start talking off topic gibberish.

No, I have absolute reason to not tolerate nonsense like that.

[Elipsis]

(Original post by Newbie123)
5 Pillars of Islam:

Shahadah
Salah
Zakat
Hajj
Sawm

GCSE RE has served me well.

It's a shame the Quaran doesn't tell you how to pray properly, isn't it? It only mentions 4 but the haddiths mention 5. What a perfect book! Also why did God change his mind about which direction you should pray in? First Jerusalem then Mecca? Human religion is human.

[Harlee24]

(Original post by .eXe)
Yes I do. They can argue but they aren't allowed to waste my time.

If you see my post history, you will see that I make extra effort to be courteous to those who make good arguments. And many of them do actually. Many of them are muslim or atheist and yet I often agree with them and am never rude or mean.

But then there are the special cases. The ones who argue for arguments sake, never actually look at the responses, make nonsense and gibberish points and when cornered...start talking off topic gibberish.

No, I have absolute reason to not tolerate nonsense like that.

Of course you don't, and i therefore i totally agree with you, people who make arguments for agruments sake are damn annoying no matter what religion they are, i mean why would you bother arguing when you can't back it up?
I'm really stubborn and i would only argue if i knew i would win..
anyway, I going off this depressing pointless thread.. bye all.

[Alexok]

All I'm going to say is, realistically, what do you expect? I will ask my Muslim friends, what would your dad do if he found out you were gay or something, and they reply with some crazy thing. They are so stuck in their belief it just seems inevitable bad stuff will happen