Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paper
Discuss current events and changes in the education system and ways you'd like to see it improved, from secondary school through to postgraduate study.
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Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperRead an interesting article which pretty much sums up my views:
https://raceclassgenderetc.wordpress...iece-of-paper/
What does everyone think? I think the sheer volume of undergraduates has de-valued university both in terms of job market prospects and teaching quality. -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperCalm down, you're not even at uni yet and you're already judging.(Original post by Muscovite)
Simple way to resolve it. Shut down all the pretend third rate universities like Sheffield Hallam and Nottingham Trent etc; leaving just the Russell groups; we'd have more govt. money to make up for the loss of fees that would improve research plus undergrad degrees would be worth a hell of a lot more. Simple
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperThe job market is well and truly saturated with graduates since Labour went on it's little 'make everyone middle class' spree. It gave a lot of people false hope. They didn't have anyone who had gone to university in their family before them, so they mistakenly thought it was a ticket to the easy/good life and that it certainly isn't. What it is is a ticket to a steady income of 20-30k for the rest of your life, or if you're lucky a bit more or unlucky a bit less. If you want to earn more than 50k a year then you really need to strike out on your own and start working for yourself and make your own business. And making your own business doesn't require a degree... but if you got a degree from a good uni you will certainly know more people than the average non-university educated person.
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperWho are you to pass judgement? You haven't even started university yet!(Original post by Muscovite)
Simple way to resolve it. Shut down all the pretend third rate universities like Sheffield Hallam and Nottingham Trent etc; leaving just the Russell groups; we'd have more govt. money to make up for the loss of fees that would improve research plus undergrad degrees would be worth a hell of a lot more. Simple
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperWhat I don't get is all these people from supposedly 'top' universities beefing about the ex polys because they say their degree is devalued because 'everybody has one'.
But I have learned off TSR that if you went to an ex poly all the employers just go LOL and throw your application in the bin so those of us from the superduper elite universities are not having to compete with them anyway we only have to compete with each other.
So I don't see what the problem is.
Surely its not a case of employers actually considering people from ex polys, so we have to compete with them
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperto be fair, even if he's not I am at uni and I completely agree with him - there's no way we should have all these so called universities just to harbor people who didn't try hard at school for a few years. Seeing my friends at these places the standards are a joke it's more of a 3 year party than a degree(Original post by SpicyStrawberry)
Calm down, you're not even at uni yet and you're already judging. -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paper(Original post by MagicNMedicine)
What I don't get is all these people from supposedly 'top' universities beefing about the ex polys because they say their degree is devalued because 'everybody has one'.
But I have learned off TSR that if you went to an ex poly all the employers just go LOL and throw your application in the bin so those of us from the superduper elite universities are not having to compete with them anyway we only have to compete with each other.
So I don't see what the problem is.
Surely its not a case of employers actually considering people from ex polys, so we have to compete with them
no it's more the problem of government money being thrown in the bin in an attempt to 'polish turds' that is the cause of frustration -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperDoing poorly in exams does not make you a piece of ****, Christ.(Original post by fortransexual)
no it's more the problem of government money being thrown in the bin in an attempt to 'polish turds' that is the cause of frustration -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperacademically speaking, I don't mean they are a bad person.(Original post by alexmagpie)
Doing poorly in exams does not make you a piece of ****, Christ.
I'd never get into an arts academy because I've got no talent for it whatsoever (that's pretty reasonable), I don't see why people get subsidised in academia despite having no talent for it whatsoever. -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperJust a 'for the record' thing. Not all ex-polys are crap and terrible and not worth going to. Most have something they're good at, even if it's just a specific subject area.
Anyway. I would much rather have 80% of people going to universities - whether ex-poly or not - and have people generally be more educated than what we have now. (Seems to work in Finland, for women anyway - and before someone asks http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11438140 ). A more educated workforce is a better workforce, in my opinion.
Because you don't have to work hard to get into ex-polys. Right. So I'm aiming for ABB+ for an ex-poly without doing any work or trying hard?(Original post by fortransexual)
to be fair, even if he's not I am at uni and I completely agree with him - there's no way we should have all these so called universities just to harbor people who didn't try hard at school for a few years. Seeing my friends at these places the standards are a joke it's more of a 3 year party than a degree -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperSo on your logic we should also close Bath, St Andrews, Lancaster, Loughborough, Leicester, Sussex, Surrey, Royal Holloway, UEA, Reading and Goldsmiths. None of these are in the Russell Group, and i'd say they were very strong institutions.(Original post by Muscovite)
Simple way to resolve it. Shut down all the pretend third rate universities like Sheffield Hallam and Nottingham Trent etc; leaving just the Russell groups; we'd have more govt. money to make up for the loss of fees that would improve research plus undergrad degrees would be worth a hell of a lot more. Simple
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paper(Original post by TheWorldEndsWithMe)
Just a 'for the record' thing. Not all ex-polys are crap and terrible and not worth going to. Most have something they're good at, even if it's just a specific subject area.
Anyway. I would much rather have 80% of people going to universities - whether ex-poly or not - and have people generally be more educated than what we have now. (Seems to work in Finland, for women anyway - and before someone asks http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11438140 ). A more educated workforce is a better workforce, in my opinion.
Because you don't have to work hard to get into ex-polys. Right. So I'm aiming for ABB+ for an ex-poly without doing any work or trying hard?
see how you feel when you meet people on campus that have got DDE.
my friend went to an ex-poly with AAB and he's averaging 85% despite the fact he never seems to do any work. I have not heard of anybody averaging 85% in his subject at my university, even those who put in a great deal of effort and have multiple A*s at A level -
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This is a good point, not all good universities are in the Russell group.(Original post by swbp)
So on your logic we should also close Bath, St Andrews, Lancaster, Loughborough, Leicester, Sussex, Surrey, Royal Holloway, UEA, Reading and Goldsmiths. None of these are in the Russell Group, and i'd say they were very strong institutions.
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****s wrong with ex polys? This is a slippery slope, eventually it'll become oh just close down everything apart from Oxbridge,London unis, Durham. Then well soon go back to the old age where only elite went to uni.
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperI agree with the article apart from the devaluing part. They forget that unis are not the same quality and employers know that. The average degree is worth less and average career prospects are worse but looking at the average is pointless. The average quality of student has also fallen so you have to compare similar students with each other. If the opening of oxford brookes has made an oxford degree worth less in the job market then they would have a point but it is no suprise that the average value of a degree from an institution in oxford fell after oxford brookes opened.
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperAgreed, the incentive structures in place discourage pursuing education properly. Undergraduate degrees are seen as nothing more than a commodity. What's more, they are a commodity that is losing value.
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paperOkay, fine, so if I meet people who got DDE, then I probably will wonder what on earth they're studying and whether they'll get a decent job at the end of it. But I'm not going to judge them on their academia, which is what you appear to be doing.(Original post by fortransexual)
see how you feel when you meet people on campus that have got DDE.
my friend went to an ex-poly with AAB and he's averaging 85% despite the fact he never seems to do any work. I have not heard of anybody averaging 85% in his subject at my university, even those who put in a great deal of effort and have multiple A*s at A level
But by your logic, it would make more sense for me to go to my insurance - University of Liverpool - rather than Anglia Ruskin, depsite the fact that AR is asking for 3 grades higher than Liverpool? I could get the Liverpool grades - BCC - with only a bit of effort, but getting the ABB for Anglia is taking quite a bit of effort on my part.
Sure sounds good to me, if all I cared about was getting into a Russel Group.
I'm not saying that some of the time, 'old' universities have harder courses than ex-polys, but it isn't fair to tar them all with the same brush. -
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Re: Your undergraduate degree is nothing more than a piece of paper(Original post by Trollolollol)
****s wrong with ex polys? This is a slippery slope, eventually it'll become oh just close down everything apart from Oxbridge,London unis, Durham. Then well soon go back to the old age where only elite went to uni.
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only if you're completely incapable of dealing with it in a reasonable manner.
That's like saying if we close down News of the World for being corrupt we then have to close down all the other news papers that are not totally immaculate at well.
Pretty unrealistic world view right.
