'Please God, make it stop!' British female journalist, 21, describes horrific sexual

Look i don't get why you're swearing, i was just explaining the fact that not all Arab men are the same. Calm down.

No I get pissed at idiots who point out the blatantly obvious. No not all Arab men are like this, however I would estimate that the vast majority of Arab men have disgusting views about women because it is so deeply rooted and ingrained in their society

By hidden I don't mean completely unknown. I mean it's covered up, not spoken of in public forums, ignored, and everyone pretends that their societies are better than western ones where issues are trying to be addressed, and are spoken of.

There are muslim states, states which try govern with Islam as guidance for making and implementing laws. Whether they follow it efficiently/fully or not isn't relevant. We're talking about societies which try to use Islam as guidance, which they were asked to do in order to make a better, more ideal society.

We certainly can blame Islamic teachings. They were written by and for men like the ones involved in this crime (and of course by more moral men, let's not generalize). Certain passages are used to justify immoral acts, and you can try to argue that 'they were not intended to be used that way', but they were, if you do some research into their development and their context. The attitudes and practices propagated by most flavours of Islam lead to increased rates of this sort of behaviour. Why? A few reasons. Because human psychology is not compatible with certain teachings, which leads to certain acts, out of frustration, guilt, anger etc and certain mindsets. The governments set up with Islam in mind are simply terrible at their job, because they are not compatible with the modern world, and plain old hatred and intolerance that you can find in the religious texts, which are bound to be interpreted in a certain way (the way they were supposed to be interpreted) and this leads to not only what you see happening in the middle east, but backwards cultures being sustained and fed to make them more intolerant and backwards, resistent to chance, instead of freeing them and letting them evolve.

What I am more interested in, is how you think certain passages from the Qur'aan are used to 'justify immoral acts'? could you provide an example?

Wow! It's shocking things like this happen, some people still think women are pieces of meat. Sickening.

That is true for all rapes.

Bear in mind, Egyptian men and women rushed to the victims aid.
Egypt as a whole must not be judged on this horrific action.

Only two Egyptian men, out of thousands that were present and watching this gang rape

There were a group of them. Hardly thousands.

Im not going to argue about the whole 'hidden crimes' point, because by the very nature of it being 'hidden', you cannot objectively prove to me that what you are saying is correct.

What I am more interested in, is how you think certain passages from the Qur'aan are used to 'justify immoral acts'? could you provide an example?

It's actually laughable, given that the Qur'aan quite clearly prohibits immorality, and clearly prohibits fornication and adultery. So Im not sure how you would argue that these very same passages could be used to justify rape?

The reasons you have given for the negative behaviours 'propogated by Islam':

1. "human psychology is not compatible with certain teachings" : Totally subjective. Thousands of people all over the world find their psychology compatible with the teachings of Islam. That aside, you cannot even objectively tell me what principles/ways of life can be compatible with the human psychology.

2."The governments set up with Islam in mind are simply terrible at their job": The reason you have given is that the fault lies with the people of the government, that they are terrible at their job. Fail to see how the faults of people relates to the Qur'aan.

this culture =/= Islam

What does Shariah law say about this?



kthnxandgoodbye

True

But that culture is very heavily influenced by Islam.

I don't think your argument is logical.

There are other sources and causes of misogyny, therefore Islamic teachings are not a source of misogyny?...

All of those examples are cases where the culture/religion has led to people having mindsets and attitudes which lead to those acts. The culture could have these negative aspects for different reasons, but in the middle east it's very clear what the pollutant is.

It's very clear in the middle east, the flavour of misogyny there is very centred on Islamic concepts regarding women, and these islamic concepts were written by misogynistic men who lived in a very misogynistic culture in the 7th century.

And not only that, but Islam and other religions have the habit of perpetuating a backwards country, stunting its growth, by suppressing knowledge and keeping people in certain traditional roles.

Well, for one thing if there are any witnesses involved, two women would be equivalent to two men, so that when one of them inevitably forgets or gets confused, the other woman can remind here, since women are obviously inferior to men. This is according to the quran.

And do you know what happens to virgins in prisons? They are raped by the guards, because virgins can't go to hell, and the guards want them to go to hell. Islam doesn't ask for this, but it is certainly the result of islamic/religious teaching.

Also, slave girls/concubines are permitted in Islam, and not only that, it's ok to have sex with them. This is essentially rape, as a captured woman is very unlikely to want to have sex with their master, and nowhere does it state the requirement for her consent. That's the thing with abrahamic religions, the idea of a woman's consent is very unimportant, or a last thought. That's why there are several confusions when interpreting texts on whether they condone rape or not. Simply, rape is a redundant concept for those who who wrote the religious texts.

Shariah is mainly concerned with the prevention, on the woman's part, of rape, as if it's her fault.

1. SHARIA LAW OF STAYING HOME

Woman must stay home to avoid exposure to na-mahrams.

Quran says:

33.33 “Stay quietly in your homes”

.In his tafsir- quran , Maulana Mohiuddin says “It is not only forbidden to get out of the house, but it is also HARAM to go out of her house”.

Quran 33:32: O wives of the Prophet, you are not like anyone among women. If you fear Allah , then do not be soft in speech [to men], lest he in whose heart is disease should covet, but speak with appropriate speech.
Quran 33:33: And abide in your houses and do not display yourselves as [was] the display of the former times of ignorance. And establish prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Allah intends only to remove from you the impurity [of sin], O people of the [Prophet's] household, and to purify you with [extensive] purification.

Refering to the Prophets wives.



2. SHARIA LAW OF LEAVING HOME UNDER COMPULSION

If a woman must leave home under absolute compulsion like escaping fire , she must cover herself fully in a chador or burqa and must always be accompanied with an adult mehram ( preferably carrying an open sword)

Quran says:

33.59 (Hilali and Khan) O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) all over their bodies (i.e.screen themselves completely except the eyes or one eye to see the way) when leaving home (under compulsion)..

An excellent example to implement this aya and the applicable sharia law was displayed by diligent Saudi religious police . They prevented unveiled (and unaccompanied by mehrams) young women from escaping a burning school building by beating them back with sticks. Most of them died with their honor in tact, thanks to these pious muslims.

Quran 33:59: O Prophet, tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to bring down over themselves [part] of their outer garments. That is more suitable that they will be known and not be abused. And ever is Allah Forgiving and Merciful.

Doesn't say veil at all, it says about them to dress modestly at all times, nothing about being forced to wear it when going outside.



3. SHARIA LAW OF RAPE

In case a woman gets raped , she is considered guilty of adultery unless she can provide four adult muslim male witnesses who had watched the action and who would testify that the sex was actually forced on her and that she was not a willing partner in it. If she has only female witnesses in case she was raped by an intruder in front of her fellow wives and slave girls or in a women’s dormitory full of women witnesses then she is out of luck. Her punishment is stoning to death if she is married or hundred (100) lashes if single.

A 19 year old girl was gang raped repeatedly by six momins in Saudi Arabia recently and was given a punishment of 200 lashes and six months prison ( the punishment was increased because it was a gang rape)

http://islamqa.info/en/ref/72338
"The punishment for rape in Islam is same as the punishment for zina, which is stoning if the perpetrator is married, and one hundred lashes and banishment for one year if he is not married.

Some scholars also say that he is required to pay a mahr to the woman."

Punishment is quite clear

4.SHARIA LAW OF SEX WITH CAPTURED WOMEN

Allah has made sex with captured women and slave girls (right hand possessions) halal in quran by five ayas (4.3, 4.24, 23.6,33.50,70.30). Thus when a rape victim is imprisoned awaiting stoning or lashings or any other woman is incarcerated for any other reason she qualifies as a captured woman and sex with her becomes halal . That is Islamic fringe benefits for the prison officials and guards who work long hours at low pay.

looooooooooooooooooool please tell me a scholar who states such
4:3: "And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses. That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice]."(Talks and marriage and conditions for more than 1 wife)
4.24:"Prohibited to you [for marriage] are your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father's sisters, your mother's sisters, your brother's daughters, your sister's daughters, your [milk] mothers who nursed you, your sisters through nursing, your wives' mothers, and your step-daughters under your guardianship [born] of your wives unto whom you have gone in. But if you have not gone in unto them, there is no sin upon you. And [also prohibited are] the wives of your sons who are from your [own] loins, and that you take [in marriage] two sisters simultaneously, except for what has already occurred. Indeed, Allah is ever Forgiving and Merciful." (States who is a mahram and whos not and permissibility of marriage)
23.6:"Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed -"(From the previous verse about guarding your private parts, as your wives are the only who can see such and so on)
33.50:"O Prophet, indeed We have made lawful to you your wives to whom you have given their due compensation and those your right hand possesses from what Allah has returned to you [of captives] and the daughters of your paternal uncles and the daughters of your paternal aunts and the daughters of your maternal uncles and the daughters of your maternal aunts who emigrated with you and a believing woman if she gives herself to the Prophet [and] if the Prophet wishes to marry her, [this is] only for you, excluding the [other] believers. We certainly know what We have made obligatory upon them concerning their wives and those their right hands possess, [but this is for you] in order that there will be upon you no discomfort. And ever is Allah Forgiving and Merciful."(Marriage rules and conditions)
70.30ame as 23.6