[cl_steele]

(Original post by Howard)
Yes, that's quite true actually. A couple of stray bombs apparently. (That's their story anyway)

But anyway - tough titties I say. The Germans didn't exactly have much respect for civilian life in WWII - they caused a war that resulted in 50 million deaths - so shouldn't whine about Dresdon being turned into a fireball.

mmm true it is a shame though apparently it was a very beautiful city before Bomber Harris turned it into a giant BBQ
The thing i do find amusing is the little tit for tat the two air forces had going on with the British flattening the city of Lubeck with the Germans in turn whipping out their Baedecker guide book to find some pretty cities to flatten :L

[Electric_Dynamo]

I think they are rightly honoured. The squadrons were following 'higher command' and their orders which were deemed essential to the war effort at the time. Don't forget they risked their live's just like any other service man/woman.

[Howard]

(Original post by cl_steele)
mmm true it is a shame though apparently it was a very beautiful city before Bomber Harris turned it into a giant BBQ
The thing i do find amusing is the little tit for tat the two air forces had going on with the British flattening the city of Lubeck with the Germans in turn whipping out their Baedecker guide book to find some pretty cities to flatten :L

Lots of very beautiful cities were flattened in WWII.

[jaadau121]

(Original post by Howard)
Lots of very beautiful cities were flattened in WWII.

I do not have a problem with it, before I get attacked for being ungrateful etc.

However to have legitmacy to such views, you must apply the same rules of engagment to Syria. Well the Syrian army is doing the same thing, they are focusing the attacks on the morale of ENEMY CIVIL POPULATION. The Syrian army is firstly making places physically uninhabitable and secondly making the enemy population conscious of constant personal danger.

The Syrian armies immediate aim is therefore, twofold, namely, to produce (i) destruction and (ii) The fear of death.

You cannot change the rules of engagement to suit your personal agenda, if such rules of engagement are good enough for the British then such rules of engagement are also fine for Syria.

Please do not be hypocritical and attempt to defame Syria, Syria is fighting a devious enemy and it has to employ the same tactics the British employed on Germany, afterall such tactics allowed the British to win and therefore Syria also wants to win.

[Howard]

(Original post by jaadau121)
I do not have a problem with it, before I get attacked for being ungrateful etc.

However to have legitmacy to such views, you must apply the same rules of engagment to Syria. Well the Syrian army is doing the same thing, they are focusing the attacks on the morale of ENEMY CIVIL POPULATION. The Syrian army is firstly making places physically uninhabitable and secondly making the enemy population conscious of constant personal danger.

The Syrian armies immediate aim is therefore, twofold, namely, to produce (i) destruction and (ii) The fear of death.

You cannot change the rules of engagement to suit your personal agenda, if such rules of engagement are good enough for the British then such rules of engagement are also fine for Syria.

Please do not be hypocritical and attempt to defame Syria, Syria is fighting a devious enemy and it has to employ the same tactics the British employed on Germany, afterall such tactics allowed the British to win and therefore Syria also wants to win.

I havn't mentioned Syria once so why the lecture? I couldn't care less what they get up to over there tbh.

[BACTSR2]

I have mixed feelings about this but ultimately I don't feel strongly about the symbolism.

[Drewski]

(Original post by jaadau121)
You cannot change the rules of engagement to suit your personal agenda, if such rules of engagement are good enough for the British then such rules of engagement are also fine for Syria.

Not to suit personal needs, but to reflect society. If WW2 happened now, then systematic area bombing would not occur. Weaponry is more advanced than that.

Just as we no longer have horse-mounted cavalry charges, some battelfield tactics are a product of their time and not to be repeated. Area bombing is one of them.

[jaadau121]

(Original post by Drewski)
Not to suit personal needs, but to reflect society. If WW2 happened now, then systematic area bombing would not occur. Weaponry is more advanced than that.

Just as we no longer have horse-mounted cavalry charges, some battelfield tactics are a product of their time and not to be repeated. Area bombing is one of them.

Give Syria such weapons and it will be able to precisely target terrorists who are causing havoc, the same terrorists which are backed by Turkey, Sunni dictators in the gulf, America and low and behold America's lapdog, mistress and puppet Britain. Sound familiar? yep, just like Al qaeda was western backed in its early days.

BTW if WW2 happened now, Germany would also have advanced weapons, so would Japan who also has reached the nuclear threshold, so unless carpet bombings occured the allies would not win.

[jaadau121]

OOOOh I have been negged, I am glad, it shows that people cannot deal with the brutal truth, will the cowards own up and explain, I have stated NOTHING but facts, shame you cannot accept these facts

[jaadau121]

(Original post by Howard)
I havn't mentioned Syria once so why the lecture? I couldn't care less what they get up to over there tbh.

Not personally to you but people who are being hypocrites by supporting the British bombing of Civilians yet attempt to take the moral high ground on Syria, they are hypocrites.

[Studentus-anonymous]

(Original post by Drewski)
That's quite a simplistic way of looking of at things.

A 'waste of resources' and 'little military goal' are quite subjective. I'm fairly confident that the higher ups knew that the 30,000+ troops the Germans used to protect Berlin and other cities would have been causing them pain and damage elsewhere on the front lines had they not been tied up defending their cities. Is it 'little military goal' to cause an inordinate amount of nuisance to your enemy?

I think the troops defending Berlin and other cities were more concerned with the Soviet frontal assaults.

Germany's finest were preoccupied with defeating the Soviet advance, seeing as it was the major front of the war, and arguably was the major reasoning for why the forces defending Germany were of incredibly inferior quality when the allies rolled through rather than the entire army sitting about waiting for British bombers to fly over lol.


Like I said there is no issue with remembering the lost crews, but the atmosphere and style of the memorial is just wrong, and TBH as the 'morally superior' country the memorial should include remembrance of the civilians bomber command killed.

There's a reason the bomber command wasn't lauded and worshipped after the war, what they did was hardly crucial and was all but a declaration of total war against the German people. Bombing cities was the least noble activity of either side in the war.

[Drewski]

(Original post by Studentus-anonymous)
Like I said there is no issue with remembering the lost crews, but the atmosphere and style of the memorial is just wrong, and TBH as the 'morally superior' country the memorial should include remembrance of the civilians bomber command killed.

It does.
"The £7 million Portland stone memorial also has been given the blessing of the German people, after an inscription was included that commemorates all the lives lost in the bombings of 1939-45.

[thunder_chunky]

(Original post by Howard)
Nothing controversial about this.

It was the Germans who originally altered their tactics and began bombing civilian populations in the UK.

Weren't they the first in WW1 to run bombings with their zepplins?

[Drewski]

(Original post by thunder_chunky)
Weren't they the first in WW1 to run bombings with their zepplins?

Yes, but in those cases civilians weren't deliberately targeted.

[standreams]

(Original post by Studentus-anonymous)
I think the troops defending Berlin and other cities were more concerned with the Soviet frontal assaults.

Germany's finest were preoccupied with defeating the Soviet advance, seeing as it was the major front of the war, and arguably was the major reasoning for why the forces defending Germany were of incredibly inferior quality when the allies rolled through rather than the entire army sitting about waiting for British bombers to fly over lol.


Like I said there is no issue with remembering the lost crews, but the atmosphere and style of the memorial is just wrong, and TBH as the 'morally superior' country the memorial should include remembrance of the civilians bomber command killed.

There's a reason the bomber command wasn't lauded and worshipped after the war, what they did was hardly crucial and was all but a declaration of total war against the German people. Bombing cities was the least noble activity of either side in the war.

Really? I personally find the invasion of Poland and subsequent death of millions of people in an orchestrated campaign of mass murder somewhat more lacking in nobility.

[Howard]

(Original post by thunder_chunky)
Weren't they the first in WW1 to run bombings with their zepplins?

I think you're right; they tried to bomb London using zeppelins I believe.

[Steevee]

(Original post by jaadau121)
Give Syria such weapons and it will be able to precisely target terrorists who are causing havoc, the same terrorists which are backed by Turkey, Sunni dictators in the gulf, America and low and behold America's lapdog, mistress and puppet Britain. Sound familiar? yep, just like Al qaeda was western backed in its early days.

BTW if WW2 happened now, Germany would also have advanced weapons, so would Japan who also has reached the nuclear threshold, so unless carpet bombings occured the allies would not win.

If you cannot see how times and warfare have changed, and equally just how incomparable the situations are, then you sir, are an idiot.

[thunder_chunky]

(Original post by Drewski)
Yes, but in those cases civilians weren't deliberately targeted.

And yet when we tried to target them they had a strong last line of defence:

[ForensicShoe]

Anyone else watch the programme on Bomber Command that was broadcast on ITV tonight? Very interesting and very touching.

[Kolya]

(Original post by Electric_Dynamo)
I think they are rightly honoured. The squadrons were following 'higher command' and their orders which were deemed essential to the war effort at the time. Don't forget they risked their live's just like any other service man/woman.

Wheeling out the old Nuremburg defence? Nice.