[ArthurWinterthurII]

We still have this nonsense circulating in mainstream culture. Personally, I myself, like a few others, come from a culture and background that differs sharply with where a large majority of 'black' people in the West come from - hence why such statements that 'blacks have a lower IQ than whites' seems silly and like child's play to me etc. But, clearly some believe it to be genetically and inherently true and whatnot.

So, in an effort to see where this eagerness to make it true stems from, a few simply questions and premises are thrown out:

So, let us assume that not only do 'blacks have a lower IQ than whites', but that it is seemingly genetic and inherent.

Now, having established this, what do we do now? Do we take the black children out of schools? Not bother interviewing the blacks for top jobs? Give the blacks preferential treatment in our criminal courts? Or rather, round them up? Build concentration camps maybe? Or send every last black out of the West?

Clearly, what I'm trying to ask (through asking such offensive and direct questions) is that - what do such theories and studies about the link between race and intelligence seek to prove? Does it rather seek to further sever racial relations; further undermine any academic achievement of the young 'black' people? Encourage an inferiority complex in 'blacks'?

What do you think?

(ALERT, ALERT: Clearly, many of you replying have low IQs (lol, a pun, calm down). This post is laden with sarcasm. I personally do not believe any of the examples mentioned in the post. I even take the statement 'Blacks have a lower IQ than whites' with a pinch of salt much like I would take the statement 'First-year university students go out more than the general population' with a pinch of salt.)

[vedderfan94]

It's been scientifically proven. Blacks DO have a lower average IQ. Some people seem to think this is racism, but it's just fact.

[ArthurWinterthurII]

(Original post by vedderfan94)
It's been scientifically proven. Blacks DO have a lower average IQ. Some people seem to think this is racism, but it's just fact.

Yes... so the question is "Where do we go from here - somebody tell me please" (much like a lyrics to a song - I forget who it was by)?

Well?

(P.S. Scientifically proven? You mean statistical studies? Have there actually been MRIs, actual dissecting of brains, extensive studying and research like such?)

[Fuzzpig]

(Original post by vedderfan94)
It's been scientifically proven. Blacks DO have a lower average IQ. Some people seem to think this is racism, but it's just fact.

It's also been proven that all tests that have "scientifically proven" this, are geared towards the white middle class male and his style of learning.

[Aspiringlawstudent]

Ever read The Bell Curve?


You shouldn't discriminate against individual people because a group they belong to has a typically below average IQ.

However, the group IQ is useful to know to plan policy.

Instead of violent oppression, enforced transportation etc, my policy prescription is simple: encourage the right people to have children (those with average and above average IQ, regardless of race, nationality, etc) and discourage those that are arguably the wrong people, those with low or below average IQ.

I can think of no policy a government can be involved in that would not be correctly termed an aggressive manipulation of fertility. The problem is, the government already has policies that manipulate fertility, and it is encouraging the wrong people to have children.

Now, my personal belief is that there should be no government, or an extremely limited one whose sole function is national defence. There should certainly not be a welfare state. My belief is that over time, those with greater skills and abilities will flourish in the free market, and those who have lesser abilities will not. Eventually, this will lead to a world populated in the main with those with above average and average IQ, by today's standards.

Obviously, there are objections to this - a lot of people don't like the idea of allowing people to simply die out if they are unwilling or unable to compete in a free market. It's certainly okay to think this in a free society. But I do not agree. I believe that artificially supporting those that are not able to support themselves detracts from higher living standards for all that could be achieved in only a few generations, where everyone has a good chance of being productive, and a lower chance of the type of suffering and serfdom that a welfare state inevitably, in my opinion, produces.

[james22]

I don't think that there is any doubt that black people score lower on IQ tests, but all this means is that they are worse at IQ tests which could be due to all sorts of reasons unrelated to intelligence, esspecially culture differences.

[Aspiringlawstudent]

(Original post by perfectsymbology)
We're talking averages. All it means is that more Einsteins will be produced in one race than another, and at the end of the day, very very few of us can be Einstein.

With respect, that is not at all what it means that one group has a higher average than another.

[Aspiringlawstudent]

(Original post by aliluvschoc)
It's also been proven that all tests that have "scientifically proven" this, are geared towards the white middle class male and his style of learning.

Really?

ALL IQ tests?

Please show me some studies that prove this.

[Maker]

(Original post by ArthurWinterthurII)
We still have this nonsense circulating in mainstream culture. Personally, I myself, like a few others, come from a culture and background that differs sharply with where a large majority of 'black' people in the West come from - hence why such statements that 'blacks have a lower IQ than whites' seems silly and like child's play to me etc. But, clearly some believe it to be genetically and inherently true and whatnot.

So, in an effort to see where this eagerness to make it true stems from, a few simply questions and premises are thrown out:

So, let us assume that not only do 'blacks have a lower IQ than whites', but that it is seemingly genetic and inherent.

Now, having established this, what do we do now? Do we take the black children out of schools? Not bother interviewing the blacks for top jobs? Give the blacks preferential treatment in our criminal courts? Or rather, round them up? Build concentration camps maybe? Or send every last black out of the West?

Clearly, what I'm trying to ask (through asking such offensive and direct questions) is that - what do such theories and studies about the link between race and intelligence seek to prove? Does it rather seek to further sever racial relations; further undermine any academic achievement of the young 'black' people? Encourage an inferiority complex in 'blacks'?

What do you think?

I think you are talking utter BS.

Why would you want to stop educating black people because they on the whole have a lower IQ than whites. By the same reasoning, why educate white people when it has been shown that orientals have a higher IQ than whites.

The not interviewing for top jobs is plain stupid. When one advertises for any job, you put in the qualifications and experience the candidates need to have. If the candidates have these you then short list them for interview. You don't interview random people off the street which is what you are implying.

Its ironic that you are posting a question about intelligence and anyone reading your post would conclude yours must be quite low.

[Hype en Ecosse]

(Original post by ArthurWinterthurII)
Yes... so the question is "Where do we go from here - somebody tell me please" (much like a lyrics to a song - I forget who it was by)?

Well?

(P.S. Scientifically proven? You mean statistical studies? Have there actually been MRIs, actual dissecting of brains, extensive studying and research like such?)

Because you can tell so much about a person's IQ from MRIs and brain dissections?

[Holz888]

I watched an interesting documentary which investigated this claim. It made the argument, that (particularly US IQ tests) are made for US citizens, and those not from the US will naturally score lower, no matter how capable they are of learning as much. But even if it is the case, why does it matter? As long as every race is given equal opportunities, they will excel. I understand that it is taboo because of what black people as a race have been through, but we just need to understand that people are different, but it doesn't make them inferior

[Aspiringlawstudent]

(Original post by Maker)
I think you are talking utter BS.

Why would you want to stop educating black people because they on the whole have a lower IQ than whites. By the same reasoning, why educate white people when it has been shown that orientals have a higher IQ than whites.

The not interviewing for top jobs is plain stupid. When one advertises for any job, you put in the qualifications and experience the candidates need to have. If the candidates have these you then short list them for interview. You don't interview random people off the street which is what you are implying.

Its ironic that you are posting a question about intelligence and anyone reading your post would conclude yours must be quite low.

I don't think you have really understood the OP.

He isn't suggesting doing any of those things.

He is asking what people that believe the statement 'blacks have an IQ lower than whites' is true would want to do.

[DudeRugs]

Even if black people do have a lower IQ than white people, there's a thing called variance. There will be some very smart and some very dumb people of all races.
Why should we do anything?

Plus there's a lot more to intelligence than an IQ test.

[Kindred.Spirit]

As soon as I read OP's post - this came to mind:

http://thewillnigeria.com/world/3823...e-Britain.html

[Aspiringlawstudent]

(Original post by james22)
I don't think that there is any doubt that black people score lower on IQ tests, but all this means is that they are worse at IQ tests which could be due to all sorts of reasons unrelated to intelligence, esspecially culture differences.

What about the Cattell Culture Fair Test? It's specifically designed to remove cultural bias.

[Maths_Lover]

(Original post by vedderfan94)
It's been scientifically proven. Blacks DO have a lower average IQ. Some people seem to think this is racism, but it's just fact.

Oh really now... by using IQ tests developed in the West which are based on the Western education system and culture? Do you see the flaw in this system?

[ArthurWinterthurII]

(Original post by Hype en Ecosse)
Because you can tell so much about a person's IQ from MRIs and brain dissections?

No, but it would certainly help to determine who is 'superior', much like it was shown that Einstein had more glial cells in certain parts of the brain and that had greater hemispheric communication (which would typically contribute to higher 'intelligence').

[Gibbers]

>Implying that someones 'IQ' is a good indicator of their intelligence.

No one gives two ****s about these experiments and their results, except people who want to use it as some sort of fuel and ammunition while spouting racial hatred. Rather, the people who do the experiments just want to find out more about their specific field and scientific interest. That's the only reason why people research these kind of things, to build upon their own foundation of knowledge and break through the current frontiers of science. Thinking that those conducting the experiments are seeking to prove something is completely off-the-mark, they are simply approaching something that is scientifically relevant... race, genes and intelligence.

Still though, as I said, this is all assuming that someones IQ is a reliable, accurate and precise indicator of intelligence. (It's not.)

[RobertWhite]

(Original post by Aspiringlawstudent)
Ever read The Bell Curve?


You shouldn't discriminate against individual people because a group they belong to has a typically below average IQ.

However, the group IQ is useful to know to plan policy.

Instead of violent oppression, enforced transportation etc, my policy prescription is simple: encourage the right people to have children (those with average and above average IQ, regardless of race, nationality, etc) and discourage those that are arguably the wrong people, those with low or below average IQ.

I can think of no policy a government can be involved in that would not be correctly termed an aggressive manipulation of fertility. The problem is, the government already has policies that manipulate fertility, and it is encouraging the wrong people to have children.

Now, my personal belief is that there should be no government, or an extremely limited one whose sole function is national defence. There should certainly not be a welfare state. My belief is that over time, those with greater skills and abilities will flourish in the free market, and those who have lesser abilities will not. Eventually, this will lead to a world populated in the main with those with above average and average IQ, by today's standards.

Obviously, there are objections to this - a lot of people don't like the idea of allowing people to simply die out if they are unwilling or unable to compete in a free market. It's certainly okay to think this in a free society. But I do not agree. I believe that artificially supporting those that are not able to support themselves detracts from higher living standards for all that could be achieved in only a few generations, where everyone has a good chance of being productive, and a lower chance of the type of suffering and serfdom that a welfare state inevitably, in my opinion, produces.

So basically, let evolution take its course?

Not sure how much I agree with that. I assume most families would support their weaker members anyway. I certainly wouldn't be alive right now if the weak were allowed to die. I would have died at birth without the specialist care I received.

[Aspiringlawstudent]

(Original post by Maths_Lover)
Oh really now... by using IQ tests developed in the West which are based on the Western education system and culture? Do you see the flaw in this system?

Have you ever taken an IQ test, I wonder?

Are you aware there are a great many IQ tests, a number of which are specifically designed to eliminate cultural bias?