[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by ljsilver)
Thats the one, I totally agree.

I just love the politics of it.

Guy attempts self harm and responability is immediatley infered upon the government. Almost as if this man is not a free individual responsible for his own actions.

It's almost as if some people believe that governements cause mental health problems.

If this mans mental instability is an example of what happen when you get a Torie/coalition government, what is the affect on the minds of men under a Labour Governement?

Objective conjectures only please. We can't be biased.


Ha.

Objective conjectures please?

Okay to clarify, if a boat is in the sea and it crashes because of the rough waves, you're saying it isn't acceptable to blame the waves?

Government policies are tightening benefits and screwing over the lower classes, pushing people over the edge is hardly a surprise.

Not that I'm saying I blame the Tories for this man trying to kill himself, but you believing it's entirely his fault and the Tories have no responsibility, you sir are blinkered

[gateshipone]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
Objective conjectures please?

Okay to clarify, if a boat is in the sea and it crashes because of the rough waves, you're saying it isn't acceptable to blame the waves?

Government policies are tightening benefits and screwing over the lower classes, pushing people over the edge is hardly a surprise.

Not that I'm saying I blame the Tories for this man trying to kill himself, but you believing it's entirely his fault and the Tories have no responsibility, you sir are blinkered

You do realise nearly all of the current regulations related to JSA are from pre-2010 right?

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by gateshipone)
You do realise nearly all of the current regulations related to JSA are from pre-2010 right?

Probably are - but the reforms are going to exacerbate the problem I suspect - not improve it

[gateshipone]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
Probably are - but the reforms are going to exacerbate the problem I suspect - not improve it

So basically, even though most issues people have with JSA are due to policies and regulations from before the Tories were elected, it's still partially their fault?

As for the reforms that are being discussed by the current government, they're nothing that the previous government wasn't thinking about and a lot of them have their roots pre-2010.

Why is it so hard to just say this guy was probably mentally ill? If the regulations governing JSA were so bad, why aren't the majority of the 2.6 million unemployed setting themselves on fire as well? Sometimes people are just ill, it's not always someone else's fault!

[ClaraJayne]

(Original post by rock_climber86)
yes it sucks but i'm sure it was a case of diminished responsibility. One could argue he wasn't "being himself" when he reached that state of mind. He has my unconditional sympathy and I hope he finds a job or something meaningful to do with his life soon

totally agree

[ClaraJayne]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
Objective conjectures please?

Okay to clarify, if a boat is in the sea and it crashes because of the rough waves, you're saying it isn't acceptable to blame the waves?

Government policies are tightening benefits and screwing over the lower classes, pushing people over the edge is hardly a surprise.

Not that I'm saying I blame the Tories for this man trying to kill himself, but you believing it's entirely his fault and the Tories have no responsibility, you sir are blinkered

Probably has no experiance in it themself that's why they act so ignorant to it..

[ClaraJayne]

(Original post by Pitt1988)
Reminds of the story of the elderly Greek man who shot himself outside of government buildings because of the **** state the country was in and not much in the way of prospects etc.

I think the people in this thread that immediately say 'mental health issues' are wrong really. Hopelessness, no faith in government, no prospects, no opportunities combined with being constantly castigated, shunned and ridiculed for being one of the 2.6 million unemployed isn't exactly a nice place to be. It's desperation more than anything. An air of Tibetan Buddhist about it, a way of drawing attention to the situation that there really aren't jobs for everyone, contrary to what the Tories may seem to think.

Iv'e been there it's incredibly difficult being on benefits, but i was actually better off than i am now as a full time student, Because i can't find work :/ i have no income and i'm living off savings. :/ it souldn't be this hard to make something out of my life. If i wasn't given inheritance money i couldn't even go to college.
Iv'e been tryig to get a job for over a year now and applying for various jobs 2 days a week.
I can totally see why this man did what he did. My dad is like it and he's been on benefits for years and years he's a wreck of emotion and lack of self worth. He used to actually tell me nearly everyday how he wanted to kill himself and end his life.
It messed with my head completely That was my dad once he used to be so loving and caring and nice. And it's totally distroyed him.

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by gateshipone)
So basically, even though most issues people have with JSA are due to policies and regulations from before the Tories were elected, it's still partially their fault?

As for the reforms that are being discussed by the current government, they're nothing that the previous government wasn't thinking about and a lot of them have their roots pre-2010.

Why is it so hard to just say this guy was probably mentally ill? If the regulations governing JSA were so bad, why aren't the majority of the 2.6 million unemployed setting themselves on fire as well? Sometimes people are just ill, it's not always someone else's fault!

That's grand! I'm not saying it's the governments fault necessarily, quite right, he might just be mentally ill.

[gateshipone]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
That's grand! I'm not saying it's the governments fault necessarily, quite right, he might just be mentally ill.

I wasn't having a go, in case I came across that way. I simply think assigning blame to someone other than the guy himself makes very little sense. Just seems the default for a lot of people is "it's those bloody Tories fault". Not saying that's your position, just seems like a recurring theme in this thread!

[Profesh]

(Original post by I Gurn Hard)
Stop being so pretentious. It won't help you become well liked in future.

Your demonstrable lack of compassion and basic intellectual humility admits a not-dissimilar prognosis. But so be it.

[ufo2012]

(Original post by gateshipone)
Why is it so hard to just say this guy was probably mentally ill? If the regulations governing JSA were so bad, why aren't the majority of the 2.6 million unemployed setting themselves on fire as well? Sometimes people are just ill, it's not always someone else's fault!

I am guessing there are probably many who have thought of doing so, but then realised it would serve no purpose to do so to themselves...

...so then they probably thought it would be better to set the Job Centre on fire, but by doing so would mean they would not be able to get their Giro...

...so maybe it would just be better setting the House of Commons on fire, but then they would end up on the bonfire like Guy Fawkes....



vicious circle innit!

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by gateshipone)
I wasn't having a go, in case I came across that way. I simply think assigning blame to someone other than the guy himself makes very little sense. Just seems the default for a lot of people is "it's those bloody Tories fault". Not saying that's your position, just seems like a recurring theme in this thread!

True point there, likely he has some sort of mental illness, but then again, you can ask what kind of government measures can/could have helped.

And most threads have a recurring theme left or right, so I'm sure this is no different.

[cid]

'Horrified eyewitnesses saw the man douse himself in flammable liquid after tying himself to railings at the Jobcentre Plus in Harborne Lane, Selly Oak, at around 9.20am.

Cops rushed-'


hang on ...cops? COPS?!!

get it together Nick.

[Llamageddon]

The jobless need to take a leaf out of Iain Duncan Smith's book and just lie about their academic achievements.

[I Gurn Hard]

(Original post by Profesh)
Your demonstrable lack of compassion and basic intellectual humility admits a not-dissimilar prognosis. But so be it.

I apologise. Your view just made me angry. I tend to resort to insults before reasoned arguments, call it a character flaw if you wish.

[ljsilver]

(Original post by That Bearded Man)
True point there, likely he has some sort of mental illness, but then again, you can ask what kind of government measures can/could have helped.

And most threads have a recurring theme left or right, so I'm sure this is no different.

Thesis - The Con-Dems have poured petrole on a bloke and set him onfire!

Antithesis - They're using Labours guidlines at the Jobcentre, Labour lit the match!

Synthesis - The man is mentally ill. Mental illness is, an illness. It's no ones fault. Lets hold hands and hug each other (and come up with some novel ways to use the 'Mental Health' issue to make some lucra.)

(I added that last part for affect)

Great compromise.

[That Bearded Man]

(Original post by ljsilver)
Thesis - The Con-Dems have poured petrole on a bloke and set him onfire!

Antithesis - They're using Labours guidlines at the Jobcentre, Labour lit the match!

Synthesis - The man is mentally ill. Mental illness is, an illness. It's no ones fault. Lets hold hands and hug each other (and come up with some novel ways to use the 'Mental Health' issue to make some lucra.)

(I added that last part for affect)

Great compromise.

A great compromise if the world was harmonious, although those forums tend to be less interesting.

[Snagprophet]

I am disappointed that there was no video of it.

[Studentus-anonymous]

Unemployment in the UK is more than joblessness, it is considered a scathing value judgement on the individual.
If you're unemployed in the UK you're assumed to be no better than the estate rats who live off of society like leeches.

I had periods on unemployment, I tried signing on twice (I didn't want to) and tbh I didn't even bother staying signed on long enough to claim. No amount of money was worth the way Job Centre staff look down upon you or the way society treats you. I was fortunate to have family support at the time.

I only feel for the people who had no choice but to go on JSA.


The continued **** economy that the Tories are magnificently failing to repair despite all their 'hard love' policies isn't helping matters either.

The guy setting himself alight isn't surprising, the only surprise is it isn't happening more often.

[ClaraJayne]

Be a bit more caring some of you. Have a heart.


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