[green.tea]

(Original post by sugar-n-spice)
Brah..if we can't observe that a thing is a living breathing organism how our actions possible affect it?

Once upon a time we couldnt observe bacteria but our actions affected them. What reason is there to think there isnt leaps as big as the invention of a microscope still to make? We have no idea how our actions might affect something we know nothing about.

Most scientists are in agreement that any life we are likely to encounter will be carbon based.

Most likely based on what they know. Id be interested to know what they think the odds of that being correct are. By my reckoning it is most likely based on what we know but unlikely that what we know is sufficient to make such a statement anything more than an educated guess.

[Fallen]

(Original post by MangoFreak)
Although there could be life that we don't actually recognise as life, I suppose that if we had the technology to terraform a planet then we'd probably be capable of recognising MOST forms of somewhat evolved life. But you never know...what if the rocks on Mars are actually sentient?

They'd probably be sitting down there thinking "How ever did those dastardly humans see through our disguise?!"

[idontthinkso]

Why not? Someone else might need them?

[Nick100]

(Original post by green.tea)
Personally when aliens as more advanced than us as we are from microbial life arrive id like to have some moral high ground.

It is not immoral to destroy microbes; it is immoral to destroy sentients. We would not have the moral high ground; we would have hindered our own progress out of some misguided sense of sentimentality for microbes. If such an advanced species exists then we must expand anyway so that we can survive our contact with them.

[Kiss]

(Original post by Nick100)
I don't even think the presence of microbial life particularly matters; it is unlikely to evolve into anything sentient by the time the sun expands. Some specimens could be reserved for scientific interests, but their existence shouldn't stop us from altering planets to our benefit.

Aliens could be planning to build an intergalatic superhighway (or some other hypothetical project) and it just so happens that Earth stands in the way of that plan. If they viewed us as megre and if they had technology to do so they could easily destroy us - would you want that to happen? Life anywhere in the universe is astounding.

[Nick100]

(Original post by Kiss)
Aliens could be planning to build an intergalatic superhighway (or some other hypothetical project) and it just so happens that Earth stands in the way of that plan. If they viewed us as megre and if they had technology to do so they could easily destroy us - would you want that to happen? Life anywhere in the universe is astounding.

And would our preserving of some microbes change their opinion? No. Would it give us the moral high ground? No, because microbes are incapable of thought. We destroy them all the time on Earth; their destruction does not become immoral if we change the setting.

[Kiss]

(Original post by Nick100)
And would our preserving of some microbes change their opinion? No. Would it give us the moral high ground? No, because microbes are incapable of thought. We destroy them all the time on Earth; their destruction does not become immoral if we change the setting.

You missed the point I was making: how can we justify destroying something we view as inferior when we may be equally seen as inferior in the perspective of some other, more advanced lifeforms? We evolved from microbes anyway, with time anything is possible. If some other lifeform hasn't been given its due yet then why rob them of the chance to evolve into their own forms?

[The_Mighty_Bush]

Why on earth would it be? There are billions upon billions of planets in the universe, one being changed so that humans can live there won't make any difference except to benefit humanity.

[Nick100]

(Original post by Kiss)
You missed the point I was making: how can we justify destroying something we view as inferior when we may be equally seen as inferior in the perspective of some other, more advanced lifeforms? We evolved from microbes anyway, with time anything is possible. If some other lifeform hasn't been given its due yet then why rob them of the chance to evolve into their own forms?

It isn't just that it's inferior; it's that it has no mind at all. If there was something analogous to Reptile or Mammal life then there might be an argument to be made.

[Arekkusu]

This question seems to indicate that some environmental types are really just self-flagellators. Exactly who would we be accountable to terraforming and plundering a barren planet?

(Unless the money spent on the project wasn't worth the outlay, socially.)

[green.tea]

(Original post by Nick100)
It isn't just that it's inferior; it's that it has no mind at all. If there was something analogous to Reptile or Mammal life then there might be an argument to be made.

Oh yeah great find life on another planet assume it conforms to the rules of earth life and destroy it.

What makes you think that mind as you understand it is the be all and end all of life in the universe?

Perhaps aliens have something other than mind than you dont have at all.

What an arrogant species we are.

[green.tea]

(Original post by Nick100)
It is not immoral to destroy microbes; it is immoral to destroy sentients. We would not have the moral high ground; we would have hindered our own progress out of some misguided sense of sentimentality for microbes. If such an advanced species exists then we must expand anyway so that we can survive our contact with them.

Sentients? Why should the value life forms across the universe be judged by their degree of similarity to humans?

Rather than sentience perhaps we could judge humanness by the degree to which they think they know it all.

[Nick100]

(Original post by green.tea)
Sentients? Why should the value life forms across the universe be judged by their degree of similarity to humans?

Rather than sentience perhaps we could judge humanness by the degree to which they think they know it all.

You're confusing sentience with sapience; a sentient entity is not necessarily similar to humans. I didn't say that life had to be similar to humans to be preserved; it only has to be sentient, or have a chance of being sentient.

I don't think I know it all, although I understand that you find it easier to argue if you imply that I do. I think that we can destroy microbes with impunity because there is zero probability that they are capable of thought. If we found something analagous to animal life then there would be an argument to preserve that because it could be intelligent in some way that would do not understand.

[lyrical_lie]

(Original post by Kiss)
Aliens could be planning to build an intergalatic superhighway (or some other hypothetical project) and it just so happens that Earth stands in the way of that plan. If they viewed us as megre and if they had technology to do so they could easily destroy us - would you want that to happen? Life anywhere in the universe is astounding.

I love that book

[green.tea]

(Original post by Nick100)
You're confusing sentience with sapience; a sentient entity is not necessarily similar to humans. I didn't say that life had to be similar to humans to be preserved; it only has to be sentient, or have a chance of being sentient.

I don't think I know it all, although I understand that you find it easier to argue if you imply that I do. I think that we can destroy microbes with impunity because there is zero probability that they are capable of thought. If we found something analagous to animal life then there would be an argument to preserve that because it could be intelligent in some way that would do not understand.

The problem here is that your limited human mind struggles to imagine life existing in a manner in every way different from that which you have knowledge of. You think consciousness is the defining trait of a higher life form because your very very limited experience tells you so. I dont think you fully understand how small and limited we are and that us struggling to imagine something wholly different doesnt mean it cant exist. How would a planet of porous rock filled with microbes that can in some way communicate with each other as our brain cells do see us? How would we see them?

[Kiss]

(Original post by lyrical_lie)
I love that book

Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy??? I didn't actually realise I'd used a big part of the plot until you mentioned it now