[SnoochToTheBooch]

(Original post by sammynorton90)
It seems to me like a lot of liberals just want the 'social liberalism' that comes with being a liberal. They think that being a liberal means you believe people should pretty much be able to do whatever they want, without taking the possible consequences into consideration. That's not liberalism, that's anarchy or libertarianism.

I'm all for social freedoms, I support same-sex marriage and adoption etc, but a lot of modern day 'liberals' take their belief in social freedom too far. They want to be able do whatever they want, even if it's obvious it will have a negative affect, on them and society.

You get people who believe they should be able to take as many drugs as they like and call the government 'fascists' for making them illegal. They don't take into consideration the affect it has on society as a whole. It's not just done to annoy them and take away their 'freedoms' it's because you end up with whole cities in Mexico run by drugs lords, and whole neighborhoods in the UK and US controlled by drug dealers. You get people becoming vulnerable and hopeless because of their dependency on those drugs.

It's the same issue with sex. I don't care what sexual orientation someone is, as long as they're not hurting children or animals. But again some so called 'liberals' want too much 'freedom'. Yes sex is a natural and private thing, but it's also something that without the right protection and education on the subject can be risky. The amount of STI's and teenage preganancies is extremely high, and not only that but sleeping around often has a negative emotional and mental affect on people, such as lowering self-esteem and self-worth. It just seems to me sometimes like these so called liberals aren't actually liberal at all, but rather just want the freedom to do whatever they like and be selfish, without taking any personal responsibility for it.

you don't end up with drug lords when "drugs" are legal. also "drugs" is far too vague a term, certain "drugs" should absolutely be legal.

[bkeevin]

(Original post by sammynorton90)
That's what I'm saying. These fake liberals think doing this stuff automatically makes them a liberal, without actually knowing anything about liberal policies.

So can you define who are true liberals? What are those liberal policies they need to know about?

[sammynorton90]

(Original post by bkeevin)
So can you define who are true liberals? What are those liberal policies they need to know about?

Liberals believe that the government should take action to achieve equal opportunities and to eradicate social ills and protect are civil liberties and human rights, and also to ensure that no one is in need. The belief in individual liberty does not make you a liberal. In fact many conservatives also believe in this, they just want it in every aspect of their life. They don't want the government taxing to pay for hospitals, schools etc, they would like people to be responsible for this themselves. The only duty they ask of the government is to protect them with a strong military and police force.

[bkeevin]

(Original post by sammynorton90)
Liberals believe that the government should take action to achieve equal opportunities and to eradicate social ills and protect are civil liberties and human rights, and also to ensure that no one is in need. The belief in individual liberty does not make you a liberal. In fact many conservatives also believe in this, they just want it in every aspect of their life. They don't want the government taxing to pay for hospitals, schools etc, they would like people to be responsible for this themselves. The only duty they ask of the government is to protect them with a strong military and police force.

Wow what an ideal world would that be! The government is able to achieve equal opportunities, social justice etc with little taxation and duties for the government itself. Do you have any real life examples where that has been achieved?

[sammynorton90]

(Original post by bkeevin)
Wow what an ideal world would that be! The government is able to achieve equal opportunities, social justice etc with little taxation and duties for the government itself. Do you have any real life examples where that has been achieved?

Well nowhere has achieved it completely, as there will always be people who oppose these ideals. But a few of the Scandinavian countries have very liberal/ socialist governments. It's not about whether it's been achieved anyway, it's about the fact that these so called 'liberals' don't actually believe in all the liberal ideals, they just believe in the personal liberty aspect, but don't really care about the other aspects.

[bkeevin]

(Original post by sammynorton90)
Well nowhere has achieved it completely, as there will always be people who oppose these ideals. But a few of the Scandinavian countries have very liberal/ socialist governments. It's not about whether it's been achieved anyway, it's about the fact that these so called 'liberals' don't actually believe in all the liberal ideals, they just believe in the personal liberty aspect, but don't really care about the other aspects.

Exactly. Just the same as there are many so called democrats, socialists,libertarians, capitalists, conservatives etc who don't believe in everything their respective philosophy espouses probably for pragmatic reasons. Why would it be different for liberals? You should know that even those philosophies themselves keep changing let alone the views of the different adherents of the philosophies!

[ufo2012]

(Original post by sammynorton90)
a lot of modern day 'liberals' take their belief in social freedom too far. They want to be able do whatever they want, even if it's obvious it will have a negative affect, on them and society.

Definitely agree.

Maybe they should be locked up for a while then on release they would know what liberty really is!

[DaveSmith99]

(Original post by sammynorton90)
You get people who believe they should be able to take as many drugs as they like and call the government 'fascists' for making them illegal. They don't take into consideration the affect it has on society as a whole. It's not just done to annoy them and take away their 'freedoms' it's because you end up with whole cities in Mexico run by drugs lords, and whole neighborhoods in the UK and US controlled by drug dealers. You get people becoming vulnerable and hopeless because of their dependency on those drugs.

That's one of the best arguments for the legalisation of drugs there is. Legalisation means no drug dealers and criminal gangs.

[Kiss]

(Original post by ufo2012)
Definitely agree.

Maybe they should be locked up for a while then on release they would know what liberty really is!

Gratification for one´s aspect of life doesn´t constitute understanding to another´s.