[TOSCS]

(Original post by L i b)
Yes, because we're entirely suspicious of your motivations.

Seems and odd way to express suspicions doesn't it? It implies you disagree with someone criticising sectarianism and racism, or that you disagree with someone criticising the Orange Order intentionally parading in front of a Catholic church and then attacking someone for videoing it.

(Original post by L i b)
Because it is a major focus of sectarianism, bigotry and the divide in Scotland - not to mention Northern Ireland too.

It doesn't deserve a mention, certainly not now that one of the clubs are the forefront of it is now defunct.

[L i b]

(Original post by TOSCS)
Seems and odd way to express suspicions doesn't it? It implies you disagree with someone criticising sectarianism and racism, or that you disagree with someone criticising the Orange Order intentionally parading in front of a Catholic church and then attacking someone for videoing it.

A bit of a strange suggestion considering I've already condemned that as "contemptible behaviour".

It doesn't deserve a mention, certainly not now that one of the clubs are the forefront of it is now defunct.

Suggesting that sectarianism in Scotland particularly, and to a lesser but still significant extent in Northern Ireland, is not linked with football is frankly bizarre. Glasgow has two football clubs divided almost entirely down religious/community/political lines. In the west of Scotland, the Old Firm is probably the most public and visible symbol of that divide. Yes, it is perhaps peculiar that one's religion should (generally speaking) dictate one's politics, and that these things should (again, generally speaking) dictate one's footballing allegiances but that's the way our bizarre and entirely ****ed-up society works.

[TOSCS]

If I want to talk about Celtic, Rangers or Accrington Stanley I will make a thread on the Football board.

[Steevee]

(Original post by 0404343m)
Having grown up in the west of Scotland, this sort of argument is cyclical, unwinnable and inescapable. Both sides angrily drag out scraps of evidence about a minority of people somewhere doing something as 'proof' that their whole religion/group/fanbase are animals/hateful/[insert adjective here]. It takes a remarkable stretch and some serious tint to the specs to then argue that when the same stuff has been perpetrated by their own side, it was either an isolated incident or under provocation. This sort of 'they started it/are worse' crap has been going back and forth for far too long, with kids that have read one book in their lives and been told stories by their uncles suddenly 'knowing' the truth. There's an otherwise intelligent guy in my office that can't take the blinkers off, there's someone else that refused to read what I suggested he read because 'why bother when I know it already?'. It's embarrassing for the whole country.

Some Rangers fans/protestants/republicans are morons. Some Celtic fans/catholics/nationalists are every bit as bad. Any time you try to voice an opinion that isn't the one held by the side the person you're talking is from, though, it's because you are, deep down, one of 'them'. It just makes whichever idiot is pointing the finger or claiming the moral high ground after someone from the other side embarrasses themselves look like a moron. The orange order isn't my favourite organisation in the world, but the crass generalisations help nobody. This thread, after barely a dozen replies, is already a lost cause.

/thread

[Foghorn Leghorn]

This bloody walk creates more trouble than it's worth.

[TOSCS]

(Original post by Steevee)
/thread

While I agree with his post, it has nothing to do with this thread so cannot really be a conclusive opinion on the subject.

It would have had relevance if, every year, the State funded Republican marches through Loyalist areas, where they stopped outside Protestant churches to play racist songs about the British people, and then attacked anybody who had the audacity to be walking along the road where they live.

As far as I'm aware, these do not exist although if I'm wrong I'd welcome being enlightened.

[Steevee]

(Original post by TOSCS)
While I agree with his post, it has nothing to do with this thread so cannot really be a conclusive opinion on the subject.

It would have had relevance if, every year, the State funded Republican marches through Loyalist areas, where they stopped outside Protestant churches to play racist songs about the British people, and then attacked anybody who had the audacity to be walking along the road where they live.

As far as I'm aware, these do not exist although if I'm wrong I'd welcome being enlightened.

You're right. The Republicans go rather farther than marches. We instead see them try and mar Royal visits, attack and kill British Police and Servicemen, plant bombs and so forth...

[Snagprophet]

Not sure if Orange Order or Trollface Order.

[TOSCS]

(Original post by Steevee)
You're right. The Republicans go rather farther than marches. We instead see them try and mar Royal visits, attack and kill British Police and Servicemen, plant bombs and so forth...

Loyalists also attack and kill British policemen and plant bombs. Your post just betrays an embarrassing lack of knowledge on the subject. Stick to simpler matters my man.

[Left Hand Drive]

(Original post by Steevee)
You're right. The Republicans go rather farther than marches. We instead see them try and mar Royal visits, attack and kill British Police and Servicemen, plant bombs and so forth...

As do the loyalist.

[DontWantYourBloodMoney]

(Original post by johnnn)
If you think orange walks are mostly about hatred and bigotry then you have to take a look at yourself and wonder if its not you that is the one is a bigot. I've seen many orange walks go down very very smoothly and it is only silly young men wearing celtic tops claiming there irish catholics when they neither have been to ireland in there life or been to chapel in the past say 5 years.

I can only assume you don't live in Glasgow, considering the swathes of folk mulling around the streets with their Sevco strips on following the flutes.

[Steevee]

(Original post by TOSCS)
Loyalists also attack and kill British policemen and plant bombs. Your post just betrays an embarrassing lack of knowledge on the subject. Stick to simpler matters my man.

(Original post by Left Hand Drive)
As do the loyalist.

Not nearly so often.

[Left Hand Drive]

(Original post by Steevee)
Not nearly so often.

Oh well that makes it ok.

[Steevee]

(Original post by Left Hand Drive)
Oh well that makes it ok.

Of course it doesn't, but these constant digs at the Orange brigade ring a bit hollow when the republican lot are running all around, ruining celebrations and planting bombs. What both sides are doing are wrong, and both are as bad as each other.

[TOSCS]

(Original post by Steevee)
Not nearly so often.

Maybe because the British police and army are doing their terrorism for them

[Left Hand Drive]

(Original post by Steevee)
Of course it doesn't, but these constant digs at the Orange brigade ring a bit hollow when the republican lot are running all around, ruining celebrations and planting bombs. What both sides are doing are wrong, and both are as bad as each other.

I have no idea of the frequency of attacks by both sides. I have no real interest in Ireland and its troubles even as a Celtic fan. Im Scottish and thats it.

I hate when marching season comes around and I'm woken up by at 8am on my day by drums and drunk Northen Irish stumbling about screaming with their Rangers tops on.

[Rhadamanthus]

(Original post by TOSCS)
Maybe because the British police and army are doing their terrorism for them

It's literally not terrorism if the state do it. There's obviously some kind of leftist ethnic-nationalist trend behind your posts, given your signature and other postbits.

[1tartanarmy]

Orange walks have every right to exist. Violence is wrong and as long as no violence is committed by the members of the walk then I see no issue. The OP is wrong here. He clearly has some agenda behind posting that video. Where to be frank nothing really happened.

As for football then its a pretty big deal in regards to this issue in Scotland and both countries in Ireland.

What I don't understand is this... and I'm wondering if someone on here can enlighten me.

The normal Joe bloggs down the street usually say "Rangers and celtic" or "catholics and protestants" or whatever are as bad as each other. Well I'm sorry but how can a british citizen possibly regard people who support terrorist organisations whether it be financially or verbally in the same category as people who associate with the British cause in Northern Ireland. Yes the Loyalists have their vices but generally they are looking out for Britain and the Brits. Whereas Republicans have been responsible for countless British deaths. How can an average British and I musts stress British citizen possibly class them equally as bad?

I'm curious at what point did loyalists become disliked by their own countrymen?

[Left Hand Drive]

(Original post by 1tartanarmy)
Orange walks have every right to exist. Violence is wrong and as long as no violence is committed by the members of the walk then I see no issue. The OP is wrong here. He clearly has some agenda behind posting that video. Where to be frank nothing really happened.

As for football then its a pretty big deal in regards to this issue in Scotland and both countries in Ireland.

What I don't understand is this... and I'm wondering if someone on here can enlighten me.

The normal Joe bloggs down the street usually say "Rangers and celtic" or "catholics and protestants" or whatever are as bad as each other. Well I'm sorry but how can a british citizen possibly regard people who support terrorist organisations whether it be financially or verbally in the same category as people who associate with the British cause in Northern Ireland. Yes the Loyalists have their vices but generally they are looking out for Britain and the Brits. Whereas Republicans have been responsible for countless British deaths. How can an average British and I musts stress British citizen possibly class them equally as bad?

I'm curious at what point did loyalists become disliked by their own countrymen?

Well says you are Rangers fan. Maybe its all the in fighting between the groups? Maybe its the drug dealing? Maybe its because they have no right to do what they are, regardless of their aims and loyalties.

[L i b]

(Original post by TOSCS)
Maybe because the British police and army are doing their terrorism for them

And there's the sound of the barrel being scraped...