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Newcastle University or University of Sheffield

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    where can i have a look at the student intake of the universities? Especially law school intake of different universities?
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    look at http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/ and compare the law departments of different unis where you can properly look at percentages of those getting 2.1's/1sts etc, total number of undergrad law students of each law department and even the percentage of international students studying law. in this case, sheffield is an excellent place to study law. managing partner of clifford chance (david childs studied his LLB at sheffield), and there are plenty of others who have become partners/directors/QCs at major top MC/City firms such as at slaughter & may, herbert smith, nabarro etc etc.. - http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/law/alumni/profiles
    (i am biased as i will be applying to sheff but ofc newcastle and nearly every other RG uni is neither better or worser than each other)
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    And also which is more well-known and has greater reputation worldwide?
    How can someone seriously say with a straight face that Sheffield offers MUCH better employment prospects than Newcastle
    Lets see, The University Of Sheffield straight law LLB degree is recognized as a qualifying law degree by

    Singapore, India and has formal ties with the University of Hong Kong's law department, which I imagine would boost it's local rankings significantly.

    Newcastle however, is not recognized by the above countries.

    Assuming that the reputation of both unis in the UK are similar, I would have to say Sheffield clearly provides the edge here
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    (Original post by thelawstudent)
    look at http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/ and compare the law departments of different unis where you can properly look at percentages of those getting 2.1's/1sts etc, total number of undergrad law students of each law department and even the percentage of international students studying law. in this case, sheffield is an excellent place to study law. managing partner of clifford chance (david childs studied his LLB at sheffield), and there are plenty of others who have become partners/directors/QCs at major top MC/City firms such as at slaughter & may, herbert smith, nabarro etc etc.. - http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/law/alumni/profiles
    (i am biased as i will be applying to sheff but ofc newcastle and nearly every other RG uni is neither better or worser than each other)
    i second this. also, 3 out of 5 MC firms turned up to sheff's law fair last year (and i'm sure it is also a regular occurrence too) and also top MC firm Slaughter & May had even help fund the creation of a Slaughter & May Moot Court (and also helped fund the creation of an internet cafe too) at sheff law school for students; clearly an indication that sheff law school is and has been always regarded highly (judging from the link of sheff's law alumni) by law firms, regardless of the good ol' opinions from those on TSR :rolleyes:

    but reiterated again and again, i'm sure that every RG+Red Brick uni is NEITHER worse or better than each other! christ!
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    i also forgot to mention that the CEO of dla piper (which is the largest law firm (in terms of lawyers) in the world with origins in sheffield itself) also studied the LLB at sheff (nigel knowles), not that this is important just thought i should add this.

    EDIT: also looking through firms' websites, thelawyer2b magazine+website i don't come across much (if any) newcastle law affiliated persons/trainees/partners etc - though this may be different when working in a law firm on a vac scheme/actual training as the odd newcastle grad etc may pop up in person
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    This is only one firm but have a look at this for as close as I've heard of to a City BSB equivalent.

    If it is the case Sheff has nearly twice as many students, as has been said then, the 5 for Sheff and 2 for Newcastle suggests they are fairly equal.

    I've certainly never either noticed myself or heard anyone else remark on a university besides Oxbridge having a particularly high number of interviewees/vac schemers, though that's not to say it doesn't happen of course.
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    does it really matter if sheff law has more students (meaning that more people want to study at sheff)? even if that's the case, law firms still decide to recruit from sheff regardless of which law department is bigger. it might be the case that most law students at sheff decide not to embark on a career at the bar or at a major city law firm and most law students at newcastle or any other uni do
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    (Original post by thelawstudent)
    does it really matter if sheff law has more students (meaning that more people want to study at sheff)? even if that's the case, law firms still decide to recruit from sheff regardless of which law department is bigger. it might be the case that most law students at sheff decide not to embark on a career at the bar or at a major city law firm and most law students at newcastle or any other uni do
    You sound like an idiot. Did it not pass your mind that perhaps Newcastle just doesn't have the facilities to provide for such a large amount of students?
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    (Original post by admbeatmaker)
    You sound like an idiot.

    Did it not pass your mind that perhaps Newcastle just doesn't have the facilities to provide for such a large amount of students?
    wow,

    how am i to know that newcastle doesn't have which facilities and what not?
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    (Original post by thelawstudent)
    wow,

    how am i to know that newcastle doesn't have which facilities and what not?
    I think it's quite an easy and reasonable presumption to make in my opinion.
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    (Original post by admbeatmaker)
    I think it's quite an easy and reasonable presumption to make in my opinion.
    People are strange about their own institution aren't they?
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    (Original post by Norton1)
    People are strange about their own institution aren't they?
    Indeed. And I don't understand (being law students) how they're not able to look at such things objectively. Beats me.
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    (Original post by Cristocracy)
    Lets see, The University Of Sheffield straight law LLB degree is recognized as a qualifying law degree by

    Singapore, India and has formal ties with the University of Hong Kong's law department, which I imagine would boost it's local rankings significantly.

    Newcastle however, is not recognized by the above countries.

    Assuming that the reputation of both unis in the UK are similar, I would have to say Sheffield clearly provides the edge here
    You're yet to answer my earlier questions:

    - Which City firms' websites are you looking at which demonstrate that Sheffield grads "land more TCs" than Newcastle?

    - On what basis do you say that Sheffield offers much better employment prospects?
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    Which City firms' websites are you looking at which demonstrate that Sheffield grads "land more TCs" than Newcastle?
    I've looked at only a few, mainly the bigger ones. One widely circulated list is that of Hogan Lovell's, and a quick look through the partners' profiles at places such as Clifford Chance, DLA piper, Allen & Overy would show that Sheffield grads do reach the very top-CEO and partnerships.

    Perhaps you would like to show me where the alumni of Newcastle have gone to?

    Also, as someone above mentioned, also looking through firms' websites, thelawyer2b magazine+website i don't come across much (if any) newcastle law affiliated persons/trainees/partners etc

    Now, you've quoted me
    Lets see, The University Of Sheffield straight law LLB degree is recognized as a qualifying law degree by

    Singapore, India and has formal ties with the University of Hong Kong's law department, which I imagine would boost it's local rankings significantly.

    Newcastle however, is not recognized by the above countries.
    and you can still not grasp the significance of this?

    Since the OP originally wanted to know about the reputation of Sheffield on a global scale (Internationally)-which I have kindly bolded and quoted, and am doing so again-I've also looked through how countries view degrees from the respective universities.

    Seeing that Sheffield's LLB degree is recognized by Singapore (one of the countries where lawyers are the most highly paid), India and have formal ties with The University Of Hong Kong's law department, a degree from Sheffield would place you in good steed for employment.

    Since Newcastle's LLB is not even recognized, it's clear which degree is better here.
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    (Original post by Cristocracy)
    I've looked at only a few, mainly the bigger ones. One widely circulated list is that of Hogan Lovell's, and a quick look through the partners' profiles at places such as Clifford Chance, DLA piper, Allen & Overy would show that Sheffield grads do reach the very top-CEO and partnerships.

    Hold on, it was you that said "Also, a look around most city firms' websites would tell you Sheffield grads land more TCs than Newcastle grads". So, actually, you've only looked at a few and, even then, you can't point to anything which supports your statement can you? When you look at Hogan Lovells, 2 associates went to Sheffield and 3 went to Newcastle. At CC, there are 2 partners who went to Newcastle and 2 who went to Sheffield.

    As for the current managing partners at DLA and CC, that simply demonstrates that certain institutions were well regarded many many years ago (35 years ago for David Childs). It doesn't give you any indication that that is still the case or that "Sheffield grads land more TCs than Newcastle".


    Perhaps you would like to show me where the alumni of Newcastle have gone to?

    No, I'm asking you to provide the basis for your sweeping statement you earlier made. You're yet to do so. I should note that I graduated from Newcastle in the mid 90s.

    Also, as someone above mentioned, also looking through firms' websites, thelawyer2b magazine+website i don't come across much (if any) newcastle law affiliated persons/trainees/partners etc

    Now, you've quoted me

    and you can still not grasp the significance of this?

    Since the OP originally wanted to know about the reputation of Sheffield on a global scale (Internationally)-which I have kindly bolded and quoted, and am doing so again-I've also looked through how countries view degrees from the respective universities.

    Seeing that Sheffield's LLB degree is recognized by Singapore (one of the countries where lawyers are the most highly paid), India and have formal ties with The University Of Hong Kong's law department, a degree from Sheffield would place you in good steed for employment.

    Since Newcastle's LLB is not even recognized, it's clear which degree is better here.
    I hear what you say about the recognition of the degrees in Singapore and I agree that may say something about the university's recognition in that country. Where is the info for HK and India? Do you really think that the ability to become a locally qualified lawyer in Singapore is that much of a distinguishing factor?
    ....
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    @chalks

    As for the current managing partners at DLA and CC, that simply demonstrates that certain institutions were well regarded many many years ago (35 years ago for David Childs). It doesn't give you any indication that that is still the case or that "Sheffield grads land more TCs than Newcastle".

    yes it is still the case for sheffield that it is still highly regarded TODAY. on the lawyer2b magazine no one from this list ( http://l2b.thelawyer.com/section1.aspx?navCode=962 ) is from newcastle whereas 2-3 partners/solicitors are from sheffield (with 2-3 partners/solicitors from each other university on the list too - a balanced variety):
    - http://l2b.thelawyer.com/matthew-clark/1013256.article
    - http://l2b.thelawyer.com/james-szerdy/1010529.article

    not to mention that the front cover for the lawyer2b 2012 issue is a dla piper solictor from sheffield law school (Tasmia Alam), and as someone on here has mentioned already - 3 out of 5 MC firms turned up to sheff's law fair last year (and i'm sure it is also a regular occurrence too) and also top MC firm Slaughter & May had even help fund the creation of a Slaughter & May Moot Court (and also helped fund the creation of an internet cafe too) at sheff law school for students; clearly an indication that sheff law school is and has been always regarded highly (judging from the link of sheff's law alumni) by law firms - the slaughter and may funded moot court at sheffield law school was opened in 2009 http://www.law.dept.shef.ac.uk/news/?p=328 + http://www.shef.ac.uk/alumni/events/2.5818/moot_court. therefore evidently, top law firms still regard sheffield highly, not "many years ago" as you say.
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    http://graduates.hoganlovells.com/ap...campus_alumni/

    Newcastle: 2
    Sheffield: 5

    you can't point to anything which supports your statement can you?
    How much more specific do you want me to be? I've already listed the firms, and there are still more like Slaughter and May etc etc that I just did not bother to put down.

    As for the current managing partners at DLA and CC, that simply demonstrates that certain institutions were well regarded many many years ago (35 years ago for David Childs)
    Etay Katz - Partner, Allen & Overy LLP

    LLB Law (1997)

    Peter Mahy - Managing Partner, Howells Solicitors, 2010 Legal Aid Lawyer of the Year

    LLB Law (1993)

    Martin McKervey - Partner, Nabarro LLP

    LLB Law (1984)

    to take that long to make partner is by no means slow.

    And the way you are putting your point across makes it seem like you imply Sheffield is no longer held in high regard by firms. Where is your evidence to support this? A quick look at the law fair would show that the firms are still returning to Sheffield, so it's a reasonable assumption to make that the law school still enjoys the same reputation. In the same vein, it's not unreasonable to assume that the partners started off by securing a TC then working their way up.

    Where is the info for HK and India?
    http://www.barcouncilofindia.org/abo...ncil-of-india/

    http://www.shef.ac.uk/law/exchange/exchangepartners

    Do you really think that the ability to become a locally qualified lawyer in Singapore is that much of a distinguishing factor?
    Seeing how the OP specifically asked for international standing, in this case, yes, it makes all the difference.

    I am doubting your ability to read at this point. I've mentioned 2 times (3 now) that the OP is looking for international standing and the more countries your degree is recognized in, the better. Obviously it's the distinguishing factor
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    (Original post by thelawstudent)
    As for the current managing partners at DLA and CC, that simply demonstrates that certain institutions were well regarded many many years ago (35 years ago for David Childs). It doesn't give you any indication that that is still the case or that "Sheffield grads land more TCs than Newcastle".

    yes it is still the case for sheffield that it is still highly regarded TODAY. on the lawyer2b magazine no one from this list ( http://l2b.thelawyer.com/section1.aspx?navCode=962 ) is from newcastle whereas 2-3 partners/solicitors are from sheffield:
    - http://l2b.thelawyer.com/matthew-clark/1013256.article
    - http://l2b.thelawyer.com/james-szerdy/1010529.article

    not to mention that the front cover for the lawyer2b 2012 issue is a dla piper solictor from sheffield law school (Tasmia Alam), and as someone on here has mentioned already - 3 out of 5 MC firms turned up to sheff's law fair last year (and i'm sure it is also a regular occurrence too) and also top MC firm Slaughter & May had even help fund the creation of a Slaughter & May Moot Court (and also helped fund the creation of an internet cafe too) at sheff law school for students; clearly an indication that sheff law school is and has been always regarded highly (judging from the link of sheff's law alumni) by law firms - the slaughter and may moot court at sheffield law school was opened in 2009, not "many years ago" as you say.
    Let me just get this straight. An online magazine publishes some interviews with a dozen lawyers, two of whom went to Sheffield but none went to Newcastle, and you suggest that that is evidence that former offers better prospects than the latter? Really? The list also doesn't include any lawyers from Oxford, Durham or the well-known London institutions. Do you draw any conclusions from that?

    As for the law fairs, FF and A&O will be going to Newcastle this year. SandM are yet to confirm and Links have no details of which institutions they're visiting. I agree that the SandM moot court sounds excellent.
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    (Original post by chalks)
    Let me just get this straight. An online magazine publishes some interviews with a dozen lawyers, two of whom went to Sheffield but none went to Newcastle, and you suggest that that is evidence that former offers better prospects than the latter? Really? The list also doesn't include any lawyers from Oxford, Durham or the well-known London institutions. Do you draw any conclusions from that?

    As for the law fairs, FF and A&O will be going to Newcastle this year. SandM are yet to confirm and Links have no details of which institutions they're visiting. I agree that the SandM moot court sounds excellent.
    my point is that you can't say that sheffield's reputation has diminished because it hasn't
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    (Original post by Cristocracy)
    I've looked at only a few, mainly the bigger ones. One widely circulated list is that of Hogan Lovell's, and a quick look through the partners' profiles at places such as Clifford Chance, DLA piper, Allen & Overy would show that Sheffield grads do reach the very top-CEO and partnerships.

    Perhaps you would like to show me where the alumni of Newcastle have gone to?

    Also, as someone above mentioned, also looking through firms' websites, thelawyer2b magazine+website i don't come across much (if any) newcastle law affiliated persons/trainees/partners etc

    Now, you've quoted me

    and you can still not grasp the significance of this?

    Since the OP originally wanted to know about the reputation of Sheffield on a global scale (Internationally)-which I have kindly bolded and quoted, and am doing so again-I've also looked through how countries view degrees from the respective universities.

    Seeing that Sheffield's LLB degree is recognized by Singapore (one of the countries where lawyers are the most highly paid), India and have formal ties with The University Of Hong Kong's law department, a degree from Sheffield would place you in good steed for employment.

    Since Newcastle's LLB is not even recognized, it's clear which degree is better here.
    Let's be serious here. Once you've completed your TC and have a permanent position at a law firm, the university you attended doesn't count for jack.

    Your claim that Sheffield graduates are obviously better because they reach higher positions is bull.

    Also, who gives a shod that Singapore recognise their degree? I doubt there will be any significant portion of UK students at UK universities wanting to practise abroad let alone Singapore.

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