[Jelkin]

(Original post by FelineCostumier)
Repainting a whole house for marks caused by fair wear and tear is not acceptable. If there are areas that are particularly bad then whole walls and/or rooms are reasonable.

Carpet cleaning can also be reasonable but not replacing the carpet. Even if it was for replacing carpet there is a formula for working out the cost. 10% of the value of the item is reduced from the total value for each year old it is. So if it is 1 year old, 90% of the value as new can be deducted.

However, with all that said, if there was no inventory taken on move in she is in an incredibly weak position. In order to make deductions a landlord has to have proof of condition, both going in and going out, she doesn't.

Your deposited has to be protected in one of the three protection schemes, if you do not agree to deductions you can raise a dispute through whichever scheme it is protected by (which is free) and they will make a decision. This is the route I would personally go down as she has been very careless about protecting herself from damages.

In my previous life I was a residential lettings property manager, I know what I'm talking about

Great advice. Could I please PM you for advice about some issues I'm having with my current flat? It's hard to get information about such things

[FelineCostumier]

(Original post by Jelkin)
Great advice. Could I please PM you for advice about some issues I'm having with my current flat? It's hard to get information about such things

Sure.

[Stevo112]

This is why I always take pictures of properties I rent out (with dates on the pics) because the landlord doesn't screw you out of money.


I would possibly look into the Mr Woods person, as I find it interesting how he;

1. Seems to have more than 1 specialty (which may not be uncommon)

2. is receiving the majority of the money


If the landlord knows this Mr Woods (relation) then there is every chance that you could be screwed over twice; She may be charging you too much for the work and the actual charges might end up with the landlord anyway. This means she might well be profiting from your deposits, which I believe is illegal (don't quote me on it).


I would ask for the information regarding the company Mr Woods is linked to. If he isn't linked to a company, then I would try and get an estimate from a company who specialises in this sort of thing. If there is a major discrepancy then I would pursue it further.


Or this might be a non issue with you, if that is the case good luck and listen to what others have said!

[FelineCostumier]

(Original post by Stevo112)
This is why I always take pictures of properties I rent out (with dates on the pics) because the landlord doesn't screw you out of money.


I would possibly look into the Mr Woods person, as I find it interesting how he;

1. Seems to have more than 1 specialty (which may not be uncommon)

2. is receiving the majority of the money


If the landlord knows this Mr Woods (relation) then there is every chance that you could be screwed over twice; She may be charging you too much for the work and the actual charges might end up with the landlord anyway. This means she might well be profiting from your deposits, which I believe is illegal (don't quote me on it).


I would ask for the information regarding the company Mr Woods is linked to. If he isn't linked to a company, then I would try and get an estimate from a company who specialises in this sort of thing. If there is a major discrepancy then I would pursue it further.


Or this might be a non issue with you, if that is the case good luck and listen to what others have said!

Honestly, if the landlord doesn't bother to make a schedule of condition there is absolutely no reason for the tenant to. The tenant is in the strongest position. Inventories are primarily there to protect the landlord, as I've already said, burden of proof is on the landlord, it is up to them to prove the deductions they wish to ask for are reasonable and justified.

They should provide quotes, with a breakdown of costs. A handy man can turn his hand to just about everything and it's not illegal to have a family member or acquaintance do the work, or even do it yourself but the costs just have to be reasonable and accountable.

As a tenant with no inventory you hold all the cards and I wouldn't be paying any of the deductions personally.

[GPH92]

landlords/ladys are evil

[Sir Master of Bate]

Every landlord has a 'handyman' - generally these are friends who are in the trade. Most are complete bodge artists. It's even worse when these idiots are given keys and just walk in and out as they please.

Joys of shared house living though...and dodgy landlords.

I don't like living in shared houses, but I'm in/out of work too much to consider letting a place by myself.

[Stevo112]

(Original post by FelineCostumier)
Honestly, if the landlord doesn't bother to make a schedule of condition there is absolutely no reason for the tenant to. The tenant is in the strongest position. Inventories are primarily there to protect the landlord, as I've already said, burden of proof is on the landlord, it is up to them to prove the deductions they wish to ask for are reasonable and justified.

They should provide quotes, with a breakdown of costs. A handy man can turn his hand to just about everything and it's not illegal to have a family member or acquaintance do the work, or even do it yourself but the costs just have to be reasonable and accountable.

As a tenant with no inventory you hold all the cards and I wouldn't be paying any of the deductions personally.

I prefer to take pictures for peace of mind. Some landlords will try and bully you into paying over the odds for stuff which was already damaged. Letting them know you have pictures is usually enough to get them back down. I know they have to prove it, but my method resolves things quicker from my personal experience.


The point I brought up about the Mr Woods chap was clear. By using a family member to do the work, the landlord may be charging over the odds (because there might be cheaper alternatives) and she may also be profiting from the work.

If that is the case, then OP should certainly be worried about potentially being overcharged

[FelineCostumier]

(Original post by Stevo112)
I prefer to take pictures for peace of mind. Some landlords will try and bully you into paying over the odds for stuff which was already damaged. Letting them know you have pictures is usually enough to get them back down. I know they have to prove it, but my method resolves things quicker from my personal experience.


The point I brought up about the Mr Woods chap was clear. By using a family member to do the work, the landlord may be charging over the odds (because there might be cheaper alternatives) and she may also be profiting from the work.

If that is the case, then OP should certainly be worried about potentially being overcharged

Landlords can't bully you into overpaying for anything any more, deposit protection has put a stop to that, as long as tenants are aware that they can dispute any and all deductions and have them independently arbitrated.

So to that end, the point about using a family member et al to do the work is also moot, ask for a breakdown of costs, if you're not happy, go to dispute and have it resolved that way. Just as a side not, it is not unreasonable to include labour costs, even if you are doing it yourself, nobody has to give their time for free, so a labour rate to be included in quotes is fair.

I would agree taking pictures can be a good thing if you have been provided with an inventory which doesn't have pictures (professional inventories come with pictures) but any other time it is not in your interests.

I am speaking from years of experience as a property manager, who worked before, during and after the introduction of deposit protection schemes. I have dealt with probably hundreds of deposits and fair number of disputes and regularly use industry specific forums. I know what I'm talking about!

[Stevo112]

(Original post by FelineCostumier)
Landlords can't bully you into overpaying for anything any more, deposit protection has put a stop to that, as long as tenants are aware that they can dispute any and all deductions and have them independently arbitrated.

So to that end, the point about using a family member et al to do the work is also moot, ask for a breakdown of costs, if you're not happy, go to dispute and have it resolved that way. Just as a side not, it is not unreasonable to include labour costs, even if you are doing it yourself, nobody has to give their time for free, so a labour rate to be included in quotes is fair.

I would agree taking pictures can be a good thing if you have been provided with an inventory which doesn't have pictures (professional inventories come with pictures) but any other time it is not in your interests.

I am speaking from years of experience as a property manager, who worked before, during and after the introduction of deposit protection schemes. I have dealt with probably hundreds of deposits and fair number of disputes and regularly use industry specific forums. I know what I'm talking about!

tl;dr

i'm not going to debate with you. I TAKE PICTURES. I AM A NIKON PHONE.

I have made a point or 2 which you or op may regard or disregard at your leisure

[Tycho]

(Original post by Stevo112)
tl;dr

i'm not going to debate with you. I TAKE PICTURES. I AM A NIKON PHONE.

I have made a point or 2 which you or op may regard or disregard at your leisure

I don't think he is disputing that it's a good idea to take pictures. He's perhaps stating that in some cases it's an irrelevance where a professionally-created inventory is already in place. By all means take pictures until your heart's content!

[tsnake23]

(Original post by Favourite Worst Nightmare)
Apparently the level of repairs/cleaning that needs doing goes way above and beyond what she would class a normal wear and tear. We do admit the carpets got dirtier but she is acting like they were spotless to begin with. With the walls, there are a few scrapes and scuffs on the paintwork and she says we need to pay for the whole house to be completely re-painted. She was angry that there was some cutlery and cardboard boxes left and that the house wasn't as clean as it should be. I realise this was our fault but I was the first to leave the student house so had no control over that. Also there was cutlery and stuff left from the previous tenants when we arrived.

I think taking 177 pounds each from 4 tenants for minor things like this is over the top and quite unfair. She would be getting almost 800. What's more she did no inventory check with us at the beginning so we could agree on what condition everything was when we first arrived. She has sent pictures of what the house looks like now but she hasn't got any pictures from before we arrived. Do I have grounds to complain about this? I may speak with Citizens Advice Bureau as I feel like i am being a bit ripped off.

Any help would be much appreciated

Most of what has been said in this thread is correct, but the first question you should be answering before anything else is:

Has your deposit been protected in a deposit protection scheme, and have you been prescribed information about it?

Your landlord sounds a bit ignorant of tenancy laws based on the fact that they haven't done an inventory so I wouldn't be surprised if they haven't secured your deposit in a scheme. If it turns out they haven't then your in a very strong position and the landlord will need to give your full deposit back and you could even be eligible for compensation of 1-3x your deposit if a judge decides to punish the landlord. In order for this to happen you will need to write a 'Letter Before Action' to your landlord threatening small claims court action unless the deposit is refunded in full. You should look at information on LandlordZone if you want more detail about this.

If they have protected your deposit then you need to login to the relevant deposit protection scheme website and request your deposit online. If the amount your landlord wants to take off is different from the amount you want back then your case will be judged by an adjudicator, although it is likely it will be judged in your favour as the landlord will have no proof that the condition of the property has deteriorated more than general wear and tear allows. Again you will find guides about this on Landlord Zone or the deposit protection scheme website you are using.

[mikeyd85]

(Original post by FelineCostumier)
I know what I'm talking about!

I love threads like this. Someone has a problem and one user pops up and totally bosses it. Good work!

[Millie228]

I'm curious to see what happens here. I had the same problem with my landlady.

Although the deposit was 1600 and she demanded 800 of it from me. I had done nothing to the flat, but she claimed I had ruined the bed, which was in bad condition to begin with (I did nothing to it) along with a bunch of other stuff. The deposit is held by the Dispute Service, I opened a case with them in April. They keep telling me they are "working on it" but I honestly fear they are on the owner's side and will never get back to me. They've told me many times that I will "hear from them shortly".
Nobody went through the inventory with me so I haven't signed anything.
It's really frustrating. I've had so much of this in London - simply because I'm foreign and a young girl, people seem to think they can screw me over.

OP, did you reclaim the deposit? Who's holding it?

[mabrookes]

(Original post by FelineCostumier)
They should provide quotes, with a breakdown of costs. A handy man can turn his hand to just about everything and it's not illegal to have a family member or acquaintance do the work, or even do it yourself but the costs just have to be reasonable and accountable.

As a tenant with no inventory you hold all the cards and I wouldn't be paying any of the deductions personally.

They dont even have to do the work, as long as the money they demand is fair. So if you damaged a wall and they claimed the amount it would cost to repair they can not bother fixing the wall and spend the money on what they please.

[xander93]

(Original post by Favourite Worst Nightmare)
Apparently the level of repairs/cleaning that needs doing goes way above and beyond what she would class a normal wear and tear. We do admit the carpets got dirtier but she is acting like they were spotless to begin with. With the walls, there are a few scrapes and scuffs on the paintwork and she says we need to pay for the whole house to be completely re-painted. She was angry that there was some cutlery and cardboard boxes left and that the house wasn't as clean as it should be. I realise this was our fault but I was the first to leave the student house so had no control over that. Also there was cutlery and stuff left from the previous tenants when we arrived.

I think taking 177 pounds each from 4 tenants for minor things like this is over the top and quite unfair. She would be getting almost 800. What's more she did no inventory check with us at the beginning so we could agree on what condition everything was when we first arrived. She has sent pictures of what the house looks like now but she hasn't got any pictures from before we arrived. Do I have grounds to complain about this? I may speak with Citizens Advice Bureau as I feel like i am being a bit ripped off.

Any help would be much appreciated

It probably isn't fair treatment, but if you all signed a lease together then you all should bear equal responsibility for making sure the house was tidy when you left it, you can't just be a dick and leave it for others.

[deadleg21]

I was in a similar position once. the carpets had huge stains from when I had to look after someones dog for a while (I'm too nice :/) You can guess how they got there. Well my blue carpet ended up having huge purple marks over it. Couldn't afford to fix it but I could afford a great deal of food colouring. So just diluted the food colouring with water and put it into a spray bottle. Sprayed all the marks away, Worked perfectly!

[NuclearFusion]

As others have mentioned, the burden of proof lies with her, so she is the one who has to prove that you damaged her property.

[Kim-x]

She's having more than one part of the work done by the same guy, so I'm guessing this isn't the cheapest quote. For all you know, he could be paying her a bribe to give the work to him at inflated prices.

The charge for painting walls is ridiculous: My dad is renting at the moment and he'll repaint between tenants at his own expense. I thought it was the done thing for landlords.


This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App

[Architecture-er]

(Original post by Favourite Worst Nightmare)
Apparently the level of repairs/cleaning that needs doing goes way above and beyond what she would class a normal wear and tear. We do admit the carpets got dirtier but she is acting like they were spotless to begin with. With the walls, there are a few scrapes and scuffs on the paintwork and she says we need to pay for the whole house to be completely re-painted. She was angry that there was some cutlery and cardboard boxes left and that the house wasn't as clean as it should be. I realise this was our fault but I was the first to leave the student house so had no control over that. Also there was cutlery and stuff left from the previous tenants when we arrived.

I think taking 177 pounds each from 4 tenants for minor things like this is over the top and quite unfair. She would be getting almost 800. What's more she did no inventory check with us at the beginning so we could agree on what condition everything was when we first arrived. She has sent pictures of what the house looks like now but she hasn't got any pictures from before we arrived. Do I have grounds to complain about this? I may speak with Citizens Advice Bureau as I feel like i am being a bit ripped off.

Any help would be much appreciated

If she hasn't got photographic evidence of the condition of the house prior to you moving in, or evidence of reasonable condition (ie the house was renovated just before you moved in) then it's impossible for her to charge you money. Taking records of the prior condition is her responsibility.

At my architecture placement we've had to photograph an entire fricking tower block so that when the lease ends our clients know what state they have to leave the building in.

Just ignore her, maybe send her a polite email explaining that you caused no wear and tear, and she needs to have photographic records that show the house has deteriorated in quality if she is to get anywhere.

[mabrookes]

(Original post by Kim-x)
She's having more than one part of the work done by the same guy, so I'm guessing this isn't the cheapest quote. For all you know, he could be paying her a bribe to give the work to him at inflated prices.

The charge for painting walls is ridiculous: My dad is renting at the moment and he'll repaint between tenants at his own expense. I thought it was the done thing for landlords.


This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App

It doesn't have to be the cheapest - it can be the most expensive quote out there as long as it is a reasonable one.

A decent landlord freshens up the place between tenants and will paint over normal wear and tear, but if a student causes obvious damage to the paint work etc then it is only fair that student then pays the cost of what the landlord would normally pay for had it just been normal wear and tear.