A few questions about graduate entry veterinary medicine

Hi - I'm going to study a science foundation year (I study arts A Levels), to go on to study Zoology at either Liverpool, Manchester, Southampton, Leeds or the University of East Anglia (depending on which accepts me).

I know this sounds super pathetic and idealistic but my ideal goal would then be to go into graduate entry veterinary medicine. However:

Would I need the appropriate A Levels in science subjects?

I've heard a lot saying it's expensive with little government subsidy - does this mean it's literally impossible if you're not rich?

Does it matter where the University I get my Zoology degree from is ranked in the league tables? Like, is graduate entry Veterinary Medicine only for The Oxford-Cambridge-London Unis guys?

Thanks in advance!

Reply 1

rattielover

Original post by schizopear

in brief:

RVC, nottingham and cambridge charge £9,000 per year, the rest charge £20,000+ per year. you can get a maintenance loan but no tuition fee loan so, yes, it is expensive.

some/most of the universities may require you to have good science A-levels anyway (the full-fee ones might be more lenient) and a lot of graduates will resit A-levels to stay competitive. not having any science A-levels at all will probably be a significant disadvantage to you.

fees may increase again - when i went back to college to retake my A-levels with the aim of going back to uni, fees were only £3,000 per year and when i did my first degree they were only £1,000 per year!

cheaper/shorter option would be to do some science A-levels and apply as an undergraduate.

do a search of the vet forum for more info on graduate entry - there's lots of threads/posts out there!

Thank you so much for your response! So if I don't have that kind of money, I may as well just give up? (I don't have that kind of money by the way. :smile:

)

Wouldn't just going back and re-doing all my A Levels reflect badly on me (along with the fact my GCSEs aren't exactly stellar - I'd be crushed by the first-time Grade A A-Levels with 15 A*'s at GCSE candidates)?

Reply 2

rattielover

Original post by schizopear

not give up - just think carefully about going the graduate route!

how much work experience have you done so far? what grades/subjects did you have the first time? there are other people on here who have taken science A-levels straight after finishing other A-level subjects and been given offers.

i don't think it will reflect badly on you if you can achieve good grades, backed up with a strong personal statement and lots of relevant work experience. lots of people don't make the right decisions first time round - that's how i ended up with a psychology degree :wink:

I'm glad I found TSR at the very least, or else I would have ploughed straight on with a Zoology degree.

The grades in the subjects I've done so far (just got my AS results - this is really embarrassing because they're not great... But I know I can do better, I just need to put in much more effort), English Lit - B, Politics - B, Biology - U (I got 1 mark off an A in my first unit and then I got discouraged and it when downhill), Law - D (undergoing resits, got As in all the mocks). My GCSEs are also not at all great. A*AABBCCC. However, during GCSEs I was struggling with depression, anxiety, an eating disorder and a learning disorder that was only recently diagnosed, but has been affecting my education, so I don't know if that will 'overwrite' them? My psychiatrist is willing to back up that I've had all these issues.

The work experience I have so far... I don't know how much of this is relevant, sorry if it's not :smile:

A week shadowing a vet (with another week lined up soon), every weekend I volunteer with ex-racing greyhounds at a sanctuary (I've done so for 2 years), two weeks helping out at a ferret rescue center, every Wednesday afternoon I help at a cat sanctuary (for the past year), I'm a member of 3 rat societies and go to rat shows every month.

Reply 3

tigercallie

Just in addition - to be honest, I would advise anyone to avoid the graduate entry route AT ALL COSTS. Its ridiculously expensive, and considering you need the same A levels as a school leaver it makes SOOOOO much more sense to go and work harder at A levels, get a few years work experience, than waste it, spending money, getting into a degree, which, ultimately, is worth very little when you come to apply for vet. I WISH i had known this when i started my degree.

On your work experience - what you've got is great so far :-) You still need to do quite a bit more, but it looks like you're well covered in the small animals department. I would suggest doing 2+ weeks with a large animal vet, work on a dairy farm, a pig farm, poultry, go lambing, zoo, slaughter house, anything really...oh and horses! Try to cover all the bases, and have a minimum of 6 weeks behind you before applying. Given your circumsances, i think the best route would be to not go to university just yet. Go and sort out your A levels and work on some kickass work experience and you could apply next year with a good chance of getting in. You'd actually be out faster than if you did a degree first!!

Reply 4

rattielover

Original post by tigercallie

Thanks for your response, you guys have been really helpful! If I decide I want to be a vet - all that work experience I have isn't to be a vet, I just really, really love animals but always thought "I'm not good enough to be a vet" and never considered it, now I am - I'm definitely re-doing my A Levels (I'll do them in Chemistry Biology Physics Maths probably). In your opinion though, should I also re-do my GCSEs? :smile:

(posted results in last post)

Reply 5

tigercallie

Original post by rattielover

(posted results in last post)

I would check each unis website for what they want from GCSE, email them if you want, theyre usually really helpful - but basically, just do what you're told on their websites! :-D goodluck! I imagine an A in A level chem would cancel out a B in GCSE as an example, but, best to check!

Reply 6

Tarnia

I did the graduate entry route, but I'm North American-so I'm not much help for GSCEs or A levels as we have a different evaluation system.

Does the zoology have any value to you in itself? From talking to peers that have done zoology, it isn't an easy field to find employment in, but I could be wrong there. It COULD set you up well for at least some of the preclinical vet med work (first year of GEP) with the anatomy and physiology. But, is that enough for you? I am not sure about here, but at my previous school it was also a HARD program...so if doing it to boost your marks, are you sure it WILL boost your marks? (I presume the grades you got in your previous degree are examined as part of the GEP entry-they were for me).

I don't regret doing a previous degree, even though my education system is different-I gained a lot from it and having my BSc and then an MSc has opened doors for me that I wouldn't have had and has given me a different set of skills. It also gives me a fallback (in theory) if for some reason vet med ever didn't work out. But, that's me. Once I knew I wanted to study abroad, I was looking at high fees regardless so...that wasn't as much a factor in choosing between programs/schools. I know UK-national GEPs that make the fees work and aren't independently rich, but it has been a stress for them-going out asking for loans, working, sometimes if you have a relationship with a vet clinic (or even if you don't) they will 'sponsor' you in return for your working for them at reduced pay when you graduate (often emerg/night cover I think).

Regardless, I do agree you need a bit more work experience, though your small animal side sounds great, and the ferrets is an added bonus (many applicants won't have 'exotics' experience). Lambing and dairy definitely, pigs and/or poultry if you can. Lambing is generally in the spring (can start late winter) and some farmers will provide accommodation, so if there isn't a farm near you that might be a way to make it work. Experience with a large animal vet, in addition to farm experience, would also help I think. So basically not much that hasn't already been said. :smile:

Good luck to you!

Reply 7

Judas the Prude

Re GCSEs, due to extenuating circumstances I also ended up with grades that did not meet entry requirements (they were slightly worse than yours) and ended up with 3 offers, so it does seem to be the case that unis may be willing to overlook an underperformance at GCSE if you have legitimate reasons for your lower grades, and make up for it in other areas of your application. Before I applied I emailed my chosen unis with details of my situation and grades and none of them suggested that I re-sit any GCSEs, but said that they would consider my application (given that I had already met the A level requirements) as long as I provided details of my extenuating circumstances with my application, though they did stress that there would be no guarantees given the very high standard of other applicants.

Obviously no one can say for certain if this will be the case for you, but I would recommend emailing any unis you are interested in with details of your situation to ask if they would consider you with those GCSE grades (assuming that you will meet all other entry requirements), and in the meantime focus 100% on getting those A grades at A level and building on your work experience!

(edited 11 years ago)

Reply 8

emmattmagic

hello, i currently have a place to study physiotherapy but i have had a change in heart to study veterinary medicine. i will only have had 7 weeks work experience by october which is when i would have to apply. I only have Biology A2 to a B grade and dont have chemistry. I would be prepared to spend this year studying in chemistry and retaking biology. However, graduate entry seems like the best option as I doubt i would get in if i applied in October. what are your thoughts?

Reply 9

Tarnia

-Are you prepared for the extra fees as listed above?

-The expectation for work experience tends to be 10 to 15 weeks for a 'school leaver' applicant, and more for graduate entry (because in theory you have had more time to gain it). I would say look at having 20+ weeks. Are you prepared to get another 13 weeks while doing another degree? I think it is minimum 4 weeks in vet practice (for Liverpool, which most applicants try for that), and otherwise split across lambing, dairy, kennels, equine yards, pig/poultry farms, etc.

-It is still pretty competitive

-As you said, what about taking a gap year and resitting your A levels/doing chemistry?

Reply 10

oj123

I have just finished my first year at vet school and have done a second degree. My GCSE's were ok but A-level were a disaster. I did Animal Science and then applied to vet school thinking I would be able to get sponsorship. Through this route I had 2 offers at 2 vet schools, but getting sponsorship is very hard and I only managed to raise a small percentage of what I needed, so I would really avoid this.

If I could turn back time I would re do my A-levels or apply to something like year zero ( Liverpool) and Gateway programme ( RVC) I am sure the others would do something similar. There are a number on my course that have done different a-levels and have got in through this route.

If you re take A-levels they will want to see what else you have done in that year ( i.e work experience- farm, vets, lab, zoo, kennels anything you can get). A number of people who re sat on my course did months of work experience at a number of establishments.

Any questions about vet school graduate entry really happy to help where I can :-)

I hope this helps. :-)

Reply 11

emmattmagic

That is definitely an option (taking another gap year) but i will only have had about 8 weeks for when i applied. would this put me at a disadvantage? the graduate route is out of the question for me, as of costs etc, will the unis look upon me less for not having the chem alevel and bio at an a. am i fighting a loosing battle so to speak against other applicants?
i have only found one uni (nott) which i could apply to for the gateway year 0 course. :smile:

thanks for your help

Reply 12

Tarnia

Sounds like a Gateway course or similar may be best for you. Do you qualify for the prerequisites for Gateway? And/or taking another gap year.

Yes, only 8 weeks work experience would be a disadvantage for most of the uni's. Cambridge requires the least work experience but requires very high academics, including bio and chemistry A levels. Especially if you are saying you already took a gap year this year? (You mention "ANOTHER gap year" being possible.) If that is the case, I think the expectation for someone having taken a gap year for work experience is 15 to 20 weeks +. 15 weeks might even be low, since many will have this WITHOUT having taken an "extra year" (the gap year).

With respect, it doesn't sound like you have had/spent a lot of time researching or learning about the different schools and career paths. That isn't meant to be a criticism, I understand that this is a new decision for you. I mention this since you thought graduate entry was best, but clearly weren't aware of the costs, though they were mentioned earlier in this very thread. You also don't seem that familiar with the general prerequisites of the program. Vet is a hard program, it is best if you do as much research/get as much experience as you can so you know it is for you. I would suggest taking a look through some of the 'stickied' threads at the top of this forum, and/or doing a search and reading some of the previous threads. If you want to see what other people are applying with, there is a stickied thread for people to post that as well. Also, go on the websites and/or contact the admissions teams of the different vet colleges-many readily can provide you with the information you're looking for, either right on their website or if you contact admissions. Go straight to the horse's mouth, so to speak. :smile:

For example, for the Dick Vet, which is the one I am most familiar with (where I went), you can find the academic requirements for school leavers right here: http://www.ed.ac.uk/schools-departments/vet/studying/uk-eu-school-leavers/entry-requirements. Or for grads here: http://www.ed.ac.uk/schools-departments/vet/studying/uk-eu-graduates/entry-requirements.

People on here are willing to help, but I personally think information and/or opinions from peers should be balanced with information for the university and admissions teams themselves. Plus, I personally find it easier to answer people's posts on here if they have already done some research and are familiar with the program.

Of the 8 weeks experience you have, what is the breakdown? Have you been able to get much time in actual vet clinics yet? Large and small vets? What about "in the field" placements eg cattle farm, horse stables, kennels...Again, this is a critical and invaluable part to deciding if vet really is the career for you.

Speaking of which, what is it that makes you think vet may be the career for you? Why do you want to do it? Are you aware of the perceived cons (long hours for lower pay than other professions, eg low to mid 20K for a new grad) as well as the pros?

Good luck!

Reply 13

Rrrrrcherry

Hello, I was wondering if you could help me. I have always wanted to do vetsci but was put off by my school telling me I couldn't acheive the results. As a result I dropped chemistry at AS level (grade D- didnt work a hard as I could as I'd given up) and then went on to a* in art, a in geography and a B in biology at a level. I then went on to study zoology and really am still keen to carry on to study vet sci. Because of my a levels I think graduate entry is the only way forward for me. My work experience is great and has been consistent and varied for the last 5 years throughout a levels and my degree. I am just worried about the fees and how I could manage to pay for It and I know you said you would go back if you could but I'm in a very similar boat to you and would appreciate any advice. Thanks :smile:

Reply 14

Tarnia

What exactly are you asking rrrcherry? is it for advise affording the fees? You may be better off starting your own thread as this one is rather old and might be overlooked. :smile:

There are many other threads about cost of graduate entry on here-take a read through. Basically, if you cannot afford 9,000-~30,000GBP per year INDEPENDENTLY for tuition alone, not including cost of living, equipment, etc., you cannot afford the graduate entry program. There is very minimal loans/support available. Now if you think you can do the degree while holding down a job that would pay such that you could do it, or you do have the money, or whatever, then congratulations, and I wish you all the best! I am just trying to be realistic and honest.

Also, many schools will still at least glance at your A-levels, so they may still be taken under consideration.

What about redoing your A levels? And maybe getting a tutor? Have you COMPLETED your zoology degree as yet? Also, what was difficult about your A levels for science that is NOT difficult for science in zoology? Why do you think you are doing so much better now? Vet is an intensive degree so normally I would say if someone cannot handle the A-level material, then vet may not be the best choice. However zoology as well is a tough degree.

For work experience, make sure you have a variety of both vet (large AND small if possible) and husbandry (farms, kennels, etc.) experience across a variety of species. For a graduate applicant you want 20-30+ weeks I believe.

Good luck whatever you decide!