Don't talk about gun control, blame Hollywood!

There is so much rubbish appearing in order to get the conversation away from gun control. Even though the arguments presented have been consistently rebutted, these pro gun nuts think that just disagreeing is enough, and there's no importance in a legitimate argument, as long as they inject misinformation and stupidity in to the conversation they have succeeded in filibustering the "debate".

It happens every time we have one of these massacres, first we have:

"Don't politicize it"

But not talking about it IS politicizing it as it is keeping everything exactly the way it is, which only benefits one side.

Then we have the obligatory absurd analogies:

"Cars kill people too, should we ban cars?"

"There was a school stabbing the same day"

Where nobody was killed.

The straw man arguments:

"Gun violence doesn't stop all crime"

No one ever claimed it did, however there are indisputably many examples of countries with strict gun controls that have monumentally less shootings. That is all the evidence needed to demonstrate the undeniable correlation that could help stop these situations from happening in the future.

Then finally we have:

"If they didn't have guns, they would find another way"

So we should make it easy for them? Why not make bombs legally available under that logic? Everyone agrees on gun control, because even the most pro gun nuts agree rocket launchers shouldn't be legally available, the debate is around where the restrictions and lines should be drawn. These absurd, easily rebutted arguments that have no other reason other than being a rudimentary distraction should be retired if you want to be taken seriously.

What has also annoyed me is neo cons coming out in favour of gun control AFTER this event, you know it shouldn't take something as horrific as this happening in order for you to see sense, and you shouldn't be congratulate upon doing so. I'm not impressed, I'm mean how low do these mass murders have to go before the rest see sense? The first school shooting should have been enough for you to favour sensible gun control laws and if it wasn't I seriously question your sense of morals.

Finally we had the good old "this happens because our kids are playing video games and are being brainwashed by hollywood" argument.
From people who are more concerned with censorship of art than weapons.

(edited 11 years ago)

Reply 1

Adileh

Well they have a point. Hollywood does promote extreme violence.

These school shootings are a recent phenomonen in america even though people have owned guns for centuries.

Obviously, something has gone wrong in American society. Disgusting Hollywood violence is partly to blame. Also, all of these mass shooters are on some sort of behavioural medication or anti depressants.

This is a complex issue. I am appalled by the opportunism displayed by anti gun lobbies.

Reply 2

SpicyStrawberry

18

The people who use the violent movie/video game argument are idiots to be honest. Free will exists, as does a knowledge of the difference between reality and fiction. Anyone who doesn't understand the fundamental differences shouldn't be watching it if they cannot grasp that concept.

Reply 3

Somali-Pir8

9

You forgot the argument
"if only the school wasn't a no gun zone, then the teachers could have defended the kids"
americans confuse me

Reply 4

hamijack

15

To be fair, loads of people watch Hollywood movies and don't go and shoot up cinemas and primary schools. The fault here is America's absolutely substandard healthcare, especially in mental health. The only way Hollywood and violent videogames influence these sort of crimes is by acting as a catalyst for someone with a pre-existing condition.

Reply 5

Slothsftws

OP

Original post by Adileh

Well they have a point. Hollywood does promote extreme violence.

These school shootings are a recent phenomonen in america even though people have owned guns for centuries.

Obviously, something has gone wrong in American society. Disgusting Hollywood violence is partly to blame. Also, all of these mass shooters are on some sort of behavioural medication or anti depressants.

This is a complex issue. I am appalled by the opportunism displayed by anti gun lobbies.

That argument might stand if the rest of the world didn't consume much of the same media. You think censoring action movies and leaving access to gun will solve this? How delusional can you be? So are you in favour of censoring adult entertainment? So you have no regard for the first amendment?

You call the depicted violence disgusting and say it promotes it, but it doesn't. Hollywood isn't one singular entity, it is thousands of minds a lot of which come from a liberal non violence moral stand point, like avatar etc, lots of Hollywood films have a non violent moral lesson. But there is nothing disgusting in enjoying a gory horror or action film, because it is fiction.

Disgusting violence? Are you aware of Japanese cinema? Of how violent their action and horror movies are? They had no more than 20 gun deaths, the US? around 10,000.
Partly to blame? No, a person is responsible for there own actions. That movie or video game didn't make you do anything.

You're appalled by people from trying to prevent this from happening? That appals you more than people whose reaction to 20 kids getting shot is to make sure this happens again? To make sure legal easy access to this weaponry will inevitably occur again next year and the year after?

Reply 6

Slothsftws

OP

Original post by hamijack

To be fair, loads of people watch Hollywood movies and don't go and shoot up cinemas and primary schools. The fault here is America's absolutely substandard healthcare, especially in mental health. The only way Hollywood and violent videogames influence these sort of crimes is by acting as a catalyst for someone with a pre-existing condition.

It has not yet been confirmed whether Adam Lanza had been diagnosed with mental illness. So I see that as just another attempt to get away from the gun control debate. I mean there are people with mental health issues everywhere else, but yet much less mass shootings, there's not some kind of mass shooting syndrome exclusive to America, its absolute rubbish.

Reply 7

User1014865

17

Virtually every single piece of equipment can allow me to kill others, pretty easily. So what's stopping me from doing it?

Hollywood movies are made to entertain. It's not Hollywood's fault that a tiny sum of insufficiently sound people decide to emulate what's ultimately fictional.

The legalisation of guns makes guns easily accessible. So if a mentally unstable person has the desire to kill a bunch of people, they can quite easily do so.

Gun control is mandatory.

Reply 8

username1002982

14

But other countries with similar levels of gun ownership still get Hollywood movies, but they don't have as many homicides. This argument didn't really work

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 9

username1084946

14

Is adult entertainment killing our children? Or is killing our children entertaining our adults?

Reply 10

Slothsftws

OP

Original post by kk_15

Is adult entertainment killing our children? Or is killing our children entertaining our adults?

Well where is the argument that adult entertainment is responsible for mass murders? And by argument I mean a logically thought reason behind your thoughts.

That stance is pretty easily refuted by the millions who watch violent shows and don't kill. Why are they immune?

Reply 11

Coffinman

8

Why shouldn't we be looking at everything else instead of what the gun control agenda wants.

In China there have been a few mass stabbings where children have died( doesn't china already have knife licences?) and we didn't get 24hr grief mongering and calls to ban chefs knives.

Reply 12

username1084946

14

I'm sick of people who always try to blame movies, bands, songs, or talk shows for whatever – teen suicides, drug overdoses or everything else. If someone is stupid enough to kill others or themselves because of this then that's exactly what they deserve – they weren't contributing anything to the society – it's one less idiot in the world. There's too many people – if more people kill themselves, it wouldn't disappoint me. What would disappoint me is that people are that stupid.

Reply 13

Slothsftws

OP

Original post by Coffinman

Why shouldn't we be looking at everything else instead of what the gun control agenda wants.

In China there have been a few mass stabbings where children have died( doesn't china already have knife licences?) and we didn't get 24hr grief mongering and calls to ban chefs knives.

Because it doesn't hold up, it is called grasping at straws.

Because guns and knives aren't the same. If you don't know the difference between a knife and a semi automatic weapon then you are severely lacking in the common sense department. Or perhaps you are doing exactly what I outlined in my OP, filibustering and I'm not buying it.

(edited 11 years ago)

Reply 14

ESPORTIVA

2

Blame the news stations which devote more air time for the killers instead of the victims. Essentially turning the shooter into an international superstar (you cant buy this kind of publicity)

Reply 15

Adileh

Original post by Slothsftws

That argument might stand if the rest of the world didn't consume much of the same media. You think censoring action movies and leaving access to gun will solve this? How delusional can you be? So are you in favour of censoring adult entertainment? So you have no regard for the first amendment?

You call the depicted violence disgusting and say it promotes it, but it doesn't. Hollywood isn't one singular entity, it is thousands of minds a lot of which come from a liberal non violence moral stand point, like avatar etc, lots of Hollywood films have a non violent moral lesson. But there is nothing disgusting in enjoying a gory horror or action film, because it is fiction.

Disgusting violence? Are you aware of Japanese cinema? Of how violent their action and horror movies are? They had no more than 20 gun deaths, the US? around 10,000.
Partly to blame? No, a person is responsible for there own actions. That movie or video game didn't make you do anything.

You're appalled by people from trying to prevent this from happening? That appals you more than people whose reaction to 20 kids getting shot is to make sure this happens again? To make sure legal easy access to this weaponry will inevitably occur again next year and the year after?

Well. I do not Agree with censorship. I do have regard for first admendment.

I just point out Hollywood does produce disgustingly violent films all the time.

I am not blaming this only. It's just that Americans have owned guns for centuries and school shootings are relatively recent and So obviously Something is wrong with modern American culture. Is it Hollywood? Is it illegal drugs? Is it legal behavioural drugs?

This issue is very complex issue. That's all I Am trying to suggest.

Reply 16

hamijack

15

Original post by Slothsftws

It has not yet been confirmed whether Adam Lanza had been diagnosed with mental illness. So I see that as just another attempt to get away from the gun control debate. I mean there are people with mental health issues everywhere else, but yet much less mass shootings, there's not some kind of mass shooting syndrome exclusive to America, its absolute rubbish.

I'm not saying that gun control isn't part of the problem, but imo a mentally healthy person just doesn't walk into a school and slaughter a bunch of 6 year olds.

Reply 17

username1084946

14

Original post by hamijack

I'm not saying that gun control isn't part of the problem, but imo a mentally healthy person just doesn't walk into a school and slaughter a bunch of 6 year olds.

Tell me, what qualifies as "mentally healthy"? It's like asking what is normal? Just because the majority of people would'nt do something like this everyday doesn't make them abnormal.
People get bullied for being "weird" when in reality they may just no be into the same music or wear the latest clothes. Get real.

Reply 18

Slothsftws

OP

Original post by Adileh

Well. I do not Agree with censorship. I do have regard for first admendment.

I just point out Hollywood does produce disgustingly violent films all the time.

I am not blaming this only. It's just that Americans have owned guns for centuries and school shootings are relatively recent and So obviously Something is wrong with modern American culture. Is it Hollywood? Is it illegal drugs? Is it legal behavioural drugs?

This issue is very complex issue. That's all I Am trying to suggest.

But your suggestion that it is hollywood is nonsensical as here in the UK we consume much of the same media.

They produce disgustingly violent films all the time? Well that's just your personal taste if you find them disgusting, they also produce family friendly kids movies and romantic comedies all the time. So what? Learn to separate reality from fiction. Especially when you'll struggle to find fiction that glorifies this behaviour, we need to talk about kevin was about understanding and relaying the depression and impact of these actions, name one movie that promotes killing innocents.